Magnum Photos website vs Steve Huff blog

[furcafe]

Good. The more people w/cameras, the better. To say otherwise is like saying that universal literacy is a bad idea because only so many people can be good writers.

As I was replying to this thread and talking about camera releases a new Sony Nex camera was announced with a few from Canon.

And by the Photokina that everyone is looking forward to like Christmas there will be 20 more and many more lenses.

 

[jsrockit]

Next time you see a guy/girl with a camera trying to be a photographer, don't ask him what camera or lens(es) his using, ask him if he has some example of his work on him. And carry a sample of your own work with you.

What happens if you want to know about their gear though? 😛

In all fairness, when I'm out on the streets, I don't want to see work or talk about a camera. I just leave them alone. However, if someone was curious about my gear, I never get offended. I also keep a small book of my work in my bag so I can show my work, but generally people don't ask and I'm not the type to force it on someone.

If gear is in YOUR way, then that may be your problem. However, not everyone who likes gear talk is letting it get in the way of making photos. Most of the gear whores I know photograph a lot. Many of us posting on here are doing so when we cannot be out photographing. Despite what others think, it is OK to take a break from photography. There is no one set way to do things. Good work is not made by following rules and forgetting to live your life outside of photography.

 

[jsrockit]

Showing your work on the internet is useless, show prints in real life face-to-face and then that is a measure of skill.

Skill cannot be seen online?

 

[brbo]

Showing your work on the internet is useless, show prints in real life face-to-face and then that is a measure of skill.

****! I saw a lot of photographic work that I liked in digital form.

Now I know it all useless...

 

[furcafe]

Perhaps in your definition of photography, which appears to resemble a fundamentalist religion.

Showing your work on the internet is useless, show prints in real life face-to-face and then that is a measure of skill.

And that is what I'm asking for. Ask people for their work in real life situations.

Print is the final product.

 

[richardhkirkando]

Just be thankful Ken Rockwell doesn't have comments on his site.

 

[finguanzo]

Just be thankful Ken Rockwell doesn't have comments on his site.

amen :angel:

 

[Timmy P]

I think that more than anything, websites like Magnum not being popular are not indicative of gear loving over taking the appreciation of photography, but simply how photography is treated nowadays for a great majority of people.


Let me share a few stories so you understand what I mean. The first was when I did a year of a Bachelor of Photography. We had a theory class and our teacher, who was a documentary photographer, asked "Who wants to be a fashion/commercial photographer?". Everyone except 1 other person, of a class of about 40, put up their hand. Next, "Who wants to be a photojournalist or documentary photographer?", me and the remaining person raised their hand. At least I learnt how to develop film before I ditched it, so I got something good out of the experience 😀


The next story is when I worked at an online camera store. The amount of "pro's" who's images looked identical to one another was staggering. Pretty much fell into the LENS FLARE LOW CONTRAST KISS or barbie doll vomit processed look. Following from that was the amount of "pro's" who's work was so bad you'd almost wonder if it would be worth selling out just to wipe the floor with them. Anyone with a basic grasp of technical details of how to use a camera & a youtube tut on photo editing could have done a better job. Had only 1 fine art and 1 newspaper photographer come in when I worked there, and only the fine art lady really passed the muster on what I would consider "pro".


Finally, I had a very awkward moment with my friend who was flicking through my very modest collection of photography books. He flicked through one I'd made on lovely snapfish about my week long trip to Japan in 2009, nothing I would consider special just something I made for the hell of it. He moved on to a smaller book of some of HCB's best images, which he got about 6 pages into before he put it down and said "this is crap, I'd rather look at your stuff". It wasn't really a compliment though because I love HCB 😡


So in summery, I would say photography both as a pursuit and also being appreciated has really moved into the realm of the fashion and commercial areas. There is also a massive glut of "me too" types who throw the "pro" label around in a way which would churn your stomach.


Following on from that, people become obsessed with gear because they want that "look" and also a bit of the IT crowd as well. Everyone knows documentary or even street work takes a lot of time and effort, do you think the average enthusiast can be bothered to invest that time, or would they rather shoot a few photo's out back with a generic hot girl, process them into smithereens and then get a million comments or likes on facebook?


At least from my own experience in Australia, most people just really don't seem to be interested in documentary or fine art type stuff unless it's flavour of the month. Most hipsters have heard of Terry Richardson, but who knows who Trent Parke is? :bang:

 

[Thardy]

Why are we comparing the number of comments on the two sites rather than the number of hits?

Gear and the overwhelming, passionate pursuit of photography have relatively little overlap in terms of interest. People browsing the two sites are not always from the same pool.

Photography is definitely not dead. IMHO it is healthier than it has ever been. Digital equipment has created such VAST access to photography that equipment heavy forums are all over the place. Just look at the endless list of digital photography magazines! The end result, however, is the production of photographs, which is photography.... and as always, not all of it is good.

I visit Magnum and various other sites regularly but don't comment. I do comment here lots, yet I am the same person 😉 What does that tell you? only that I visit the two types of site for very different reasons. A related point is that the more my photos sell for and the better the exhibition venues, the fewer people ask what equipment I used.... The paucity of blog postings an internet fanfare does not mean that exhibitions and a healthy photography culture does not exist!

