M9 with B&W sensor?

[Calzone]

Cal, your B&W volume is enough that the cost of an M9 or M10 would be made up in a pretty short time.
That was just an aside...

So, if I get really desperate and depressed again, getting mad at photography and yelling that I'm going to sell the M9, I'm going to send it to you to keep it away from me so I can't sell it. Use it as much as you like and see if you actually like the workflow and the image quality.

Until then, I'm keeping it in my hands and using it. I can't afford to not have it at this point I figure. Once I find a job outside the media then the M9 can go away, but I still have it as a tiny moneymaker.

Phil Forrest

Phil

I figure that a Digital M would easily pay for itself if I only shoot half as much film over a period of 3-4 years. Today I'm getting a shipment of Arista Premium from Fed Ex to add to my stockpile in the freezer. Next week I'm taking off work to develop about 45 rolls of film. Tonight I'm shooting some more.

BTW passionate people who struggle in the arts have bouts of artistic despair. I was a painter for 12 years and one day I kinda destroyed almost all of my work and only kept a few paintings. Don't do anything drastic, and consider just getting a secure day job so that you don't have to compromise your artistic integrity. Creativity can be a curse of a lifestyle. Please consider what we talked about.

Cal

 

[taxi38]

I suppose theres no chance this might be the X2m and sell for a couple of thousand pounds...........?

 

[Phil_F_NM]

Phil

I figure that a Digital M would easily pay for itself if I only shoot half as much film over a period of 3-4 years. Today I'm getting a shipment of Arista Premium from Fed Ex to add to my stockpile in the freezer. Next week I'm taking off work to develop about 45 rolls of film. Tonight I'm shooting some more.

BTW passionate people who struggle in the arts have bouts of artistic despair. I was a painter for 12 years and one day I kinda destroyed almost all of my work and only kept a few paintings. Don't do anything drastic, and consider just getting a secure day job so that you don't have to compromise your artistic integrity. Creativity can be a curse of a lifestyle. Please consider what we talked about.

Cal

Absolutely I'll consider anyone's advice (as long as it's reasonably sane.)

As for your volume of film, you should roll over to the Eastman 5222 thread and start shooting some of the Kodak XX that we use. Tom A. is also experimenting with the ORWO line of film and having fantastic results. That gives us folks 100, 200 and 400 ISO to choose from in either 400 or 1000ft lengths. The only thing is you have to bulk roll your own stuff but after the initial outlay, I'm paying less than a dollar per roll. At that price I can afford to shoot almost as much as I can shoot with the digital.

I'll roll you a few canisters of XX and bring them to the May meeting.

Phil Forrest

 

[Calzone]

Absolutely I'll consider anyone's advice (as long as it's reasonably sane.)

As for your volume of film, you should roll over to the Eastman 5222 thread and start shooting some of the Kodak XX that we use. Tom A. is also experimenting with the ORWO line of film and having fantastic results. That gives us folks 100, 200 and 400 ISO to choose from in either 400 or 1000ft lengths. The only thing is you have to bulk roll your own stuff but after the initial outlay, I'm paying less than a dollar per roll. At that price I can afford to shoot almost as much as I can shoot with the digital.

I'll roll you a few canisters of XX and bring them to the May meeting.

Phil Forrest

Phil,

Realize that I shoot a lot of 120 and when I do 6x9 its only 8 shots per roll. With 120 its easy to blow through 20 rolls in a day of shooting. You probably forgot how hungry your big Fuji was.

Also I do the Freestyle bulking of film. Getting another shipment today to restock already. Another thing is that I made processing costs amount to only a few pennies of fixer per roll because I use Diafine and it gets reused. Gone are the days of mixing up a batch of 10 liters of ID-11 at a time.

I kinda threw away the instructions and shoot Arcos (Legacy Pro) at 100 with 5+5, and do Tri-X (Arista Premium) at 650 with 3+3 that gives me medium format detail and an extended contrast range in 135. In 120 Cristian once said of my 6x9 negatives, "With negatives like these you don't need 4x5." I do minimal agitation so my process is near stand development.

I'll be trying to do Diafine-Times-Two where you cycle film through Diafine twice to double the film speed next week. If I can get 1600 ISO with rich mid tone I'll be happy. I want to shoot at night mucho.

