M9 "Altitude" Problem

[Clark.EE]

Been over 3500m for last 3 weeks in Peru & Bolivia.
Had a lot of issues with the loan camera from leica
Locked up 4 or 5 times, Battery issues, would not recognise a
fully charged battery when inserted. later discovered that if i turned it off & waited 5 minutes or so, it was ok!
Exposure problems, conditions were quite extreme on occasions.
Anyone else had problems at altitude?

 

[icebear]

Which firmware version do you run ?
What type of battery are you using - orig. Leica or some cheapo ?
I have never had any issues so far but I also haven't been in the Andes.

 

[Richard G]

I've read on here of someone who had theirs in the extreme cold somewhere, I think Alaska, with no problem.

Avoiding non-Leica batteries and SanDisk Extrme 8G cards would see potential improvements in performance.

 

[TheGodParticle]

I've shot with the m9 in -25c in Russia, in Dubai with +53c and had no issues except for my hands that were surely not feeling too well

I use a Sandusk 32gb extreme card and two original Leica batteries

 

[jaapv]

If you do not use special measures like keeping a spare battery in your pocket to keep it warm you will get trouble like that during prolonged use at below-zero temperatures. On any digital camera. As the M8/9 is small and made of metal the battery will drop below operating temperature easier than a DSLR.
If a Li-Ion battery gets too cold it will not work, if it gets too hot it cannot be recharged. That is why the manuals of digital cameras give a minimum and maximum operating temperature.
As the photographer will often tend to get " under cover " as soon as possible we see these " my camera was fine at minus 60 degrees" posts. The battery was normally not out long enough to be frozen into inactivity. And batteries tend to get charged at night.
I have had to switch the battery for a warm one when in the mountains in winter after a few hours, and needed to recharge my batteries inside a fridge in Zambia.

 

[paradoxbox]

why not bring along some hand warmers on your trip? you can get a box of 20 of them for 3 or 4$ and they stay warm for around 8 hours. they have self adhesive so you can stick one to the bottom of your camera plate and it'll keep your camera good for hours, or you can put it under your clothing under the spot where your camera rests on the strap.

 

[Clark.EE]

I dont think temperature was the issue.
On the salt flats in Bolivia it was 25 C in the day & 5-6 at night.
Probably a bit colder on the Inka trail.
2 Leica & 2 generic batteries.
Not had these problems with the M8.
In fact it is much smoother in operation, more responsive, faster etc etc,
or was till i dropped it.
Maybe it has some issues?
As i say it is a loan camera from Leica, i think the Rangefinder is out as well.
I assume it is the latest firmware. V. 1.176.

 

[KM-25]

Funny how people just assume it is cold at a relatively moderate elevation of 11,500 feet ( the term altitude is for flight references ). It is spring in the Southern Hemisphere at the moment, not cold winter.

3500 meters is pretty average in terms of human habitation, I doubt the camera is being affected by it.

 

[hteasley]

I think it's a humidity issue, not a temperature issue. Is it humid where you are right now?

 

[KM-25]

I think it's a humidity issue, not a temperature issue. Is it humid where you are right now?

Nope, it is very, very dry in the Andes, 22,837 foot Aconcagua looking like a virtual desert compared to 20,320 foot Denali.

 

[hteasley]

Nope, it is very, very dry in the Andes, 22,837 foot Aconcagua looking like a virtual desert compared to 20,320 foot Denali.

Well, shoot. I've figured out (I believe) that the intermittent shutter issue that my M9 has experienced has been due to high humidity.

 

[jaapv]

I dont think temperature was the issue.
On the salt flats in Bolivia it was 25 C in the day & 5-6 at night.
Probably a bit colder on the Inka trail.
2 Leica & 2 generic batteries.
Not had these problems with the M8.
In fact it is much smoother in operation, more responsive, faster etc etc,
or was till i dropped it.
Maybe it has some issues?
As i say it is a loan camera from Leica, i think the Rangefinder is out as well.
I assume it is the latest firmware. V. 1.176.

