M4

[HuubL]

Not sure if this is allowed in the forum, or that I should put this in the Classifieds right away. If so, moderator, please remove this post.

Long story short: I bought an M4 about a year ago on a local Dutch website. It was described as a good user, still with the original Leica seal, so never serviced, but functioning well. It indeed showed use on the strap lugs, some patina on the chrome (but no meter stripes!), haze in the finder, a spot on the rangefinder mirror and feeling a little gritty. I shot two rolls with it and the pictures looked fine. Since I already had two M4s (and a couple of other cameras 😀), I sold it here in the Classifieds to a member in the UK for a small profit. After two weeks the new owner got problems with the film transport, he returned the camera and I reimbursed him.

I’ve never been very pragmatic as far as cameras is concerned. I didn’t consider to accept my loss and decided to sink some more money in the camera to get it fixed. So, I sent the body to Will van Manen. It appeared one of the gears was broken, which he replaced and in addition he gave the camera a complete overhaul.

I’ve been studying the AntiqueCameras website where a good user M4 is valued at 800-1200 US$, excluding the price for a CLA (150-200 US$). But that was in January 2012. When I had the M4 here on offer a few months ago, it didn’t sell for 800 US$.

A few questions:
1. Are the Antiquecamera website prices still valid?
2. If not, what would presently be a reasonable price for a CLA’d M4?
3. Would it likely move faster now that it’s had a CLA?
4. Would it move faster when it is offered with a lens, e.g., a contemporary 50mm Summicron (rigid)?

 

[Livesteamer]

For a chrome M4 I think your prices are about right. If black paint it would be worth more. RFF is a great place to sell but it may take a while. Far fewer people looking at the classifieds than on the big auction site. Good Luck. Joe

 

[kknox]

I have always sold my cameras w/out lens. You might offer the lens, but most of us all have lens that can be used in the M4. That website has not kept up with current camera values. I paid Youxin Ye $150.-$180 for my CLA's over the past 2 years, and also had one done in Seattle for $180.00US.

I recently sold an M3 with a full CLA in Ex condition for $850.00 here on RFF. The Leica cameras that I have sold have all had CLA's. The only reason I sold a couple was to fund another GAS attack. It seems to be easier to sell with a full CLA, then the new buyer knows they are getting a camera that's ready to go. If you sell the M4 w/ out a CLA, you will worry about a future problem like you just had with the last sale. Good luck with you sale.

 

[kentchung]

M4s with a recent CLA would definitely sell better than one that's got the original seal. If an M4 has never been through a CLA, it's long overdue and likely not really usable. Now that your M4 is through, I'm sure it will find itself a good home soon if the price is right~ GLWS.

 

[SolaresLarrave]

Hypothetical, analogous situation: I have an M4 body, purchased for about $675, and not in an ideal shape (in need of a RF alignment and replacement of lugs and light shields). Fixing it will cost me about $170. If I decide to sell it, I'll offer it at $800 plus shipping (perhaps $15 if within the US). Sure, I take a hit, but I'll consider it my profit (after all, I did use the camera for a while). One user-condition, fixed M4 at that price should be a nice proposition.

In your case, the camera was overhauled (I don't think that's the same as a CLA), so I'd add what I paid for it, the overhaul cost, and then shave something like 15 or 20% of the total to come with a sale price, assuming you want a quick sale. That way, you recover some of your investment and the buyer walks away with a smile.

EDIT: I realized that my figures are off... Maybe the sale price should reflect a deduction of 5 to 10 percent of the total

 

[Robert Lai]

It makes sense to overhaul a camera only if you intend to use it for a LONG time. Yes, it will sell faster, and fetch maybe 10-20% more on the selling price, but you will be losing far more money on the overhaul price.

Due to job loss I sold my Leica NJ overhauled M7 and Nikon F3 with motor drive, databack, etc. Both had been overhauled by their respective companies in the past 2 years. I figure a $1000 loss on the M7, and probably $1200 loss on the F3. The Nikons now sell for dirt cheap compared to what they once cost to purchase. They aren't inexpensive to service either, as labor costs are the same no matter what company you use.

Selling anything expensive at the beginning of April is not a great idea. In the USA and Canada this is income tax season. Since money may be owing to the government, a lot of us can't spend any until we know for sure. You may be luckier after the 15th of April (30th of April for Canada), when people will have tax return money and be able to purchase things.

Sell the camera without a lens. With a lens, you make it harder to sell as you need to find a buyer who wants that particular camera AND that particular lens.

 

[HuubL]

Thanks for all your feedback. Robert, you got good advice with the 15th April date. I'll keep that in mind 🙂

 

[hepcat]

I've bought and sold a lot of gear over the past two years, switching from a full Olympus digital kit with SHG glass to a Leica digital kit, and then acquiring (and selling some) Hasselblad gear. My experience has been that if you want it to sell quickly, price it at a bargain. If you want to make the maximum amount of money, price it where you want it, market it properly (lots of photos, receipts for the overhaul, etc) and be patient. Someone will buy it at your asking price, eventually.

Individual pieces almost always sell faster than bundles, and you get more out of them. I have bought a number of bundled items that I only wanted one piece out of, and sold the other pieces at a substantial profit; sometimes actually making a little on the entire deal. I'd suggest selling the body by itself for that reason.

The April 15th date may or may not be important. I've never found that it makes much difference in selling photo gear myself.

 

[Steve Bellayr]

On anything: Sometimes you win sometimes you loose. That goes for houses, stock markets, etc. On the other hand, if you can afford it, and have more than one lens, why not keep one camera with color and one with b&w? Even with one lens this might work.