Making the switch

[grizzlyadam]

First a bit of background:
I have been a semi-pro photographer for about 5 or 6 years. I shoot mainly weddings and some travel editorial work with a good friend of mine. For work I shoot Canon dSLRs 99% of the time. Recently the wedding scene has been testing my patience. I am not enjoying like I used to. I have always wanted a nice rangefinder but I am child of the digital age and never learned how to shoot on film all that well and honestly don't care that much to learn. I understand it has its benefits and do not want to start any debates on that.

What I would like is to hear some feedback as far as how you, as an individual, would move forward if you were looking to dump all of your dSLR equipment and jump into a digital rangefinder.

I should have approximately $4500 US to spend after all items are sold. This is a pretty conservative estimate and a few hundred dollars could go either way. What I am looking for in an M body with the fastest glass possible in the 35, 50 and 80-90mm equivalent ranges. I am not against non-leica lenses because I am not buying for the brand I buying for the RF functionality. The 35mm and 80-90(portrait) range is probably most important to me. I understand I will not be getting an M9 which means there will be a certain "crop" factor involved so a 28mm would give me close to a 35mm equivalent and so on. I would like the most bang for the buck so to speak.

Also If you believe that this is just not enough to get what I am looking for there really is no reason for me to do this other than i want to so I can be patient and save my nickels and dimes. The only problem is my 5d and 40d are not going to be worth much in the future. I bought L lenses so that is a good investment that is holding steady. Any advice with specific lenses and info would help

Thanks
Adam

 

[Phil_F_NM]

A nice option would be an M8 or M8.2 with a 28mm f/2.8 (any of the brand names that offered them are fantastic) or the Voigtlander 28mm f/1.9//f/2 and a Voigtlander 75mm f/1.8. You'd still have a bit left over with that kit if you shopped around carefully. You might also want to look at the 25mm f/2.8 Zeiss lens.
Remember, you'll have to get a few UV/IR filters as well but these days they are coming way down in price since a lot are entering the used market with the increased sales of M9 bodies.

Phil Forrest

 

[Lss]

I should have approximately $4500 US to spend after all items are sold. -- -- What I am looking for in an M body with the fastest glass possible in the 35, 50 and 80-90mm equivalent ranges. I am not against non-leica lenses because I am not buying for the brand I buying for the RF functionality.

Your budget is otherwise plentiful, but it is limiting for getting a fast 35 equivalent. You can get an M8, possibly an M8.2, and three lenses to cover those focal lenghts. Now the fast 35 is a problem if fast means at least f/2. There you either have a Voigtländer 28/1.9 (out of production) or 28/2, or you need to significantly stretch the budget to Leica 28/2 or even Leica 24/1.4 which is M9 money. If f/2.8 is sufficient, you have several options. I have the 28/1.9 and it is a good lens.

I will gladly leave the wedding business debate to those who find that part interesting.

 

[Shade]

I dumped all my dSLR gear for the rangefinder and olympus mirrorless. Its just easier and feels better to me.

For your setup I would recommend an m8 because I think the m8.2 is not better tahn the m8, it has lower shutter speed even! The rest of the upgrade to me is worthless.

For lenses you could go for the 28/2 voigtlander, not as good as the zeiss or leica, but it holds its own ground and to me its a no brainer for the price.

Next would be another voigtlander 35/1.2 mk2, this is one hell of a lens and extremely sharp with imho pleasing bokeh. This would be the most expensive lens out of my suggestions.

Lastly the voigtlander 75/1.8, which also is a stellar performer, I used to own one but I find having too many lenses to become a hassle.


Rough estimate:

M8: $2200
28/2: $450
35/1.2: $1500
75/1.8: $700

Its a bit more than what you budgeted for, but I think it would be a credible set up. The 28/2 and 75/1.8 are rough preowned price while you will have to get the 35/1.2 mk2 new since everyone is ordering one and I imagine it would be difficult to find a preowned one now. But you can try..

 

[hellomikmik]

My advice: be patient, keep the 5D and good glass - earn some money with it and then get m9.

 

[Fraser]

The M9 and 5d work great together, quite often when I can't be bothered carrying everything at work I have my M9 with 28mm and 5dmk11 with a longer lens.

 

[gilpen123]

RD1x, Leica 35 2.0 V4, Hexanon 90 2.8 and VC 15 4.0 you'll be able to include a nice domke bag in your budget.

 

[Steve M.]

Your budget is fine for an Epson or Leica rangefinder (what else is there?), and some good glass. I'm a little confused by your statement about having to learn new skills to shoot film. If you shoot digital, film is lots easier. No clipping of the highlights, easier to expose, etc. True, there's always the developing and printing issues, but w/ the good price Precision Camera offers on developing and scanning, you wouldn't maybe need to learn anything new. If it were me, and I was after B&W, the Epson cameras seem to make better files and don't have that pesky IR filter need like the Leicas. But I'd still set aside $450 or so for an R2a film camera and try some of that glass w/ it. Just to see.

 

[BobYIL]

Seeing the world through a rangefinder could be so different than seeing the same through a lens..