The Magnum site looks static, but Magnum's Facebook page is quite lively with 218,000 "likes" and comments on the photos. The FB page actually mirrors the website. In contrast, Huff's page only has 8,000 likes.

The comments you see on Huff's site are frequently by the same people who post numerous times on the same topics. Sure there are 50 comments per thread, but what if it's one guy who posts 7 times? And many times topics devolve into silly stuff like.

1. Leica is too expensive
2. The MM has no merit
3. Leica is rich boy's toy

That's hardly anything to get worked up over.

Also if one dares to venture onto Flickr, you'd would find many groups with images where people rarely mention gear.

As far as photo forums and blogs - you have the same few hundred people who visit them making all sorts of noise. I wouldn't say that's "everybody" .

 

[moreammo]

I'm an IT Director so maybe you should ignore me 🙂

Innovation is driven by the needs of the masses.

The end result is every photographer has a whole host of tools to achieve their vision, use them or don't thats your choice. 30 years ago it wasn't so different, the communication channels were just not so widely open for the world to see. If GAS is a symptom of stifled creatively for you, that's great you can spot that a mile away, you know when to buck down and focus on what you enjoy.

Innovation has opened up the world to all of us, even if we chose to focus on our cats in full auto instead of grasping the art our cameras our capable of. Shots that would have at one time been very difficult with high end equipment can be achieved with a point and shoot and Photoshop in much less time. In the right environment a $3 disposable camera from the local pharmacy wins the cover of Sports Illustrated. Be in the right place at the right time and that same $3 disposable wins the cover of Time. Gear truly does not matter but we like reading and talking about it. the innovations are exciting... new tools to achieve our goals... but maybe i'm part of the problem.

 

[Turtle]

Unless I am very confused, I am a photographer, but I don't carry prints around on the street because that is silly. I also don't feel the need to prove anything in such a casual manner.

I do agree that equipment obsession can be a disease, but its not a new phenomenon.

Showing work on the internet is not ideal, but it is a lot better than nothing.

 

[mawilliams]

Magnum is the National Football League, or English Premiere League if you will 🙂 of photo agencies - I doubt very much that they care about comments the great unwashed (us) leave about their photographer's work anyway. Good lord folks - we are not on their radar. The magazines, galleries and publishers that buy their photographer's work are their primary concern. Their website is a wonderful place to go to see some of the best photojournlism in the world. If you don't like the work there photojournalism is obviously not your bag.

 

[fstops]

Skill cannot be seen online?

Not really. a 800x600 downsized picture from a badly calibrated monitor, in a badly lit place with another badly calibrated monitor could mean the difference between a good photo or crap. One of the reasons people are going over the top with HDR and other gimmicks is that those exaggerations overcome limitation of seeing images on a monitor - they make all stuff "pop" on the monitor.

 

[fstops]

Unless I am very confused, I am a photographer, but I don't carry prints around on the street because that is silly.

It is very straight forward, when photographers meet they talk camera, for a change it would be better to see each others work...

Who better to show one's work than other photographers and people as well and the cops if it came to it.

The best outcome of this approach would be that everyone would strive for better pictures because they know they might be asked for it on the spot.



P.S. And if someone is shy then they picked up the wrong hobby/activity.

 

[Vics]

Well, this has been a nasty little chapter in RFF's heretofore friendly and helpful histrory.

 

[jsrockit]

Not really. a 800x600 downsized picture from a badly calibrated monitor, in a badly lit place with another badly calibrated monitor could mean the difference between a good photo or crap.

I judge a photo initially on content and compostion, both of which can be determined at 800x600. The type of technical stuff you are refering to can be sorted out later if the photo is worth it.

 

[fstops]

I judge a photo initially on content and compostion, both of which can be determined at 800x600. The type of technical stuff you are refering to can be sorted out later if the photo is worth it.

The computer monitor is not designed to show subtlety, most of them are designed for reading text and not everyone can afford or has a $1000 monitor. Even those who have the $1000 monitor will not notice anything 'subtle' in a 800x600 image because its too compressed.

 

[emraphoto]

Showing your work on the internet is useless, show prints in real life face-to-face and then that is a measure of skill.

And that is what I'm asking for. Ask people for their work in real life situations.

Print is the final product.

ignoring what is currently one of the most powerful mediums for photography seems odd to me?

where exactly can we see your work? you are expressing very strong condemnations of peoples work and their interests thus it would be interesting to gain some perspective. no need for subtleties... just perspective.

 

[Bob Michaels]

Showing your work on the internet is useless, show prints in real life face-to-face and then that is a measure of skill.
And that is what I'm asking for. Ask people for their work in real life situations.
Print is the final product.

fstops: The opening tomorrow night. There are 35 prints in this exhibit.

 

[moreammo]

Nice Bob! And the images look good here on my "monitor" too.

Even the color ones 🙂 Nice work Bob I like the Delta Pics, Esp Big C's restaurant