Monochrom Issue...

I guess my point is that M9 experience/stats are then relevant, and there is no reason to focus on a very small pool of M Monochrom cameras.
 
john neal said:
Vince,

Glad you are getting your problem sorted on warranty.

I'm now wondering about my MM - using it yesterday in single shot mode, it strted making a shutter sound like a DSLR in motor mode - kept on for nearly a minute with the writing light flashing (no, not in subtle mode). Now it has a horrible metal on metal slap sound every time I make an exposure. Results look OK, but it's a bit worrying.

I guess I will have to carry on until something fails. I'm going to London next month, so may see if I can get a slot booked at the Leica store to talk to one of the guru guys there about it.
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I would not carry on until something fails as that will certainly be at an inconvenient moment.
The way you describe the shutter is simply broken, so send it in.
 
<sigh> Jaap, I have to say that I think you are probably right.

I will look at it tonight and see what it sounds like with a recharged battery (from memory, the battery was 50%+ though, and it was the genuine one that came with the body). If it still sounds wrong I will return it.

Lasse - point noted, I was being a bit slow, sorry :)
 
Vince Lupo said:
Offhand I don't know how many actuations I have on it. As far as the blades not closing properly goes, they look totally fine to me, so I can't really say.

What I can tell you is that if it is indeed a shutter problem, I'm not too happy about it. I just got my 0.95 Noctilux back for a second time from Leica, and now this with the Monochrom.

I use Nikons professionally and not one item has ever had a problem so soon out of the gate (D200 and D700 in the past, D4 and D800 currently, plus a host of lenses). Makes me wonder.....
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I understand what you're going through. I felt with M9 and lens issues with Leica NJ for a year and a half till I finally got everything working and sold it when I could. I have used Nikon professionally for over forty years and in that period not had a total amount of trouble that equaled what I had in a year and a half with my new Leica and lens. Leica service is without a doubt the worst I've seen from a camera company. Leica QC is about as bad as I've seen as well.

Good luck!
 
Just to confirm -- yes the shutter assembly is the same as the M9. Unfortunately NJ doesn't have any at the moment, so they've had to order it from Germany. Hopefully I'll have the camera back within the next week or so.
 
I think their customer service is fine (at least they've been fairly attentive to me). When I contacted them about this issue, for example, they asked me if my camera had been with them recently. It had, but it was for use in calibrating my Noctilux lens, as well as for sensor cleaning. They immediately sent me a pre-paid UPS label, and they'll pay the return shipping as well. So I think they're generally pretty thorough - at least that's been my experience.

As far as the shutter issue goes, I did have a talk with one of the NJ reps regarding the fact that this shutter was 'defective' (his words) so relatively soon out of the gate. I mentioned that I've used Nikon professionally for a number of years and never had any shutter issues with any of the bodies, some of which had over 150,000 actuations. Plus, the issue with my Noctilux also was a point discussed (all three focusing guides had to be replaced, thankfully under warranty). The fact that a $19,000 camera outfit has to go back to the mother ship with relatively little use under its belt is a bit of a frustration, to say the least.

Reminds me a bit of a recent incident I had with our 2007 Porsche Cayman -- one of the key fobs stopped working, and the service manager told me that it would cost over $400 to replace. Apparently the circuitry in the fob can 'go bad' after a number of years. Odd, as my 2006 Jetta has basically the same style of key fob (lock/unlock buttons, trunk button etc), and has been working perfectly for an even longer period of time.

But after all is said and done, I do hope that this Leica kit will be one that I will keep for a number of years, and these recent issues are an anomaly.
 
Vince Lupo said:
I think their customer service is fine (at least they've been fairly attentive to me). When I contacted them about this issue, for example, they asked me if my camera had been with them recently. It had, but it was for use in calibrating my Noctilux lens, as well as for sensor cleaning. They immediately sent me a pre-paid UPS label, and they'll pay the return shipping as well. So I think they're generally pretty thorough - at least that's been my experience.

As far as the shutter issue goes, I did have a talk with one of the NJ reps regarding the fact that this shutter was 'defective' (his words) so relatively soon out of the gate. I mentioned that I've used Nikon professionally for a number of years and never had any shutter issues with any of the bodies, some of which had over 150,000 actuations. Plus, the issue with my Noctilux also was a point discussed (all three focusing guides had to be replaced, thankfully under warranty). The fact that a $19,000 camera outfit has to go back to the mother ship with relatively little use under its belt is a bit of a frustration, to say the least.

Reminds me a bit of a recent incident I had with our 2007 Porsche Cayman -- one of the key fobs stopped working, and the service manager told me that it would cost over $400 to replace. Apparently the circuitry in the fob can 'go bad' after a number of years. Odd, as my 2006 Jetta has basically the same style of key fob (lock/unlock buttons, trunk button etc), and has been working perfectly for an even longer period of time.

