Leica to FSU instead?

farlymac

farlymac

PF McFarland
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I read a lot about folks getting their FSU lenses shimmed for Leica use, but does anyone ever put Leica lenses on an FSU camera?

PF
 
No, and I think I only started using the J-8 on the M2 because I was told I shouldn't and wondered why...

But I've often thought that, if the bug is going to bite it would be sensible to start with a Leica lens on an ex-USSR body because bodies are cheap even allowing for Oleg's magic touch. Then you'd have the best lens on the best value body (especially a FED 2) for ordinary everyday use. Also you'd have more time to seek out the correct body (year etc) for the Leitz lens.

Regards, David
 
Brian, I knew I had read something about the cam followers, but couldn't recall it at the moment I started the thread. Other than that, and the shimming, anything else one would have to look out for?

PF
 
It once was suggested that the cam shaped rangefinder arm of the FSU rangefinder can be adjusted to give both correct readings at infinity and close focus for either 50 or 52. Never tried this before, but if its possible it would make the shimming unnecessary. But exchanging lenses would require readjustment over and over again.
 
Nobody at RFF would doubt Brian Sweeney knows lenses. However, in the early days of RFF, I remember reading about a lot of people using Leica or other lenses with their FSU bodies. So there must be some, or there were an awfully lot of lucky RFF users.

The lenses that can be successfully switched may be small. I don't personally know since I don't use Leica or Leica clones. My only two FSU cameras are a Kiev kit and a Moskva.
 
The Nikkor 5cm F2 works well with my Zorki 3M, and I adjusted the RF of the camera for the lens. The Nikkor 5cm f2 has a thick Cam and the RF follower of the Zorki works well with it. The RF follower of the same camera fouls up with the Nikkor 5cm f1.4, it has a thinner cam.
 
I have been using combination of Fed2 and Summar for many years. No problems. Actually i miss that pocketable combination sometimes.
 
Some lenses with cut out slots like the Summaron 35mm 3.5 lose rangefinder coupling. The flange threading doesn't place the cutout slot at the arm. I guess this wasn't a concern as FSU lenses didn't have cutouts. :)
 
I have used Canon LTM lenses on FSU cameras in the 1990s, the 35mm F1.5 lens on a Zorki 4 and the Canon 25mm f3.5 lens on a Fed 5c body.
 
Cam follower

Cam follower

Brian Sweeney said:
More problems than just reducing the shim.

http://rangefinderforum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=107438

The shape of the cam-follower of the FSU camera can foul-up on the thinner RF cams of several of the lenses made for Leica. The Summarit is an example of a lens that the finger-style pickup of the FSU camera slides under the RF Cam of the lens.
Click to expand...

Not only can you end up with faulty coupling, but worse, you can find yourself with an unremovable lens. The Hektor (and I think Elmar) 135mm lenses have only a small area of RF coupling around their circumference which can cause big problems with an FSU camera. You can generally screw the lens in without problems, but when you attempt to unscrew it, there is an excellent chance of jamming against the RF coupling cam. If the camera in question has a removable back, you can use a cable release to lock the shutter open in the Bulb position, reach in with a finger and pull the cam back out of the way. If you have a bottom-loading camera with a triangular cam however, you are liable to end up with a really serious problem!
:bang: :bang: :bang: :bang: :bang: :bang: :bang: :bang: :bang: :bang: :bang: :bang: :bang: :bang:

So, you may or may not have this problem, but my advice is to never use a Leica 135mm lens on any camera that does not have a roller follower for its rangefinder.

Cheers,
Dez
 
Can you change the focus to clear the jam? At least on a FED 2 with the Canon 135mm, I think focusing as near as possible clears the jam.
 
Brian Legge said:
Can you change the focus to clear the jam? At least on a FED 2 with the Canon 135mm, I think focusing as near as possible clears the jam.
Click to expand...

I suspect it will vary with the particular camera. I can recall at least one occasion where it didn't do the job. That was with a hektor. I have not tried this with the Canon 135; maybe it has a more forgiving profile.

