Need Help Taking the Plunge

[sooner]

Hello All. I'm a newbie to rangefinders and this site, and am really enjoying my recent purchases: Canon GIII QL17, Konica Auto S2, and Yashica 35 GSN. These are nice cameras and cheap. I love the rangefinder focusing system and taking nice shots at 1/15th of a second. But I am also an equipment nerd with a compulsive urge to acquire. I know you all know what this feels like.

That brings me to this forum, and I may be opening a hornet's nest, but are Bessa's really THAT good? I'm tempted by CameraQuest's Bessa L and 25 lens as a barely affordable start, but am concerned. People report shutter and maybe build problems? Also, how much better are the lenses compared to the rangefinders mentioned above, or my Konica SLR lineup? "Better" is subjective, but how would resolution and contrast compare, especially to my Konica SLR lenses?

I know this sounds like heresy on this forum, but I need to decide if now is the time for me to take the plunge before a June trip to Europe (where the wide lenses would be nice). Also, I fully acknowledge not being a great photographer.

Any help sorting it out would help me. Thanks in advance.

 

[SolaresLarrave]

Hello, John!

I've never owned a Bessa, but it was my holding one in my hands that prompted me to abandon my SLR in favor of these cameras.

Now... on the minus side, Bessas have the reputation of coming with their rangefinders off when you get the body out of the box. However, once corrected, they are reliable cameras and excellent performers. Besides, their price has no equal. If not, ask around, write down what experienced Bessa owners can tell you, and just enjoy carrying it around for a while, learning how to use it in a pinch (you don't want Europe to be a "learning" experience away from the dealers who own you a warranty!).

Good luck and welcome to the forum!

 

[FrankS]

One thing that I can say for certain is that a Bessa L will not suffer from rangefinder misalingment problems! If you desire a wide angle lens such as a 25mm, you can't beat the Bessa L/25mm Snapshot combo!

 

[rover]

Hi John, sounds like you will fit right in around here.

Let me ask a question, this compulsive equipment nerd thing, at some point in time are you going to look at a table with 7 or 8 cameras on it and then think, I should have just bought a....(insert dream camera name here)? Yes or no, we have both types here, you may want to take this into account when planning your next purchase.

For me, I have sold a Himatic 9, Yashica GSN, Konica Auto S3 a Bessa R, two R2s and an R3a and finally bought a Leica. I really didn't take that much of or any financial loss in all my buying and selling, and had some fun with it, but had I just saved the money up front and bought the Leica right off the bat I may have been better off. (or maybe not?)

The Bessas, very nice cameras. The L is a little of a strange duck in that it does not have a viewfinder and you have to scale focus the lens, but most who use this combo find it fun to use. The CV 25mm lens is pretty sharp, a very capable lens. An R, R2a or R3a all avalable new right now would be better all around choices if that is what you are looking for. Buy from a reputable source like Cameraquest and you should have a good experience with your purchase.

 

[jlw]

It's true, if you start right out buying a nice new Leica and three or four lenses, you won't have to wonder, "Should I have bought a more expensive camera?"

Instead you'll get to wonder, "Should I have used that money to buy a good used car, or make a down payment on a house, or invest in some mutual funds?"

I think it makes a lot of sense to start out inexpensively, the way you have, and see whether or not you really like the RF style of photography. Give it a year or so before you start buying anything that represents a serious chunk of money for you. (I know there are people on this forum who would consider the price of a new Leica and four lenses to be pocket money, but I don't want to talk about them right now.)

 

[sooner]

Rover, to answer your question, one reason I'm contemplating a Bessa is similar posts where people said, "I should have just gotten the Bessa." I enjoy collecting and using different cameras, especially when they're so cheap (bought my S2 for $20). The Bessa L is very cheap, too, but of course the lenses are not. I am on a budget, for now, but don't really want to lug my SLR around Europe, especially given my preference for wide angle shots. I'm mostly wondering if the lens quality will be noticeably better than my Konica SLR kit, which features some very nice and affordable glass. Or am I just spending the money to acquire a fun kit with similar growth potential (i.e. all the Leica glass)?

