Roger Hicks
Veteran
Dear Ben,Well Roger, after having used my M9 2 years now, I have to say you were right that I now feel there's a significant improvement over the M8. It's nice to have rid of those embarrassing IR filters, and it's also nice to have full-frame back. But to be honest, I still count the improvements in IQ as minor. To call them "significant" is an exercise in semantics.
But whereas I was willing to admit that the IR filters and crop factor of the M8 were things I didn't like but was content to live with if necessary. I have no such issues with the M9, so I'm completely content to bide my time a couple years until used M10's are out there for thousands less.
I fear my chances of finding the money for a new M10 are significantly lower than yours, as my wife is obsessive about vacuuming under the couch cushions
Highlight 1: Same here. Sure, I'd like higher ISO/better high ISO performance but it's a LONG way from decisive.
Highlight 2: I also have the advantage I can set it against tax, but it's still a lot of money to find. Fortunately, my ALCS royalty paid for the M9. But that was the highest ALCS payment I've ever had.
Cheers,
R.
Turtle
Veteran
If the M10 has a CMOS sensor, it will very possibly beat the MM by a good margin on high ISO, but it might not have the effective resolution. After all, the 5d III is 22 mp and the Eos 1DX 18.
Considering the short timeframe between the MM's availability and the M10 announcement, they would surely have to be able to see a viable market for the MM even after the M10 is known to us all (or the MM would have a lifespan of about 2 months). I presume this means more resolving power and, potentially, more gradual tonal transitions in B&W for the MM. I would also expect it to remain quite a bit cheaper.
The M 8.2 remained on the market for a while after the M9 was released, so perhaps the same with the M10 and M9 would mean a noticeably higher price for the M10.
Considering the short timeframe between the MM's availability and the M10 announcement, they would surely have to be able to see a viable market for the MM even after the M10 is known to us all (or the MM would have a lifespan of about 2 months). I presume this means more resolving power and, potentially, more gradual tonal transitions in B&W for the MM. I would also expect it to remain quite a bit cheaper.
The M 8.2 remained on the market for a while after the M9 was released, so perhaps the same with the M10 and M9 would mean a noticeably higher price for the M10.
Lss
Well-known
I guess you mean embarrassing for Leica. As a user I don't see anything embarrassing about using filters. For the sake of convenience I would prefer going without filters, but the real advantage of going M9/M10 for me would be full frame. M10 of course may have other interesting features, M9 not so much.
Price prediction? Too much for me to really care, but I hope it's not much above M9-P to allow as many as possible to buy it (or impatiently wait for availability).
Jeff S
Well-known
Funny how nobody seems to complain about the potentially common use of filters with the MM (Leica even initially recommended light yellow), while the M8 still gets bashed. I guess if Leica had planned for M8 filters rather than awkwardly stumbling into the need for them, these would be viewed as an advantage.
The M8 filters still are more effective in some circumstances than the internal M9 filter. And many (including me) feel the M8 delivers better b/w files out of the camera than the M9, likely in part due to filtration differences.
Jeff
sig
Well-known
Around $1000
denizg7
Well-known
Well I don't expect Leica to surpass my expectations since they don't make their own sensors. So i think a lot of black and white photographers will want to see an M10M and so forth.
Me Honestly? Film B&W is better , consider not the noise but B&W film has an inky feel that digital without editing will not have.
Jeff S
Well-known
I don't wish to engage in the tired film versus digital debates, but only wish to point out that both film and digital typically require "editing," be it in a darkroom or on a computer, or use of different papers, etc.
Still, one might prefer one to the other.
Jeff
Ben Z
Veteran
Speaking just on my own behalf, no complaints because I have absolutely no interest in the MM whatsoever. A huge advatage to me as a once-in-a-while b/w shooter is the ability with the M9 to obviate carrying filters by using color channels in CS.Jeff S said:
They would still be a disadvantage from economic, flare, and mandatory-use standpoint. But at least Leica wouldn't have come off looking like a bunch of incompetent nincompoops.
Quite true, and I still keep a Heliopan IR-cut filter in my bag for such curcumstances. But I have need to use it very very very occasionally, unlike the M8 which (as a mostly color photographer) was practically useless without the filter.
victoriapio
Well-known
depends on what the m10 offers over the M9 but expect $10,999.00 US.
$10,000 for sure.
N
Nikon Bob
Guest
For most it is who cares they will never buy a new Leica at today's prices me included. As Roger points out that may also turn out to be true for a segment of current owners of digital Leicas.
Bob
Bob
mervynyan
Mervyn Yan
with digital m, there is always time delay for average non professional shooter, so I don't want to rule out never never, but certainly used digital m will be on the market at much lower price. so yes, I am interested in monochrome and m10 while keeping current gears useful.
MarkoM8
Member
9999,99€ + Vat
Nemo
Established
I agree with you.
But we don't know, yet, the real price of the M10. It is a key variable, regardless of the M10's specifications.
Nemo
Established
... only for real discriminating photographers...
In fact, we all are discriminating photographers. The real condition is a rich photographer.
BobYIL
Well-known
I wonder how much the "Maria Sharapova" version be offered for.. More than €20K???
kbg32
neo-romanticist
Whatever it is, I'm not buying one. I have a college fund for my son to prepare for and I have 15 years to save. With todays economy, I wish I had 30 more years.
The M9 was the topmost I would pay for any Leica.
The M9 was the topmost I would pay for any Leica.
Keith
The best camera is one that still works!
jtm6
Well-known
Porsche and Mercedes have models that are priced at the "wow that's expensive but not crazy expensive for me if I really want one" range for some people. I feel like Leica digital M models are destined to be like Lamborghinis... just a few very insanely expensive models.
In all fairness, Leica also has lower priced cameras.