My new Zorki 4K - can it be saved?

[fymmot]

Hello all!
I want to begin by saying that this forum has been an awesome resource for me ever since I first got the idea into my head that I wanted, nay needed, a FSU rangefinder. I have very limited experience with film photography and zero with rangefinders but I have been fascinated with Leicas and rangefinders in general for quite some time. I just never figured they'd be affordable for a student like me.. How wrong I was! Last week I decided that it was time and I bid on a FSU camera on ebay. A beautiful Zorki 4K with a Jupiter 8 arrived 3 days ago in perfect condition.

Now I think I have ruined it, before even having loaded my first roll of film. Despite all warnings and despite all good advice here and elsewhere, I'm fairly certain that I accidently changed the shutter speed without cocking the shutter. I don't know how it happened but I suspect that's what it is. I was going through the manual and testing all the speeds with the back of the camera open. When I was testing a slow speed (can't remember which one) and released the shutter, the curtain stayed half-open. I cocked it once more and released the shutter again and the curtain closed, but ever since then the shutter does not react anymore. The cocking lever is locked as if the shutter is cocked (not sure if it is) but nothing happens when I press the shutter release. I can unlock the lever by switching the rewind switch near the shutter release button to Bulb mode and then back to normal. The lever then lets me do one more "cocking motion" and then locks again in the same position. The shutter time dial does not move like it normally does.

What do experts like yourselves say? Is the race lost or is there still hope for this rangefinder newbie? I've been looking through every piece of advice I could find in every thread in here but to no avail. I would be heartbroken to learn I managed to turn this beauty into a paperweight before even shooting one roll with it.

Yours in desperation,
Tommy

 

[softshock]

I've accidentally changed shutter speed before winding on in a Leica III once or twice without incident, so I don't think it is a case where it is guaranteed to mess anything up.
Your Zorki may very well have already been that way. It could be a matter of adjusting the shutter tension or the brake being worn. There is a way to text if they are opening in sync, and if they are, try to work with the speeds which do work. It isn't really worth the repair. If all else fails, I'll sell you my Zorki 4 😉

 

[fymmot]

Yeah well if I can't fix it I'll definitely buy another one. I'd hate to do it but I would 🙂

Is there anything I can do right now that I haven't thought of yet? At the moment the shutter doesn't release at all, at any speed, and the shutter speed dial doesn't spin when I use the cocking lever.

Is there something that could be done by removing the top cover and tamper with the shutter speeds dial?

 

[batterytypehah!]

It's beyond my experience to diagnose but I'll venture this: it's not very likely that you turned it into a paperweight. Unless you use force, changing the shutter speed at the wrong time does not cause damage. You just don't know what speed you're firing at, or at worst the camera will lock up.

I'd say give the resident experts time to chime in before you take anything apart. RFF member wolves3012 is very knowledgeable and helpful, and posts often. He's in the UK though so probably fast asleep at the moment.

Good luck and welcome to RFF, by the way.

 

[batterytypehah!]

Bump. This doesn't seem to be resolved yet.

 

[oftheherd]

I'll give you another bump to hope someone can help. I have read several times discussions on this issue, and from recollection, often it isn't too hard to clear.

In the meantime, you might look at this thread to see of if looks like it might help. http://www.rangefinderforum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=9983

If not, google for "zorki shutter stuck" and see if you find anything.

Good luck.

 

[Grytpype]

Some more threads that might help: -

http://www.rangefinderforum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=44840

http://www.rangefinderforum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=64087

http://www.rangefinderforum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=98664

 

[wolves3012]

This is a tough one to diagnose, given that you don't know whether the shutter is actually cocked and not releasing, or isn't cocked and won't! Firstly, can you see which side of the frame the metal curtain laths are at present?

 

[fymmot]

Thank you all for your help and sorry for not returning to this thread sooner! The problem is unfortunately not yet resolved.

I read the threads you guys recommended and it does seem like they describe the same problem I'm having. However my camera is a 4K with the advance lever and since it locks in place, I wasn't able to follow the advice given in those threads on how to cock the shutter manually.

I really couldn't tell which side of the frame the metal curtains laths are on, so that won't help either. Sorry I can't give you more relevant information :/

I'm not really sure how to proceed so I'm considering having it repaired by a specialist here in Stockholm. Probably will cost me more than what I paid for the camera itself though...