 

[rover]

You are limited to wide angle lenses with the L, but it sounds like that is what you are looking for. The quality of the CV lenses are very good.

So, Europe, with a Bessa L and 25. Have a look at Bertram's gallery, look for his Timeless photos and many others. He uses this combo quite a bit. I feel safe saying that you will like what you see.

http://www.rangefinderforum.com/photopost/showgallery.php/ppuser/236/cat/500

Again, not having a viewfinder or focusing mechanism the L is not as versitile as other cameras, but you will find it very capable and Bertram proves that the quality of the CV 25mm lens is very good.

 

[SolaresLarrave]

Boy... do I feel dumb. I don't know why I assumed the question was about a Bessa R.

What are you waiting, John? This is a sure winner!

 

[Huck Finn]

Sooner, I see absolutely no reason for you to buy a Bessa unless you are dissatisfied with something about your existing camera arsenal. I would suggest that you stick with what you have until you come up against its limits; then you'll know what you need. If you don't find that you're limited by the equipment you have, why buy anything else?

You ask if the Voigtlander lenses that Cosina makes for the Bessa cameras would be better, how their resolution & contrast would compare. The funny thing is that as you read rangefinder forums like this one, you'll find that there are a lot of people prefer the look of lower contrast lenses from the '50s, '60s, & '70s to the look of sharper, higher contrast modern lenses. You already have lenses from the '60s & '70s on your cameras, so you're there! Konica knows how to make first rate lenses, so I doubt that you will find Voigtlander lenses to be better . . . although maybe different. Generally speaking, RF lenses seem to be better than SLR lenses at their maximum aperture - that is when comparing prime lenses from each system. However, that shouldn't matter much with the 25/4 since it doesn't have a very wide maximum aperture.

It seems to me that your dilemma is whether to carry 2 cameras (one of your RFs & a Bessa L + 25/4) or one SLR with 2 lenses. I'm not sure that the RF set-up will be any more compact, so there should be other reasons for making this choice.

Since you are an admitted "equipment nerd with a compulsive need to acquire" (Welcome to the club.), I think that you would be better served by saving your money until you can afford an interchangeable lens body that you can actually build a system around rather than the L which you will in all likelihood eventually abandon anyway . . . unless you want, in effect, a second fixed focal length camera with a wide angle lens.

My 2 cents . . .

 

[sooner]

Thanks to all for your comments, but especially to Huck Finn, who hit the nail on the head. It sounds like I should stick with my Konica this time around, until I can afford the R2 and a couple of lenses. I would like a nice wide lens on a fairly quiet body, but I have a 21mm and 28mm for the Konica. Or maybe I'll just take the Canonet and be happy.

 

[SolaresLarrave]

Something to be said about the Canonet: excellent travel camera. I took mine to Cartagena, Colombia. Talk about hot, humid weather! However, the camera took it in stride and, the best part of it, nothing failed. And the lens is wide enough for a shot free from distortions.

This time I didn't assume. I read your post very carefully too...

Where in Europe are you going?

 

[sooner]

Solares, I did not make my earlier post clear, should have said Bessa L which is really what I was thinking (because the R2, which seems much sturdier than the R) is out of my price range. We're visiting Wupperthal, Germany, Denmark, and Oslo, and hopefully some of western Norway and the beautiful fjords. So wide angle might be nice for street and building shots, and nice vistas of the coastline.

 

[Huck Finn]

Wow! What a great trip, Sooner. Should be some change from the Oklahoma plains. Enjoy the trip & some nice photo ops. 🙂

 

[Trius]

Thanks to all for your comments, but especially to Huck Finn, who hit the nail on the head. It sounds like I should stick with my Konica this time around, until I can afford the R2 and a couple of lenses. I would like a nice wide lens on a fairly quiet body, but I have a 21mm and 28mm for the Konica. Or maybe I'll just take the Canonet and be happy.