In case it was not cold, you are completely right in assuming it has to do with the firmware.
As there were problems with data loss caused by substandard and aging batteries Leica tightened up the power management on the latest firmware.
Logically, that resulted in many generic batteries becoming unusable and some old M8 batteries had to be replaced as well. Try your camera with a recent original battery.
Also the writing of the files to the card became slower because extra data checks were written into the firmware.
Because of this some users have reverted to earlier firmware like 1.162

 

[SDK]

Low Humidity and Static Charge

Low Humidity and Static Charge

Low humidity can lead to static electricity charges building up in non-grounded electronics. An M9 is a computer with a camera built onto it and can be disabled by static electricity. My college Photo teacher Peter T. Brown used to have trouble with his Nikon F3 (electronically controlled film camera) locking up on him in the High Plains region of the US due to static charge buildup.

So Clark, you may need to discharge the charge to ground occasionally to restore function. Turn off the camera, take the battery out and set it down for a few minutes. If there is a grounded metal structure around, touch the metal skin of the camera to that (obviously don’t pick something that is carrying its own charge like power lines). Then pop the battery back in and turn the camera back on. Hope that helps.

 

[mike rosenlof]

Altitude also makes convection, or even forced air cooling, less effective. Less air mass moves less heat. That's the reason behind a lot of the altitude specs you see on electronic equipment.

 

[sepiareverb]

I've got an M9 body in NJ right now, along with a flash. I started getting black DNG files when using the flash- randomly. Spoke with the tech today, turns out it is the batteries and firmware. I've got a mix of batteries, all Leica, but some from my M8 and thus too old. A couple of new batteries and a firmware update will fix me.

I've had trouble with the camera in cold weather, but never at high altitude nor in humidity. Was at 10,000+ feet last summer, and spent a week at 7500' (both in New Mexico) with no issues. Vermont is HUMID in the summer, and again never any issues. Below 15°F I have issues with battery life. THAT is the real drag of digital. An MP doesn't blink at 0°F, but it is often (nearly always for months on end) below 20°F here in the winter.

 

[Clark.EE]

Just get a couple more batteries you say!
Thats about £150 of our English pounds.
I only paid £1200 for my M8!
Glad its a loan camera, cant wait to get my M8 back to be honest.
Certainly made up my mind about an "upgrade".

Am back in UK now, just tried the Batteries in the M9.
They seem to work fine except 1, i will check the charge & try again! Interesting...

 

[sepiareverb]

I've been using these batteries (well two of them anyway) since I got my M8 in 2007. That's about five years out of a rechargable battery. Couldn't begin to guess how many charge cycles they've been through, lots tho. Doesn't seem outrageous that it has lived it's life and is passing on...

 

[V-12]

Just get a couple more batteries you say!
Thats about £150 of our English pounds.
I only paid £1200 for my M8!
Glad its a loan camera, cant wait to get my M8 back to be honest.
Certainly made up my mind about an "upgrade".

Am back in UK now, just tried the Batteries in the M9.
They seem to work fine except 1, i will check the charge & try again! Interesting...

Generic batteries will not work with the M9 the same way they do with the M8. This is a well documented situation. The correct level of a generic battery will not be shown with an M9, the camera will not read the charge level so makes wrong assumptions and closes down. Switching it back on again gives you another few minutes before the same thing happens again. Often a 'Battery Low' warning will be shown (even if fully charged) and this can be cancelled by pressing 'OK'. Press 'OK' often enough and the M9 seems to realise the battery can't really be empty because it is still working, so resets the battery level indicator. The only way to show the correct charge with a generic battery in the M9 is to completly discharge it before re-charging. But this situation is worse with the new Firmware as the cutoff point for the camera to consider the battery as being 'low' is higher, so it shuts down sooner.