 

[Celesta]

I am experiencing exactly the same problem with my recently acquired Zorki-4. I CLA'd it after the shutter stopped working, checked the speed mechanism was set correctly and all, but the shutter just doesn't do anything. It happened after I rewinded the first roll of film. I heard it is not an uncommon issue with Zorkis, but I cannot find any solution 🙁 I will keep searching and will share the findings.

 

[stevebrot]

I am experiencing exactly the same problem with my recently acquired Zorki-4. I CLA'd it after the shutter stopped working, checked the speed mechanism was set correctly and all, but the shutter just doesn't do anything. It happened after I rewinded the first roll of film. I heard it is not an uncommon issue with Zorkis, but I cannot find any solution 🙁 I will keep searching and will share the findings.

Make sure your turned the rewind release "collar" back fully counter-clockwise?


Steve

 

[AK66]

I had a similar thing happened to my new 4K after I rewound the film first time. Even though I never changed the shutter before winding. The curtain just stuck half-way and then everything just jammed. But I managed to turn everything back to normal. Like it was mentioned before by other posters, most likely, there's nothing wrong with the camera. It's just built that way.
First of all, don't force anything. Then, read carefully in the Butkus's manual part 5.6 - "camera unloading" paragraph e). It is kind of complicated. I read both russian and english manuals and in this section they're addressing this particular situation.
I had to read several times in both languages to fully understand what to turn where. But finally everything came back to normal. Hope this will help.

 

[BradM]

fymmot, if all else fails, Oleg Kalyavin,http://www.okvintagecamera.com/index.html may be able to help with the repair. Sending the camera to him in Russia maybe cheaper than your Stockholm repairer - and Oleg knows what he is doing with Soviet cameras.
His prices are on his site.

I'm debating whether to send him my Kiev 4A or not. It will cost me about $60 in postage (forward and back) + $50 to repair - and Oleg has Kiev bodies for sale at $50+$22 postage. Hmm....

 

[wolves3012]

I am experiencing exactly the same problem with my recently acquired Zorki-4. I CLA'd it after the shutter stopped working, checked the speed mechanism was set correctly and all, but the shutter just doesn't do anything. It happened after I rewinded the first roll of film. I heard it is not an uncommon issue with Zorkis, but I cannot find any solution 🙁 I will keep searching and will share the findings.

Check that the rewind-release has been re-set properly first. Also, check that the shutter button isn't in its locked position - it's quite common the have it lock down after using the rewind/advance collar.

 

[dll927]

No one has raised this issue, but what is a "new" Zorki 4A? By now, no such thing exists. I take it you mean you just acquired it.

The 4's were supposed to have been the model of which the largest number were made, so they are more plentiful than some of the others. If you read enough of these forums, you will find discussions by daring people who take it upon themselves to repair their own cameras. So a spare body or two might not hurt.

 

[fymmot]

fymmot, if all else fails, Oleg Kalyavin,http://www.okvintagecamera.com/index.html may be able to help with the repair. Sending the camera to him in Russia maybe cheaper than your Stockholm repairer - and Oleg knows what he is doing with Soviet cameras.
His prices are on his site.

I'm debating whether to send him my Kiev 4A or not. It will cost me about $60 in postage (forward and back) + $50 to repair - and Oleg has Kiev bodies for sale at $50+$22 postage. Hmm....

Thanks for the advice. I did indeed have it repaired in Stockholm and it was indeed expensive, so I should probably have contacted Oleg in the first place to get a proper CLA. It's working now though, and I've shot 15 or so rolls with it since, inb Paris and here in Stockholm. I'm incedibly happy with the camera all-in-all and it's a very special feeling shooting with it, especially when I shoot street - something that I've never experienced with non-rangefinders.


It is interesting to hear about others having the same problem, and it being a different issue from the classic "shutter rewind and speed dial" problem. I could have sworn that I did everything right, so it's nice to know that my memory isn't faulty in addition to my lack of judgement... 🙂

 

[john341]

I have a Zorki 4k which did a similar thing. It turned out that the rewind collar had been moved slightly halting the camera mechanism. I removed the film and resetting the collar righted the problem. Hope it works for you Good Luck!