Minolta CLE or Leica M5

I use an MLE body with a Zeiss 25mm f2.8 because the MLE's screen, edge to edge, approximates the 25's coverage. This is great for me because this means I don't need a 24/25mm viewfinder widget on the hot shoe. I don't like those pesky viewfinders - I think they just get in the way, but YMMV. The fact that it is aperture-preferred means that I change the film speed setting to suit black and white film, usually shooting 400 ISO film at 250.

I use my M5 for its spotmeter, which is really accurate. I only shoot HP5-plus, so I make my metering values accordingly to get white whites, black blacks, etc. I have an M5 with an M6 viewfinder, so I also get the 75mm lens frame, as I use a 75mm Summarit, a great lens IMO. Some people hate the M5, but I don't care. I just shoot with mine.

I also have an M2 with a Tom Abrahamsson Rapidwinder. I love it. I use that as well.

I agree, it's a weird comparison. Sizewise, the MLE and M5 are kinda Mutt and Jeff, but I like and use them both.
 
Not sure I have anything much to add, but my 2¢:

M5 is repairable, CLE not always so.

+1 on the CL as a good compromise between size and repairability.

Wrist strap? Neck Strap? no strap? the 2-lug CL or M5 was extremely annoying to me.


I'd suggest a read through the recent thread about issues with the CLE metering readout (I haven't, but it has been active lately.)
 
I loved my CLE - a nice compact, quick and lightweight camera that felt really good in the hand. I'd pair it with the 40mm Summicron to start - I wouldn't bother with the other C-lenses. If you want other lenses get a 90mm Tele-Elmar and/or a 28mm Elmarit afterwards, and if/when you move to an M-body you can take these with you.
 
janoow10 said:
Don't want to spark any controversy, but what are people's thoughts on the Minolta CLE? Aside from the usual aspects about it not being serviced and difficult to repair, what do people think of it as compared to the M5.
Click to expand...
You mean the M5 is difficult to service and repair? My last CLE I had serviced by a national camera repair shop about 5 years ago for $100. Unless the board is fried it isn't that difficult to repair. Where the rumor started that the CLE was failure prone I don't know, probably by people trying to sell their Leica CL which had a very, very high failure rate.

The CLE is a lovely camera and the 28/40/90 lenses are fantastic. The only user issue with the CLE is the meter doesn't work in manual mode and there is no way to lock in the AE meter. If you want to expose for a portrait in daylight (suject's face is in the shade) you need to meter in AE mode and then switch to manual mode and make the necessary adjustments.
 
Beemermark said:
You mean the M5 is difficult to service and repair? My last CLE I had serviced by a national camera repair shop about 5 years ago for $100. Unless the board is fried it isn't that difficult to repair.
Click to expand...

There is a difference between service (rf adjusment, clean, new foam seals) and repair.
🙂
 
pippy said:
Ah!
Apologies, Michael. I'm pretty new hereabouts and have not yet got a handle on everyone's senses of humour.

I, too, would like to know why the CLE and M5 were singled-out for consideration. M-bayonet and metering apart they have little in common...

Pip.
Click to expand...

No problem, I was hoping to stem the inevitable flow of myriad Leica opinions and experiences by getting back to the OP's basic requirements and intentions. It would appear that I have failed...

Michael
 
Dralowid said:
Pip,

I think I my have been a bit obtuse in my attempt to ask the OP why he had chosen these two cameras. For this I apologise but I'd still like to know.
Click to expand...

I know an odd comparison. But two I've been recommended from a friend. Just trying to figure out, as a starting point, where to even begin. Budget-wise, I can get these two at similar price-ranges, second hand of course. Trying to get myself to start using a rangefinder camera, but I don't have a huge budget.
 
BillBingham2 said:
As a place to start either with serve you well.

What sort of equipment do you have today?

What sort of pictures do you want to take on film?

Lots of other alternatives, why the CLE or M5?

B2 (;->
Click to expand...

I mostly shot digitally. I have a leica camera, but a v-lux at that, not a digital rangefinder. I want to get myself to start and learn to shoot with film, mostly street photography. But I'm pretty experimental in my photography so wanna try my hand at film. Why those two? Firstly, as a starting point recommendation from a few friends. Secondly, price-wise, they're comparable at second hand. I am a beginner at shooting film, so want to delve into it without investing a lot and work my way up the ladder, so to speak..
 
Should have clarified further in initial post. So basically, I want to start to experiment with film, having solely shot digitally before that. I haven't got a huge budget and don't want to invest so much at my current stage or level - beginner. These two cameras had been recommended to me as a starting point with the budget I have. So let's say as a beginner, which camera would you recommend I start with?

In terms of what I'd shoot on film, it'd mostly be street photography (people, portraits etc.)
 
If the point is to begin from zero, it's very simple.
The choice in my view would be the lens you plan to use.
If 40mm lens, or 28mm CLE is the choice.
If 50mm or 35mm, then M5.

Remember that a good lens can be more expensive than the body.
Cheap "for M lens" (Jupiter with adapter) may be a choice but you may prefer Voigtlander or Canon LTM + adapter may be sensible choice.

I used the two (M5 , CLE ) for different types of photos for years, those with other gears.
They are quite reliable.
 
With that info I'd go CLE over an M5 every day and twice on Sunday. The M5 while small, I think you will find the CLE a better street camera. If you can find the 28, 40 and 90 you should be well set for everything you mentioned and more. I remember something about the 28s have white-spot issues, but that might be 10 years ago. All of the bad ones might have washed through the system by now.

