willie_901
Veteran
Well, somebody, somewhere chose made a bad choice even though the number of thin (required due to the M mount) yet efficient IR filter materials was limited.
I sort of remember the original, problematic IR filter was either a bit thinner, more effective or less expensive than the alternate sources that are not sensitive to water. These details were painfully revealed on another Forum about 10-11 months ago.
The sensor manufacturer may not have selected the filter. They certainly did not manufacture the filter material. I don't even know who exactly assembles and tests the entire sensor unit. I think it is impossible to assign fault as these details are likely proprietary.
I sort of remember the original, problematic IR filter was either a bit thinner, more effective or less expensive than the alternate sources that are not sensitive to water. These details were painfully revealed on another Forum about 10-11 months ago.
The sensor manufacturer may not have selected the filter. They certainly did not manufacture the filter material. I don't even know who exactly assembles and tests the entire sensor unit. I think it is impossible to assign fault as these details are likely proprietary.
Jubb Jubb
Well-known
you're lucky, camera clinic took 3 months to replace my M9P sensor. But they cleaned it.
make sure you check all your setting when you get it back. I ended up shooting jpegs my first shoot and had to change all my menu settings back to how i had them to start with.
make sure you check all your setting when you get it back. I ended up shooting jpegs my first shoot and had to change all my menu settings back to how i had them to start with.
xavoy
Established
Are they using the sensors with the new coatings yet, or are we still on the old coating stock?
ChrisN
Striving
Update: received notice that the camera has been repaired. They asked me to confirm my address for returning the camera, and I have received tracking information by email.
So that was just over six weeks in their workshop. I should see the camera in a few days.
So that was just over six weeks in their workshop. I should see the camera in a few days.
back alley
IMAGES
just in time for those holiday snaps...
nightfly
Well-known
Personally I love the sensor and there's no other camera I'd rather have so I'd buy another used M9 and roll the dice again.
3 months at Leica but I've got essentially a new camera for the half price. Frustrating but I can't really complain too much as they did it all for free. If they had floated me a loaner while it was gone I'd have zero complaints.
3 months at Leica but I've got essentially a new camera for the half price. Frustrating but I can't really complain too much as they did it all for free. If they had floated me a loaner while it was gone I'd have zero complaints.
uhoh7
Veteran
Well, my question is, how many of these replacements are actually the new generation sensor?
I'm not even considering to send mine in until I hear the new sensors are in stock in NJ, and the backlog is caught up. But I don't have sure signs of the issues as yet.
I'm not even considering to send mine in until I hear the new sensors are in stock in NJ, and the backlog is caught up. But I don't have sure signs of the issues as yet.
sepiareverb
genius and moron
Well, the 15th has come and gone with no word from NJ. I'll try them tomorrow by phone, but I suspect they'll be closed all week. The holidays have snuck up on me once again.
I too really do like the files the camera makes - the color rendition especially, and appreciate the low ISO, I'm shooting a roll of Fuji C200 right now and that's almost too fast for me.
I too really do like the files the camera makes - the color rendition especially, and appreciate the low ISO, I'm shooting a roll of Fuji C200 right now and that's almost too fast for me.
uhoh7
Veteran
They have been putting the older one on for years. Many don't want to wait. I think it's a different policy in this regard at the various service centers.
But maybe they are at the point where all replaced sensors are the latest gen, which would be nice to hear.
derekfulmer
Member
Are they able to replace M9/p/me ccd sensors with cmos sensors? Seems that would be a good solution if so
ChrisN
Striving
The camera arrived this morning, very well packed inside the pelican-style case I sent it in, and further wrapped in plenty of bubble wrap and a cardboard box.
The paperwork says it should have received a new-generation sensor, so I'll be interested to see if I can note any difference in the colour rendering (which I really liked in the original).
I'm also interested to note that the shutter count has increased by 88 exposures during its absence, so it looks like they did a good bit of testing.
I didn't note what software version the camera was running before I sent it off, but it now shows version 1.204. Is that a recent release?
Overall I'm very happy with the way Leica has dealt with this challenge, and with the work of their local representatives.
Now - back to a bit of testing and fun with my favorite digital camera.
The paperwork says it should have received a new-generation sensor, so I'll be interested to see if I can note any difference in the colour rendering (which I really liked in the original).
I'm also interested to note that the shutter count has increased by 88 exposures during its absence, so it looks like they did a good bit of testing.
I didn't note what software version the camera was running before I sent it off, but it now shows version 1.204. Is that a recent release?
Overall I'm very happy with the way Leica has dealt with this challenge, and with the work of their local representatives.
Now - back to a bit of testing and fun with my favorite digital camera.
Darthfeeble
But you can call me Steve
1.202 is what I show on mine and I installed that a month or so ago.
ChrisN
Striving
Thanks Darth and Moof - I really haven't been keeping up with all the latest news and tweaks in the Leica world. It's funny but the M8 didn't interest me at all; the M9 only caught my eye in the -P version, and I have no interest in the latest versions.
So from the firmware version it confirms I have the next-generation sensor. OK. I hope they also gave me back the 25% of the battery charge they took away with an earlier firmware upgrade.
So from the firmware version it confirms I have the next-generation sensor. OK. I hope they also gave me back the 25% of the battery charge they took away with an earlier firmware upgrade.
uhoh7
Veteran
Yes that's what I'm now reading everywhere also, if you have 1.204, it's the new sensor.
jaapv
RFF Sponsoring Member.
