"New" M7- Confused or upset- Not quite sure
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drewbarb
picnic like it's 1999
Just to clarify: if the DX system is screwed up, folks are telling you to set the film speed manually on the back door, not the shutter speed. You can still shoot on Auto.
sepiareverb
genius and moron
Just call Leica or your dealer already. Why let us speculate when they will take care of it?
N
Nikon Bob
Guest
I trust my Nikon FM2ns more than my Leica Ms and don't blame you for being upset. As others have said it is fixable or use the work around. Paying big money doesn't guarantee reliability these days or so it seems.
Bob
spicoli
Established
All,
Thank you for your replies. To answer some questions though:
1. No, I didnt spend $2400 for DV coding. I wanted the latest technology and I like AE metering, as its what I was used to on my FM3A. The DX is nice, but wasnt the deal maker. I have had issues, er, problems with my M6; most recently it cost me an entire mornings shoot. And thats after a CLA with the past 2 years and less than 30 rolls ago. For $2400 I wanted reliability and piece of mind. That and the way the market is going I thought Id have a little fun instead of giving $$ to my financial advisor.
2. Yes, I could set the film speed manually and be done with it. What I dont get though is if this camera has DX coding then it should work, without exception (Nikon Bob and Tuolumne). Yes the build quality is incredible and I certainly like having a Leica for all the same reasons you do, but its a tool and an investment to me, and if it doesnt work as advertised then I dont see the point.
Thank you for your replies. To answer some questions though:
1. No, I didnt spend $2400 for DV coding. I wanted the latest technology and I like AE metering, as its what I was used to on my FM3A. The DX is nice, but wasnt the deal maker. I have had issues, er, problems with my M6; most recently it cost me an entire mornings shoot. And thats after a CLA with the past 2 years and less than 30 rolls ago. For $2400 I wanted reliability and piece of mind. That and the way the market is going I thought Id have a little fun instead of giving $$ to my financial advisor.
2. Yes, I could set the film speed manually and be done with it. What I dont get though is if this camera has DX coding then it should work, without exception (Nikon Bob and Tuolumne). Yes the build quality is incredible and I certainly like having a Leica for all the same reasons you do, but its a tool and an investment to me, and if it doesnt work as advertised then I dont see the point.
ampguy
Veteran
well at least your film is rewinding, right?
well at least your film is rewinding, right?
These cameras are old, and likely sat on shelves for awhile. They all need a good fixup/CLA, and will about every 100 rolls or so.
A good Nikon F3 or Yashica GSN will go about 5000 rolls.
You're lucky that you're not having any rewind problems, that would be another $100 or so, and will possibly come up within 100 rolls or so.
well at least your film is rewinding, right?
These cameras are old, and likely sat on shelves for awhile. They all need a good fixup/CLA, and will about every 100 rolls or so.
A good Nikon F3 or Yashica GSN will go about 5000 rolls.
You're lucky that you're not having any rewind problems, that would be another $100 or so, and will possibly come up within 100 rolls or so.
humanized_form
Established
My M7 is currently being repaired for a variation of this problem. With my M7 not only are the DX readings incorrect and intermittently fluctuating when the camera is turned on, but the same problem is also happening when setting the ISO manually. I don't know of a workaround. Intermittent incorrect ISO readings in DX and in manual. The M7 has to be turned on and off numerous times before the film speed is read correctly.
When researching this problem online I found this old photo.net thread: http://photo.net/leica-rangefinders-forum/00KHJN
The last entry in the thread is similar to my M7 problem.
Hopefully your problem is just limited to DX setting. My camera has been with Leica repair for two months now. Yikes.
When researching this problem online I found this old photo.net thread: http://photo.net/leica-rangefinders-forum/00KHJN
The last entry in the thread is similar to my M7 problem.
Hopefully your problem is just limited to DX setting. My camera has been with Leica repair for two months now. Yikes.
whitecat
Lone Range(find)er
I have had to send 3 different models of "new" Leica M bodies for repair.
sepiareverb
genius and moron
M's are individuals. There is plenty of variation in the M7's I have and have had. Just have it fixed. You seem to have gotten a used camera if it was $2400, and the seller is a reputable one, who should work with you to make it right.
drewbarb
picnic like it's 1999
Yep, even Leica doesn't make 'em like they used to. They never mastered the height of 1970's photographic technology- even on a camera introduced in 2002. Their last truly cutting edge design was introduced in 1954, and they hung their hats there, intentionally or not. Through the curse of their own success and the SLR onslaught, they were roundly knocked of the podium. Now ("Now" being since the 70's...) they really have their hands tied: all the die-hards and crusty traditionalists throw up their hands when anyone talks about changing the M at all. I might qualify to be in this group- but it makes cramming "modern technology" (i.e., electronics of any kind) into their cameras that much harder.