There are lots of other options, some better for this, others for that. You can spend a life time figuring out what is best and miss a lot of opportunities. For many folks here it's a journey finding the right camera. Some have many, crazies like me had too many. While I got back into RF with Leicas, I moved to Bessas, back to Leica and then of all things to Nikon. I started out years ago with Nikkormats and Nikon SLRs so they just felt right. Everyone's journey is different. Joe has bounced between so many cameras I've lost count. Keith has a stable stable of cameras, digital and film and moves between them as needed.

Go for it!

But please, please, PLEASE keep us in the loop on your journey. Ask questions, share results, feelings, etc.

Good luck and stay in touch!

B2 (;->
 
I hated the CLE and got rid of it fast. Averaging light meter, no center weighted option. You cannot use light meter if you set exposure manually, battery cover falls off at the worst possible moment spilling the batteries
 
BillBingham2 said:
With that info I'd go CLE over an M5 every day and twice on Sunday. The M5 while small, I think you will find the CLE a better street camera. If you can find the 28, 40 and 90 you should be well set for everything you mentioned and more. I remember something about the 28s have white-spot issues, but that might be 10 years ago. All of the bad ones might have washed through the system by now.

There are lots of other options, some better for this, others for that. You can spend a life time figuring out what is best and miss a lot of opportunities. For many folks here it's a journey finding the right camera. Some have many, crazies like me had too many. While I got back into RF with Leicas, I moved to Bessas, back to Leica and then of all things to Nikon. I started out years ago with Nikkormats and Nikon SLRs so they just felt right. Everyone's journey is different. Joe has bounced between so many cameras I've lost count. Keith has a stable stable of cameras, digital and film and moves between them as needed.

Go for it!

But please, please, PLEASE keep us in the loop on your journey. Ask questions, share results, feelings, etc.

Good luck and stay in touch!

B2 (;->
Click to expand...

Thanks! Definitely agree - don't want to spend ages researching and finding the best or perfect camera; it's more about the experiences and journey that help you determine what's best for you. In my case, going to film is something I'm keen to do this year (as a mini new year's resolution), but it's a little bit daunting having used digital SLRs the whole time, hence don't want to start off on the wrong foot, but I guess it's a whole learning journey.
 
I sort of hate to add on to this expanding thread, and potentially add to the confusion, but there are a couple of things to consider. Pablito (#34) said he hated the CLE partly because of its averaging meter. The M5's meter is essentially a spot meter -- it meters only a small central portion of the frame. You may take right to that, but I think it's not everyone's cup of tea. I'd hate to have you get the M5 and then realize you don't like its metering pattern. On the other hand, the CLE meter is very accurate (but watch for the "dancing LED" problem).

The M5 takes a battery, the 625 mercury 1.35 volt, that's no longer available. There are workarounds, including just having the camera adjusted for a 1.5 volt 625 alkaline, but that costs money, and the alkaline battery's performance over time isn't as reliable as the mercury's. You can find good discussions of how to substitute for the mercury batteries on this forum and elsewhere -- or send me a PM if you like. The 625 alkaline is hard to find except at camera stores these days. The CLE takes two readily available 1.5 volt batteries.

The CLE has one of the very best viewfinders I have ever used, with easily visible 28mm framelines, even for a glasses wearer. The M5's widest frameline is 35mm, though it also goes out to 135mm. This difference may be important for you.

Finally, as others have mentioned, the two cameras are very different in size. You may find the M5 too big, or the CLE too small. I hope you get to try them both out before deciding.

Stephen Gandy's Cameraquest website has excellent profiles of both cameras, if you haven't seen those yet.
 
I like the M5 for it's great ergonomics and feel in hand.
Could write a whole page about the overhanging shutter speed dial alone 😛
The spot meter stands out the most as compared to the CLE.

The M5 spot meter is the easiest of all Rangefinder meters to use.
It's one of the best features of the M5 especially for B+W users.
Place a zone and you get the exposure you want for the frame.
No more exp +/- with AE hoping you understand what the meter will do.
There is a time for AE cameras like the CLE but, when you need control the M5 is gives a better hand at it.
 
Huss said:
There is a difference between service (rf adjusment, clean, new foam seals) and repair.
🙂
Click to expand...
The CLE metering was wonky. Everyone extols that the CLE is failure prone and un-fixable. I sure a very few are, but I've never actually seen multiple threads in the last 40 years with the header "My CLE died and is un-repairable". I have seen hundreds (if not thousands) of threads to the effect hinting the camera is failure prone and everyone knows it can't be repaired. None of these threads are by anybody that actually owned a CLE. The electronics of the CLE are on par with other cameras of the era, which is quite robust (except for the Leica R3,R4, and CL).
 
Satisfied Fool said:
Never had an M5 and never will. I just think it is a very ugly camera, which is enough reason for me not to ever want one.
Click to expand...

Which was the general feeling of professional photographers (the main buyers back then) when Leica brought out the M5 - big and clunky. One of the main reasons that Leica almost went bankrupt. Leica dropped the M5 and brought out the M4-2; a cheapened M4. Another failure back in the day finally rectified with the M4-P (still nothing but an M4).

I've owned a couple of M5s and while loving the meter just couldn't take to them.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Similar threads

gzisis69
Question about Minolta CLE repair options
Replies
12
Views
3K
ThomasN
T
M
Flash Advice for Minolta CLE
Replies
19
Views
2K
matteo29103
M
V
First Rangefinder Suggestions
2 3 4
Replies
78
Views
6K
Godfrey
Godfrey
J
  • Article Article
The Mysterious Leica M5 of 1992: We now know more, but not all!Wetzlar made 20 M5s 17 years after it ceased production, but why?
2 3
Replies
43
Views
3K
38Deardorff
38Deardorff
tortellini_man
first M mount film body
2 3
Replies
56
Views
5K
JohnGellings
J
Back
Top Bottom