BTW TA Rapidwinders make shooting my Leicas like my F3P with motordrive. Very easy to shoot lots of film.

Cal

 

[dallard]

Here's some fresh grist from the rumor mill:
http://leicarumors.com/2012/04/19/l...0-more-leica-monochrome-with-lcd-screen.aspx/

 

[Phil_F_NM]

On May 10

On May 10

Can't we just get a firmware update for the M9 that allows use of the 21mm Super Angulon so we don't get those weird edges?

Phil Forrest

 

[jsrockit]

Can't we just get a firmware update for the M9 that allows use of the 21mm Super Angulon so we don't get those weird edges?

Phil Forrest

They already have your cash Phil.... 😀

 

[Phil_F_NM]

They already have your cash Phil.... 😀

YOUR cash, John. The GI Bill paid for it. Thank you all! 🙂

Phil Forrest

 

[135format]

Assuming just for one moment that its not all an april fools joke, then from what I've read the microlens(bayer) filters aren't required. So does that mean if the same kodak(ex) sensor is used that we get a 54MP camera?

 

[jsrockit]

YOUR cash, John. The GI Bill paid for it. Thank you all! 🙂

Phil Forrest

Ah, I see. So, when you show up in May, I'll have my second M9 then...since it was MY cash. 😉

 

[jaapv]

Assuming just for one moment that its not all an april fools joke, then from what I've read the microlens(bayer) filters aren't required. So does that mean if the same kodak(ex) sensor is used that we get a 54MP camera?

No about 24.

 

[Calzone]

Assuming just for one moment that its not all an april fools joke, then from what I've read the microlens(bayer) filters aren't required. So does that mean if the same kodak(ex) sensor is used that we get a 54MP camera?

In an article I mentioned earlier in the thread the reviewers state that removing the Bayer Filter results in about a 10% increase in resolution, but no noticable difference could visually be be determined when compared with a B&W print made with a color sensor. Not sure if the extra resolution would be noticed and a smaller sensor with less than 45 megapixels.

Cal

 

[taxi38]

What interests me is that the image will pass through the camera less affected than with a colour sensor.This is a good thing.Unfortunatly academic as I dont see what I can sell in order to buy one and still have a lens to put on it.

 

[135format]

No about 24.

I know I'm goig to regret asking but how so? If you have 3 colour areas which you convert to 3 intensity measuring areas how does that work.

 

[robklurfield]

Of course, Jaap is perhaps the only person on RFF who has a microscope for cleaning his sensors that costs more -- way more -- than his cameras. And that microscope is also a Leica.

Jaap, you posted a picture of your "other" Leica a long time ago. Care to re-post it?

Leica makes more than just rangefinders..🙄

 

[jaapv]

Ah - but Leica microscopes are not made by Leica Camera, but by another company called Leica Microsystems.😉

 

[jaapv]

I know I'm goig to regret asking but how so? If you have 3 colour areas which you convert to 3 intensity measuring areas how does that work.

Because resolution is not determined by merging the Bayer filtered channels, luminance of the discrete pixels must be considered as well. So an 18 MP filterless sensor will still have only 18 MP resolution, as that is the number of pixels. However eliminating the sharpness loss because of the Bayer filter will give the same impression of sharpness and detail on a 24 MP filtered sensor, not a 54 MP sensor, which I assume is what you mean. 18 million pixels are 18 million pixels and will not miraculously be multiplied.

 

[135format]

Because resolution is not determined by merging the Bayer filtered channels, luminance of the discrete pixels must be considered as well. So an 18 MP filterless sensor will still have only 18 MP resolution, as that is the number of pixels. However the resolution loss because of the Bayer filter will give the same impression of sharpness and detail on a 24 MP filtered sensor, not a 54 MP sensor, which I assume is what you mean. 18 million pixels are 18 million pixels and will not miraculously be multiplied.

I thought that pixels as we get them in our image files were a combination of 3 receptors. i.e. Green, Red and Blue receptors. My asumption was that turning them all into luminance receptors would effectively give you three times as many pixels. Obviously I'm wrong on that one.

 

[jaapv]

That is the Foveon story. it s a nice enough sensor, but marketing remains marketing.

 

[Keith]

Anyone who would shell out $5000 + for a digital camera body with a 36 x 24mm sensor that only produces black and white needs their head examined IMO!

YMMV of course! 😀