Now, I'm very happy shooting with my M3's. I'd love to get an M2, and maybe a nice screw-mount Leica. I love my M and LTM lenses; and while I'd love to be able to use them on bodies with modern features like AE or digital sensors, I doubt it will ever be with a Leica. I'm not a Leica basher, but I need affordable bodies that work. Cosina and Zeiss have given us great cameras with AE if you aren't happy with the function of the M7. Personally, I don't need a $4000 camera that can't match the AE function of a $500 Japanese camera, and also doesn't have the old-world build quality of their old stuff. I know, and don't mind, that nobody can do it like that anymore (though look what Nikon was able to do with their recent re-releases of their mechanical RF's....) but it is sad that we can't look to Leica for new solutions. They have tried- and some of their efforts are fine; I'd shoot with an M7 or M8 if someone gave me one. I don't blame them for this, but Leica is never going to build an affordable cutting edge camera again, film or digital. All the money in the market has gone to Nikon and Canon over the past 30 years. Leica can't compete with that. I'd be delighted to see Nikon release a digital M-mount camera. Cosina and Zeiss are doing great things. Luckily for us- and for Leica- it certainly looks like the M-mount is the de-facto standard for 35mm RF's going forward (as well as back). This makes a ton of sense, and it means there's plenty of life for all of these cameras, and hopefully for Leica. But the Zeiss Ikon is the pinnacle of evolution for the film M camera- not the M7. One could make an argument for the Hexar RF, too, but this camera had more demons than the M7, and anyway, it and Konica are gone.
If Leica can keep making and selling MP's and great lenses, maybe one day they could do a real, ground-up redesign of a totally new RF camera, the way they did with the invention of the M. Could you imagine that? Throw out everything but the mount, and build a new camera- film (yeah right) or digital. Try again to do what they did before- to make the best camera possible. Make it simple, functional, reliable, and small; make it rugged and able to take some abuse. Give it the most basic functions: focus, manual and aperture priority auto; maybe shutter priority, and even program mode/s for broader appeal. Give us ISO control, either with film or a sensor. Is Leica ever going to be able to give us a really new, affordable camera that just works right? I'm not holding my breath. Maybe Nikon or Cosina or Zeiss or someone else will- hey, maybe even Leica. But until that happens, I'm perfectly happy with my M3 from 1959.
Now, I'm very happy shooting with my M3's. I'd love to get an M2, and maybe a nice screw-mount Leica. I love my M and LTM lenses; and while I'd love to be able to use them on bodies with modern features like AE or digital sensors, I doubt it will ever be with a Leica. I'm not a Leica basher, but I need affordable bodies that work. Cosina and Zeiss have given us great cameras with AE if you aren't happy with the function of the M7. Personally, I don't need a $4000 camera that can't match the AE function of a $500 Japanese camera, and also doesn't have the old-world build quality of their old stuff. I know, and don't mind, that nobody can do it like that anymore (though look what Nikon was able to do with their recent re-releases of their mechanical RF's....) but it is sad that we can't look to Leica for new solutions. They have tried- and some of their efforts are fine; I'd shoot with an M7 or M8 if someone gave me one. I don't blame them for this, but Leica is never going to build an affordable cutting edge camera again, film or digital. All the money in the market has gone to Nikon and Canon over the past 30 years. Leica can't compete with that. I'd be delighted to see Nikon release a digital M-mount camera. Cosina and Zeiss are doing great things. Luckily for us- and for Leica- it certainly looks like the M-mount is the de-facto standard for 35mm RF's going forward (as well as back). This makes a ton of sense, and it means there's plenty of life for all of these cameras, and hopefully for Leica. But the Zeiss Ikon is the pinnacle of evolution for the film M camera- not the M7. One could make an argument for the Hexar RF, too, but this camera had more demons than the M7, and anyway, it and Konica are gone.
