sanmich
Veteran
I know nothing in sales or marketting, but...
in the last months I am loosely following some items of interest on ebay and wonder if certain dealers have been able to artificially control their market, buying all of them at reasonable prices, even if they have lots of them in stock, just to bring their price up...
try for example "Leica SYOOM", or "Hexanon 50mm 2.4".
It looks like if these are small market items (rare sellers, rare buyers), and a very few dealers are able to literally set their price where they want, no matter where the regular market equilibrium would have set it.
in the last months I am loosely following some items of interest on ebay and wonder if certain dealers have been able to artificially control their market, buying all of them at reasonable prices, even if they have lots of them in stock, just to bring their price up...
try for example "Leica SYOOM", or "Hexanon 50mm 2.4".
It looks like if these are small market items (rare sellers, rare buyers), and a very few dealers are able to literally set their price where they want, no matter where the regular market equilibrium would have set it.
rxmd
May contain traces of nut
For rare items eBay probably isn't a place to get good deals. I'm not sure if it ever was. Rather than the equivalent of the $1 box at the local garage sale, it's more the equivalent of the bulletproof storefromt of a high-end dealer.
These stores (Breguet Camera, SK Camera, the various other incarnations of Boris Yamshchik's enterprise etc.) cater more to collectors anyway, who are willing to pay those prices. And those people don't click "Buy it now" at an auction, they send an e-mail or call the shop. If you're not a collector, you have a long wait ahead of you. That said, there is probably no reason to want a Leica SYOOM or a 50/f2.4 Hexanon unless you're collector.
Of course the stores are buying and reselling stuff (there was a guy on a German forum tracking Rolleis across their eBay trajectory by serial number), but I don't think they are really deliberately monopolizing it. It's more that the stuff is really rare and the Breguet Camera etc. auctions are the only ones you see. There is no market equilibrium if there are too few sellers and there hasn't been a buyer in a month (as for SYOOMs). That said, there are currently seven 50/f2.4 Hexanons by four sellers, not really a monopoly. None of them are cheap, but maybe you're simply looking at stuff that isn't cheap.
These stores (Breguet Camera, SK Camera, the various other incarnations of Boris Yamshchik's enterprise etc.) cater more to collectors anyway, who are willing to pay those prices. And those people don't click "Buy it now" at an auction, they send an e-mail or call the shop. If you're not a collector, you have a long wait ahead of you. That said, there is probably no reason to want a Leica SYOOM or a 50/f2.4 Hexanon unless you're collector.
Of course the stores are buying and reselling stuff (there was a guy on a German forum tracking Rolleis across their eBay trajectory by serial number), but I don't think they are really deliberately monopolizing it. It's more that the stuff is really rare and the Breguet Camera etc. auctions are the only ones you see. There is no market equilibrium if there are too few sellers and there hasn't been a buyer in a month (as for SYOOMs). That said, there are currently seven 50/f2.4 Hexanons by four sellers, not really a monopoly. None of them are cheap, but maybe you're simply looking at stuff that isn't cheap.
santela
Established
When I saw the title I though you are gonna be talking about Leica...
rbelyell
Well-known
yup, thats what i was thinkin'.
Robert Lai
Well-known
I personally try to avoid ebay except for the most unusual stuff (e.g. a 33mm push-on lens hood for my Kodak Tourist 1).
I find the best deals just by schmoozing with other people. I asked a person on photo_net about his push on lens hood, and he mentioned that he was getting rid of his cameras. So, I ended up with a very, very clean Agfa Super Isolette for $350.
I told Clarence Gass that I was interested in Leica thread mount cameras, and he found a LNIB SYOOM in his back room, which he sold to me at a very fair price. He also had a LNIB, fully serviced Kodak Retina II (with hood). But, I was not interested in more 35mm cameras at the time, so I passed on it.
I find the best deals just by schmoozing with other people. I asked a person on photo_net about his push on lens hood, and he mentioned that he was getting rid of his cameras. So, I ended up with a very, very clean Agfa Super Isolette for $350.
I told Clarence Gass that I was interested in Leica thread mount cameras, and he found a LNIB SYOOM in his back room, which he sold to me at a very fair price. He also had a LNIB, fully serviced Kodak Retina II (with hood). But, I was not interested in more 35mm cameras at the time, so I passed on it.
sanmich
Veteran
No, I just want a really good 50 in screw mount and to try shooting faster my IIIF+VC CS 28 as a very small street combo..
Sorry for that. Maybe I'm not that bad in marketing after all :angel:
rxmd
May contain traces of nut
Hm, are you sure you have exhausted your options? A collapsible Summicron 50/f2 would be faster, just as small, still really good and cheaper (there's one for $495 on eBay). A Nokton 50/f1.5 would be faster and probably better (if not as small) - around $600 new and there's one for $420 in the classifieds. A Skopar 50/f2.5 would be small and reasonably priced (if not as fast) - $600 new and around $400 used. A Heliar 50/f2 would be fast, good, still somewhat collapsible and costs $800 new.
How much are you ready to pay for that really good, small, fast, cheap 50? If those are two expensive just how large can it get? Is a 50/f1.8 Canon too big? An Industar-61?
celluloidprop
Well-known
The market for oddball Leica collectibles isn't large enough for someone to lay out money above the market price to try and move the market.
sanmich
Veteran
You are right, there are other options, and I tried a few of them.
Let's say that I was looking for modern glass.
The Nokton has been tempting but looks too big. The CS has a bad rep of poor QC (too many different opinions over the web). I tried a Heliar that er...didn't live to the legend.
The hex just seems tempting, that's all (and Roland keeps raving about it
). It's not that I NEED any of these, or I would have bought them. I am just tempted to try them, and I'm wondering about the reality of the prices as found on the web, and how much could be the result of speculations of a limited number of dealers.
Gabriel M.A.
My Red Dot Glows For You
Yes: Leica has a monopoly on Leica products, since they're the only ones who sell Leica products to distributors. Unlike Nikon, which only sells Nikon products to distributors.