But after all is said and done, I do hope that this Leica kit will be one that I will keep for a number of years, and these recent issues are an anomaly.
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Very interesting how leica responded to you. I explained the same that i make a livng with my cameras and have used leica since 68. I asked if there was pro priority service like nikon nps which I'm a member. I asked about loaners and was told no pro priority service and no loaner. My equipment was in for service about half the time I owned it and made as many as 4 trips back on my dime. No prepaid label. I finally had to threaten leica and got my 90 apo replaced.

After all of this and hundreds of dollars in shipping and about 8 months in shop I finally got to one of the managers who said in the future call him or one other person in NJ and they would provide pro service.

After this ordeal and the inability to trust the equipment through a shoot I sold it.

I also bought a new Porsche a few years ago and had nothing but great service from it and my dealer. There were never any major issues and any minor ones were usually taken care of by the dealer even when it went out of warranty. I'm planning on giving myself a new one as a retirement gift very soon. I will not be buying any new digital leica gear again.
 
Well, I tested my shutter again last night:-

1st shot - OK and no nasty metallic noises
2nd shot - shutter goes into "motor drive" mode - single shot selected on the power switch and not in discrete mode. It ran for 8 - 12 "shots". Not good but, even worse -

when I turned the power switch to "off" the shutter started motoring again. It ran for a minute or so and I though I would risk taking the lens off to have a look. The blades were not opening, just jumping a bit. The sound was very similar to an auto-everything SLR rewinding a film, or in slow motor drive mode. Anyway, I couldn't stop it, so it was a battery out job.

Now, do I return it to the store (Classic Camera) or direct to Leica in Mayfair? I think a couple of phone calls are in order.

I have to say that this is the first issue I have had with a new Leica camera, but I'm still miffed that a 3-month old premium product has just plain died on me :( I'm just glad that I wasn't on the holiday of a lifetime, or shooting something important / irreplaceable.
 
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Wow that is rather disturbing -- definitely get it to Leica while it's still under warranty. Hope these incidents aren't indicative of more widespread problems.
 
It does not occur very often, certainly not widespread, but it is a known problem.
john neal said:
Well, I tested my shutter again last night:-

1st shot - OK and no nasty metallic noises
2nd shot - shutter goes into "motor drive" mode - single shot selected on the power switch and not in discrete mode. It ran for 8 - 12 "shots". Not good but, even worse -

when I turned the power switch to "off" the shutter started motoring again. It ran for a minute or so and I though I would risk taking the lens off to have a look. The blades were not opening, just jumping a bit. The sound was very similar to an auto-everything SLR rewinding a film, or in slow motor drive mode. Anyway, I couldn't stop it, so it was a battery out job.

Now, do I return it to the store (Classic Camera) or direct to Leica in Mayfair? I think a couple of phone calls are in order.

I have to say that this is the first issue I have had with a new Leica camera, but I'm still miffed that a 3-month old premium product has just plain died on me :( I'm just glad that I wasn't on the holiday of a lifetime, or shooting something important / irreplaceable.
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As Jaap says, it is rare on the M9, MM or 240 - it is well known on the M8 range, probably due to being under more tension (1/8000 top speed).

It would seem to be a common shutter to many Leica bodies, including the R8/9 where it hardly ever fails - joint venture Leica / Copal product.

I have arranged to have it returned to the factory (no cost to me) for repair / replacement (won't know until they inspect it). Apparently, the repair section is busy at the moment, and even though this is a relatively simple job I could be without it for up to 6 weeks :eek:

Oh well, at least it will be done under warranty - apparently my dealer is not an authorised Leica agent, so it's easier & quicker to deal with the Leica store in London as the 2-year warranty applies regardless of point of purchase.

I will report back when I know what the factory do to fix it, etc. For now, I'm waiting for the return label.
 
Classic Camera (Pied Bull Yard?) not an authorised agent? Always thought they were...maybe they lost that status when the Leica store opened.
 
I think they may have been at one time - certainly in 2003 when I bought my MP there they were - I got the full Passport package with it.

I have confirmed with Leica that they are not an authorised dealer, and do not even send repairs to Leica. The thinking is that they buy their Leica stock somewhere other than from Leica. Given the nature of the Leica worldwide warranty, owners can deal direct with Leica for claims. Quite how they would deal with a Passport issue is unknown.

Authorised dealers in London (as far as I recall), are Richard Caplan, Red Dot and RG Lewis, as well as the Leica store (of course)
 
I have nothing but praise for Red Dot, and a good place to sell too. Ivor has been around the Leica thing for years and years.
 
Vince,

Sorry to hear about your problems, and I wish you the best of luck.

I've had my MM for nearly two years without any issue. Hopefully your difficulty was just a fluke. My Monochrom is starting to get a patina from heavy use and the vulcanite is worn down in one area due to my use of a grip.

Cal
 
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