John: If it were me, I would stick with the Konica kit because you know it and it covers a slightly more useful range than just having the Bessa L and 25mm Skopar. I don't have a Bessa, but I have multiple fixed lens RFs (mostly Oly, with a Minolta and Konica thrown in), and I really like using them but of course don't have the wider 28mm and 21mm focal lengths, as I do on my OMs. I'd love to have a 28mm or 24mm fixed lens RF, but those are close to non-existent.

I figure that at some point I will get a Bessa R-x and a range of 3 lenses, but will not give up my fixed lens RFs. Different purpose.

Trius

 

[MCTuomey]

Sooner, welcome to this forum. I'm new to RF, like yourself, and own two fixed lens RFs and an R2A. I bought the R2A to put together a kit that covered at least two RF focal lengths - 35mm and 75mm - because I like shooting in the 35-40mm and 75-90mm ranges. A recognized need. But I am very happy clooping around with my Canonet or Hi-Matic which are my have-at-all-times cameras. (Mine are in good working order.) I like the character of the Canon 40/1.7 as well as the Hi-Matic's 40mm and would be very comfortable shooting holiday pictures with either camera vs my R2A. There's real joy and challenge in the normals and wides, I think, when you're travelling. Getting close, right in the mix, keeping everything simple. Unless you have to have something outside of the 35-40mm FL, I wouldn't jump for the Bessa yet. The urge to acquire needs a bit of sublimation sometimes in the interest of a more informed decision.

I guess if I had to have that Bessa for the trip, then I'd go ultra wide or 75mm for the lens, to give yourself some versatility over your Yashica, Canonet, or Konica.

 

[sooner]

Mike and Trius, thanks for the feedback. This is why I love this forum, because you get good advice. My gut was telling me it wasn't time yet to move up to a Bessa system, which for me is still pricey, but wanted to throw it at the Bessa forum for a little arm-twisting, figuring you never know what passions will emerge. Instead, I got good advice telling me to hold steady until I can get the kit I need, when I'm ready. Hey, it's still fun to watch the kits sell on Ebay, like seeing your older brother go off on a date.

 

[dostacos]

I also am looking at the Bessa [R3A] If I was willing to do a Leica I would have bought a Hassy instead of my Kiev 88. lugging a Kiev 60 or 88 is NOT the most fun, like the negative size but they are for set shots, not walking around cameras. Indoor buildings and Museums that allow non flash photography lend themselves to a fast wideangle lens. when traveling with only one camera/lens in the past I used a Canon 650 eos with a 35-70 zoom. I have looked at the prices of Leica V Bessa and the Bessa WINS!

and for that reason, the glass being MUCH less expensive and until my skill would show the difference with the better lens/camera I will go with the less expensive. A Bess R3A and six lenses for just shy of the cost of the leica body alone......

Bessa R3A Leica M7
body $559.00 body $2,795.00
21/4.0 $340.00 21/2.8 $2,695.00
28/1.9 $450.00 28/2.8 $1,995.00
35/1.2 $900.00 35/1.4 $2,695.00
50/1.5 $350.00 50/1.4 $2,695.00
75/2.5 $300.00 75/1.4 $2,895.00
90/3.5 $320.00 90/2.0 $2,195.00
$3,219.00 $17,965.00


Expense is relative....for less I can get a gaggle of lenses and several bodies in M42 screw mount 😀

I am looking at the speed of these lenes, I want a low light no flash camera for night scenes, walking around New Orleans' buorbon street, or the River walk in San Antonio, or even Hollyweird. Many of the Leica lenses are faster, on the other hand if I REALLY need that one I can cash in one of my kids college funds and buy it.

I also shoot with Pentax spotmatic SLRs so I am kinda retro, avoiding digital for as long as possible