List of Sonnar Lenses

Hacker said:
Anyone knows whether the Tanaka 5cm f/2 is a Sonnar or not?
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I think it is. While I have not seen an authoritative diagram or taken one apart, I have 2 copies of the Tanar 50/2, 1 chrome and 1 black & chrome. Each has several structural features that point to a sonnar (I summarized this on the camerapedia site):

1 - The front element is small compared to most planar-type 50/f2 lenses.
2 - The rear element is set deeper in the mount than in planar-type lenses (i.e., closer to the film plan at a common focus distance).
3 - The lens more compact than most planar-type lenses
4 - Both lenses have an 18-inch close focus (uncoupled at 1 m)

I have 3 50mm f2 LTM lenses that are definitely sonnar designs: Nikkor, Quinon, and J8. The Nikkor and Quinon share all of the above features, while the J8 shares the first 3. The Canon 50/1.5, a sonnar, also shares the first 3 features compared to other 50mm f1.4 - f1.5 lenses.

I am not very adept at reading reflections, but the Tanar seems to have fewer internal reflections than the planar lenses.

Finally, the images rendered by the Tanar seem sonnar-like: plenty sharp in the middle with a nice transition to less sharp at the edges, with smooth out-of-focus imagery (which can get a little swirly wide-open, depending on the scene).

So, based on all of this, I suggest that the Tanaka Kogaku Tanar 50mm f2 lens is a sonnar. I like the lens very much, by the way. (Case closed?!!)

Cheers,

David
 
januaryman said:
Long thread, but the prices on the lenses that I know are under valued.

Canon 50/1.5 -- $300?? Not! Try $450 if you can find one. Over $600 at Kevin's.

Jupiter 3 $100? Not for a decent one. Figure on $125 minimum.

Jupiter 8 $30? No no no. $50- $75

We might be better off not listing estimated prices if these are going to fluctuate the way they do. Updating would be necessary on a monthly basis!

BUT if anyone wants to part with that Canon 50/1.5 for $300, just tell me where to send my money. Mark it sold!
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I tend to agree. I've seen a couple recent sales on an auction site:

Canon 50/1.5 - A good quality one sold rather recently for $450. Another one recently sold for $285 with haze in fair condition.

Jupiter 3 - $151. This was located in the US and had better resassurances regarding its quality.
 
Sonnar design lenses for the early Pentax SLR:

Takumar 58 mm f2

Takumar 83mm f1.9

these were 1950s preset M42 lenses.
they have a legendary reputation in the early SLR world.
 
tooffy said:
The Japanese said it's half Sonnar/half Gauss. Signature is closest to the Canon50f1.5 (of all the four 50mm Sonnars that I have). Physically, looks very much like Canon50f1.5 but heavier. I paid about $700 for it.
Canon50f1.5 @f1.5

Topcor50f1.5 @f1.5

Zeiss50f1.5 @f1.5

Nikkor50f1.4 @f1.4 (Nikkor's Glow :cool:)
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Nice lens comparison. Do you one particular lens for a particular situation, or is it more of a collection?
 
Toofy, nice comparison.

Just close the Nikkor down a teeny bit (less than half a stop), and it will bite at least as much as the other lenses. The "glow" will disappear and a sharp and contrasty Sonnar will show up ...

Cheers,

Roland.
 
Hi Roland,
Thanks. I found this out when I got the lens from a fellow RFFer last year-I love the Nikkor for its dual-personalities! It's like 2 different lenses in one.:)
ferider said:
Toofy, nice comparison.

Just close the Nikkor down a teeny bit (less than half a stop), and it will bite at least as much as the other lenses. The "glow" will disappear and a sharp and contrasty Sonnar will show up ...

Cheers,

Roland.
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ferider said:
I am wondering about the various Komura lenses (85mm and 105), and also about the longer Fujinon lenses.

Best,

Roland.
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What about the regular Fujinon 5cm f/1.2?

3273117950_b6fc1f4e00_o.jpg
 
ferider said:
Toofy, nice comparison.

Just close the Nikkor down a teeny bit (less than half a stop), and it will bite at least as much as the other lenses. The "glow" will disappear and a sharp and contrasty Sonnar will show up ...

Cheers,

Roland.
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Hmmm, ahhhso!!!!

So that`s a pretty interesting word of advice, while the Nikkor "glow" is`nt one of my fondnesseses of the SC lens, I`m still really searching for a space in my work and creativity for these Nikkor`s, (I have a "Tokyo" and a "Japan" version) - while my Canon f1.5 and my "hacked" CZJ f2.0 get all my attention in work now.

I think the Nikkor`s going to go through some Black and White tests to see how I like that in my styles (I`m not so happy with the Nikkor f1.4 in crossprocessing, (too dark - too green) the f2.0 and the modern 1980`s Summicron f2.0 perform better for me with this film experimentation.)

Tom
 
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Now, the 4 lenses at f2.0

Canon50f1.5 @f2
3270564963_ef39830476.jpg


Topcor50f1.5 @f2
3271379156_dcacff202c.jpg


Zeiss50f1.5 @f2
3271381932_c7bf54f18e.jpg


Nikkor50f1.4 @f2 (no more glow)
3270567943_2f47e5dfa7.jpg
 
To my eyes, the Canon wins hands down. Both test.

How the HELL did you get that guy to sit so still, tooffy? He is still among the living, I trust?
 
Added Tanaka Kogaku Tanar 50mm f/2 to the list!

dberger said:
I think it is. While I have not seen an authoritative diagram or taken one apart, I have 2 copies of the Tanar 50/2, 1 chrome and 1 black & chrome. Each has several structural features that point to a sonnar (I summarized this on the camerapedia site):

1 - The front element is small compared to most planar-type 50/f2 lenses.
2 - The rear element is set deeper in the mount than in planar-type lenses (i.e., closer to the film plan at a common focus distance).
3 - The lens more compact than most planar-type lenses
4 - Both lenses have an 18-inch close focus (uncoupled at 1 m)

I have 3 50mm f2 LTM lenses that are definitely sonnar designs: Nikkor, Quinon, and J8. The Nikkor and Quinon share all of the above features, while the J8 shares the first 3. The Canon 50/1.5, a sonnar, also shares the first 3 features compared to other 50mm f1.4 - f1.5 lenses.

I am not very adept at reading reflections, but the Tanar seems to have fewer internal reflections than the planar lenses.

Finally, the images rendered by the Tanar seem sonnar-like: plenty sharp in the middle with a nice transition to less sharp at the edges, with smooth out-of-focus imagery (which can get a little swirly wide-open, depending on the scene).

So, based on all of this, I suggest that the Tanaka Kogaku Tanar 50mm f2 lens is a sonnar. I like the lens very much, by the way. (Case closed?!!)

Cheers,

David
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