1.2.04 will work on an old sensor as well. However, 1.2.02 will not work on the new sensor.
The only tweak to the firmware they made was to add new colour handling when the firmware detects the new sensor.
The only tweak to the firmware they made was to add new colour handling when the firmware detects the new sensor.
ChrisN
Striving
Thanks Jaapv.
willie_901
Veteran
An informed buyer would ask to see the replacement paper work from Leica. I would hope anyone who knows about the firmware change would be savvy enough to request copies of the replacement documentation.
ChrisN
Striving
1.202 is the latest software version currently available on the Leica official website. https://us.leica-camera.com/Service...&subcategory=93713&type=108942&language=93871
I guess only Leica can tell you (from their records) whether a particular camera has been upgraded to the new sensor. And if not, then the (old) sensor would be replaced if it started to show the corrosion problem, even if you are not the original owner (as in my case).
I guess only Leica can tell you (from their records) whether a particular camera has been upgraded to the new sensor. And if not, then the (old) sensor would be replaced if it started to show the corrosion problem, even if you are not the original owner (as in my case).
dreamsandart
Well-known
great customer service
great customer service
I know a lot of folks would like nothing better for Leica to stumble and fall [for whatever odd reasoning] and the IR filter problem on the M8 and sensor problem on the M9 gave them immense pleasure and justification for disliking a digital Leica. (the 240 took care of any issues and are refined but then the ‘high priced critiques’ have that point to use)
As for me, I am very happy to have a good camera that takes my M-series lenses, and handles in a way that made the transition from film to digital with my Leica glass very easy.
Leica has handled the sensor issue very well for me. Sent my M9 into have a sensor cleaning and was informed they could do a replacement. Two weeks later my 5 year old camera was back in my hands; replaced sensor, replaced camera cover (which I thought I wouldn’t like but find a better grip), and a general clean and total adjustments. Its basically a new camera, and at no charge for any of the work, parts, or shipping. This was last year and the replaced sensor was still the old style, which actually is fine with me. If and when it needs to be done again I will again have a total CLA done on a 6+ year old camera at no charge. Thank you Leica Japan.
I’ve thought of replacing the M9 over the past few years with a newer 240 or MM, but in the end I still find it a very satisfying camera to use. The files have a look I like, it handles fine if not perfect (no its not a speed demon in anyway [except with its RF focusing ;-], but I work ‘slow’, shot to shot and with lower ‘film-like’ ISO), and at the price I could sell it for I may as well enjoy it.
In a way I feel pretty good about the fact I have this camera on the old side of digital technology that still can be an everyday camera and produce very nice results. Its been very dependable, and except for some card issues at the beginning it hasn’t miss a step. Yes, the shutter release isn’t as smooth as my film M-series, it doesn’t make the quietest of shutter sounds during and after, and writes to file are slow, but over-all it still has that Leica feel to me, and this is coming from a diehard Leica user of 40+ years.
So free sensor replacement and camera adjustments, a new 1 year warranty, and all done on a 6 year old camera regardless of original or second hand ownership. I understand some folks had reliability issues and complaints (not me), but I find this to be an excellent example of taking care of their customer base.
great customer service
I know a lot of folks would like nothing better for Leica to stumble and fall [for whatever odd reasoning] and the IR filter problem on the M8 and sensor problem on the M9 gave them immense pleasure and justification for disliking a digital Leica. (the 240 took care of any issues and are refined but then the ‘high priced critiques’ have that point to use)
As for me, I am very happy to have a good camera that takes my M-series lenses, and handles in a way that made the transition from film to digital with my Leica glass very easy.
Leica has handled the sensor issue very well for me. Sent my M9 into have a sensor cleaning and was informed they could do a replacement. Two weeks later my 5 year old camera was back in my hands; replaced sensor, replaced camera cover (which I thought I wouldn’t like but find a better grip), and a general clean and total adjustments. Its basically a new camera, and at no charge for any of the work, parts, or shipping. This was last year and the replaced sensor was still the old style, which actually is fine with me. If and when it needs to be done again I will again have a total CLA done on a 6+ year old camera at no charge. Thank you Leica Japan.
I’ve thought of replacing the M9 over the past few years with a newer 240 or MM, but in the end I still find it a very satisfying camera to use. The files have a look I like, it handles fine if not perfect (no its not a speed demon in anyway [except with its RF focusing ;-], but I work ‘slow’, shot to shot and with lower ‘film-like’ ISO), and at the price I could sell it for I may as well enjoy it.
In a way I feel pretty good about the fact I have this camera on the old side of digital technology that still can be an everyday camera and produce very nice results. Its been very dependable, and except for some card issues at the beginning it hasn’t miss a step. Yes, the shutter release isn’t as smooth as my film M-series, it doesn’t make the quietest of shutter sounds during and after, and writes to file are slow, but over-all it still has that Leica feel to me, and this is coming from a diehard Leica user of 40+ years.
So free sensor replacement and camera adjustments, a new 1 year warranty, and all done on a 6 year old camera regardless of original or second hand ownership. I understand some folks had reliability issues and complaints (not me), but I find this to be an excellent example of taking care of their customer base.
jaapv
RFF Sponsoring Member.
No to the first, but as Leica when servicing a camera with an old sensor uses 1.2.04 to update the firmware it is possible to mislead an unwary buyer. However, the camera would have had to be in Leica service, so the seller must have the relevant paperwork.