If you're intending to use the rangefinder also for professional work, do not sell anything, do buy yourself an inexpensive film rangefinder first and see whether rangefinder is for you. Such experience may cost you less than $200 including film & etc., however you'd lose nothing from the present status you enjoy.

 

[grizzlyadam]

Thank you for everyone's input. This is exactly what I am looking for. mikmik I don't think I want to earn more money with my camera. This started as a hobby for me and I would like to get back to that.
I will continue shooting film occasionally and playing around with it. I think the R2a will make a great second body some day.

 

[The Meaness]

I have an M8 with 15mm, 28mm, and 50mm lenses. They produce 20mm, 37mm, and 67mm equivalents. I have loved using a 50 on the M8 because it is easy to use as a portrait lens, but gives you a little more room than an 80 or 90mm. My suggestion is to get a fast 50 as a portrait lens, find the right 25/28mm for you and call it a day. I love the 50 as a portrait lens because there are so many options, and they are almost always lighter, faster, and more compact than the 75 or longer RF lenses. There are a lot of other great options for lens combos, but that's what suits me best.

 

[Shade]

I wish they would use the m3s viewfinder on the m9 instead..

 

[seakayaker1]

Lens suggestions:

Voigtlander 28/1.9 ASPH Ultron ~ New 679.00
Voigtlander 50/1.5 ASPH Nokton ~ New 699.00
Voightlander 75/2.5 Color-Heliar ~ New 429.00 with free View Finder
Three LTM to M adaptors @ 59.00 each

Total cost for lens $ 1984.00

Leaves you with about $ 2500.00 for a used M8, or spend a little more for the M8.2.

I currently own the 28/1.9 and 50/1.5 above and they are fantastic lens, a lot of bang for the buck! I have owned the 75/2.5 and then sold it when I picked up a 75/1.8. I did replace the 75/1.8 with a 75/2 Cron. The 75/2.5 was a wonderful portrait lens with my M8.2 camera. I had to pick between the 75/2.5 and 75/1.8 Voigtlander I would choose the 75/2 since I liked the way the lens rendered the photograph.

Good luck with your decision and you should be able to pull together a kit for the budget your working with.

 

[Jeff S]

I think the frame lines on the M8.2 (2m), or on an upgraded M8, are worth the expense for more accurate framing at distances, which you seem to want. As you probably know, the M8 can be upgraded in 3 ways (the others being the sapphire glass and the shutter...the latter requiring reduction in speed from 1/8000 to 1/4000). The prices of used gear will generally correspond to the respective level of upgrade (one get a base M8 or 1, 2 or 3 upgrades, with the M8.2 including all 3 plus a few other minor differences). I think Leica missed the boat not incorporating the 2m frame lines on the M9.

I own 2 M8.2s and have had no problems with either camera. The early M8s and M9s, both being 'first generation' cameras (the former being the first digital M, and the latter being the first FF digital M), had some teething issues, some requiring trips to Leica service. The M8.2 is a more well sorted camera IMO and has seemed to have fewer issues. The limited numbers of M8.2s may also help retain future value compared to other digital Ms, but this shouldn't dictate your purchase decision.

I suggest that you buy only from a reputable Leica dealer that will provide warranty and stand by your purchase should you have any issues.

Jeff

 

[jippiejee]

I just bought my first digital M, a Leica M8, and though I love it, I think your Canon dslr's are probably a lot better in challenging light situations as needed for weddings and events. I consider the M8 my 'good daylight' machine. It's just not very good at higher ISO's.

 

[Chris Bail]

grizzlyadam - I completely understand where you're at. I've been going through something similar recently, and will be selling off my Nikon gear and fast lenses as soon as I shoot my last scheduled wedding. I started picking up weddings as a way to pay for more cool gear, and at some point it turned into shooting more weddings to buy more gear to shoot more weddings, etc, ad naseum....

SO. I made it a goal to sell most of my cameras and gear, and buy myself a digital rangefinder. (I'm already a film rangefinder user).

I am working with the same sort of budget (after selling my gear), and looked long and hard at the Epson R-D1, M8 and M9. Ultimately I want to get an M9...seeing as I already have a Leica CL and a couple M lenses and LTM lenses, and given the fact that the M9 prices really haven't dropped much in the last two years, I opted to get an M8 right now instead for less than 1/3 the price of a nice used M9. You can find these for right around $2k...which leaves quite a lot for a couple fast CV lenses 35/1.2 and 50/1.1 (neither of these are as nice as the Leica fast lenses, but they are still pretty dang nice, and you won't have to sell your car to buy them) and maybe a 90/2.8 Elmarit.

1 week of M8 ownership under my belt, and one Voigtlander fast lens later, and I'm a happy guy.

 

[gDallasK]

Don't forget there are less obvious alternatives. The Ricoh GXR is available with an M-Mount module - the A12-M which mounts Leica and other M-bayonet lenses and offers through lens focusing with either the LCD or (optional) EVF. Focusing is quick, easy and accurate and - if you find you can't get on with a rangefinder - you can still use all that great Leica glass. I have both an M9 and a GXR. Whilst nothing competes with the M9 for IQ, the GXR is a lot easier to use in some situations.

 

[Shade]

The Ricoh A12 is a great option too, I second that!