If Leica can keep making and selling MP's and great lenses, maybe one day they could do a real, ground-up redesign of a totally new RF camera, the way they did with the invention of the M. Could you imagine that? Throw out everything but the mount, and build a new camera- film (yeah right) or digital. Try again to do what they did before- to make the best camera possible. Make it simple, functional, reliable, and small; make it rugged and able to take some abuse. Give it the most basic functions: focus, manual and aperture priority auto; maybe shutter priority, and even program mode/s for broader appeal. Give us ISO control, either with film or a sensor. Is Leica ever going to be able to give us a really new, affordable camera that just works right? I'm not holding my breath. Maybe Nikon or Cosina or Zeiss or someone else will- hey, maybe even Leica. But until that happens, I'm perfectly happy with my M3 from 1959.
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pfoto
Well-known
Seconded. I would then buy my first digital camera.
Keith
The best camera is one that still works!
Great ... so when my M8 freezes, does the mad scroll, changes colours of things that I photograph to every hue except what they were, I just think to myself ... "they're just a small company after all!"
Not f***ing likely ... we need blood! 😛
Not f***ing likely ... we need blood! 😛
John Rountree
Nothing is what I want
Yeah, like Nikons never have any problems.
N
Nikon Bob
Guest
On the whole I have had very few problems with my Nikon SLRs , all were bought used, compared to what I have had to do with my Leica Ms and LTMs. I have more Nikon SLR bodies than Leica RFs so I think that is even more telling. The Nikons also cost a fraction of the Leica stuff.
Scott
I hope you did not think that I meant to imply that the setting the iso manually was an acceptable solution. I fully agree that the auto DX should work as advertised especially with a camera as costly as a Leica.
Bob
spicoli
Established
Bob,
No worries. Im regretting the sale of my Nikon kit. Over the years Ive had 2 FM3As (one a gift from my wife after Afghan deployment #1), an FE2, FM2n, EM, F100 and D1. The Mrs currently has a D200 and D70 after learning on a D100. The most reliable camera Ive ever owned was also the cheapest: the EM. The abuse I put that camera thru, after a tour of duty in Alaska, cannot be described. Ive got literally thousands of aurora borealis shots, all perfectly metered with that little EM. I had looked forward to a spring trip back to Fairbanks with this M7, Ive not seen much aurora work with a Leica...
Im not selling all my Leica kit in protest or anything, but I do think adding another Nikon MF SLR is in my best interest. An FE2 maybe?
No worries. Im regretting the sale of my Nikon kit. Over the years Ive had 2 FM3As (one a gift from my wife after Afghan deployment #1), an FE2, FM2n, EM, F100 and D1. The Mrs currently has a D200 and D70 after learning on a D100. The most reliable camera Ive ever owned was also the cheapest: the EM. The abuse I put that camera thru, after a tour of duty in Alaska, cannot be described. Ive got literally thousands of aurora borealis shots, all perfectly metered with that little EM. I had looked forward to a spring trip back to Fairbanks with this M7, Ive not seen much aurora work with a Leica...
Im not selling all my Leica kit in protest or anything, but I do think adding another Nikon MF SLR is in my best interest. An FE2 maybe?
photobike
Member
I have had a m7 for 6 years and never had any problems with dx settings. I've used fuji, kodak,ilford, agfa,and bulk loaded film.
drewbarb
picnic like it's 1999
Looking at your gear preferences a la your Nikon kit, it looks like you go for press-style workhorse gear with AE and bullet-proof function. Leica is not your brand for this these days. I shoot with Nikons similar to the kit you describe, and still use them for weddings and assignment stuff where appropriate. The old mechanical Leicas come along for quiet and more considered shooting, but I wouldn't count on them for the sort of things I pull out my F3 for. Leica hasn't been a cutting edge workhorse camera for 50 years. Don't expect them to be.
BennyC
Member
Try changing the batteries and see if this DX problem appears again.
spicoli
Established
BennyC,
I tried changing batteries and different types fo film. The results were the same.
Scott
I tried changing batteries and different types fo film. The results were the same.
Scott
Roger Hicks
Veteran
At least four times a year?
Don't think so.
Sure, the frames on my M4-P are sticky -- but I've not had it serviced since I bought it a quarter of a century ago. And if I use it for a few days (instead of my other Leicas) it soon frees up.
Cameras are made to be used, not collected/fondled/admired/talked about on the internet.
Cheers,
R. (currently sorting 2000+ pics taken in the last 2 months with 500+ left to develop -- all on Leicas)
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