Cheers,
Dez
 
Especially when I am doing a CLA on a FSU I use my trusty Summaron 2.8 35mm LTM. Always provides sharp pictures - works on FSU and Leitz camera's: shot with a Z4 from a fellow member

Kopie%20van%20D1_test%2024%20Zorki4-2.jpg
 
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Ron's picture illustrates a common problem with the FSU cameras. I had a FED 2 with a shutter that tapered - most noticable at the fastest speeds. The left side of the frame was overexposed or correctly exposed, and the right had side was underexposed as the second curtain caught up to the first one. It took me a long time to finally get the shutter travel even. By then, I had gotten so frustrated that I sold it to FEDKA. He was surprised that I wanted to sell such a well adjusted FED-2, but by then I'd had it! The design of the FED-2 shutter tensioning spools allowed only 1/2 turn adjustments, which I found too crude.

Leicas are also susceptible to this disease. I have a IIF with Don Goldberg now for this problem at 1/1000.
 
Robert Lai said:
Ron's picture illustrates a common problem with the FSU cameras. I had a FED 2 with a shutter that tapered - most noticable at the fastest speeds. The left side of the frame was overexposed or correctly exposed, and the right had side was underexposed as the second curtain caught up to the first one. It took me a long time to finally get the shutter travel even. By then, I had gotten so frustrated that I sold it to FEDKA. He was surprised that I wanted to sell such a well adjusted FED-2, but by then I'd had it! The design of the FED-2 shutter tensioning spools allowed only 1/2 turn adjustments, which I found too crude.

Leicas are also susceptible to this disease. I have a IIF with Don Goldberg now for this problem at 1/1000.
Click to expand...

What I found out with that Z4 was indeed that - as will be many times the case with old Zorki's, Feds and of course the older Leica's - that the shuttersprings are tensioned much too tight (in this case the second curtain was tensioned too tight). However it could be adjusted to normal specs. I never heard about restrictions of 1/2 turn adjustments on a Fed 2, I always read that they had the same shutter installed as the Zorki's. Problem is that if these springs are tightened to much and the camera lays many years around, the springs won't provide enough tension anymore to get correct shutterspeeds.
If this is the case with the first curtain spring, your camera will suffer at the high speeds, so 1/1000 will not open correctly, and the second curtain will catch up to fast. Your Leica might therefore need a new first curtain springroller ($$$).
 
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Robert Lai said:
Ron's picture illustrates a common problem with the FSU cameras. I had a FED 2 with a shutter that tapered - most noticable at the fastest speeds. The left side of the frame was overexposed or correctly exposed, and the right had side was underexposed as the second curtain caught up to the first one. It took me a long time to finally get the shutter travel even. By then, I had gotten so frustrated that I sold it to FEDKA. He was surprised that I wanted to sell such a well adjusted FED-2, but by then I'd had it! The design of the FED-2 shutter tensioning spools allowed only 1/2 turn adjustments, which I found too crude.

Leicas are also susceptible to this disease. I have a IIF with Don Goldberg now for this problem at 1/1000.
Click to expand...
I'm not quite sure how you see that "problem" in the picture, the content is in shade on the right and hence will be darker anyway. I see nothing wrong with it.

If the shutter is running properly, correctly CLAd, the "tapering" is a non-issue in my experience. It was good enough for Leica, I doubt they'd have suffered an inherent fault. I have 20+ cameras with this type of shutter, FSU and others and none of them has the problem.
 
wolves3012 said:
I'm not quite sure how you see that "problem" in the picture, the content is in shade on the right and hence will be darker anyway. I see nothing wrong with it.
Click to expand...

I agree, that picture was made in a shady corner and doesn't present a problem like the one we discussed; the picture was taken after the CLA if I remember correct.

this one was made before CLA and proper shutter tensioning and demonstrates the problem discussed:

test%2004%20Zorki4.jpg
 
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