Nikon 105 2.5 problem

[rbsinto]

My 105 2.5 in Nikon mount has quite severe damping of the focusing ring. I've had it CLA'ed twice, the last time about a year ago by a Leica repair person, and for a while the ring turned easily.
It has since stiffened up again, and I think it is worse in the severe winter cold.
Can anyone suggest a god repair person (preferably close to Toronto) who I can speak to about eliminating the problem?
Please and thanks.

 

[daveleo]

That is unusual. Maybe very unusual.
I have had 2 of these lenses over a 20 year timespan and never a hint of that problem. ? ? And, to have it re-occur . . . that's weird.

Are you storing it in a very cold area?

EDIT: I just realized this is in the RF sub-forum. I referred to the Nikon F-mount lens. Sorry.

 

[Highway 61]

Can anyone suggest a god repair person (preferably close to Toronto) who I can speak to about eliminating the problem?
Please and thanks.

I don't know if any God repair person could live close to Toronto.

Joking aside, I think this may have to do with the type of grease used during the previous services. This Nikon lens helicoid is all brass and some casual petroleum-based greases can get very sticky after having damped some brass helicals for a while.

Special lithium grease, physically and chemically steady from very cold to very high temperatures is absolutely mandatory there.

If you also notice some changes in the damping stiffiness according to the external temperature, this is a clue confirming my idea.

Sending the lens out to DAG for a consistent and well done service with the appropriate lubricant would be the best solution if you value that lens and want to keep and use it for long. In case there was something wrong with the focusing helix alignment itself, he would be able to correct it on a bench. It's fully possible that the lens got hit at some point without having external signs of it, and as a result the two helix parts would be out of linear alignment and wouldn't be durably free enough, hence the recurrent focusing stiffiness in spite of two recent services...

 

[FrankS]

Try Winball Camera in Toronto. He does the repairs, his wife translates. He repaired my Nikon f4.

 

[E.M]

I have the same problem with a Nikkor 105 micro ais , I really have to use force to focus it , but it's been unused for a long time . I bought it new in 1988 , lovely lens and it will get serviced soon .

 

[Highway 61]

I have the same problem with a Nikkor 105 micro ais , I really have to use force to focus it , but it's been unused for a long time . I bought it new in 1988 , lovely lens and it will get serviced soon .

The classic Micro Nikkors always had some quite stiff native focusing rings, it's on purpose because they are often used vertically on reprography benches, and with a too free focusing action the focus could change by itself between two shots (simple gravity can make a free focusing ring turn) and produce out of focus documents (when it comes to real macrophoto, focusing is very very very critical). So, yes, their focusing rings can get very hard to move over time when the original grease gets harder.

 

[rbsinto]

I don't know if any God repair person could live close to Toronto.

Joking aside, I think this may have to do with the type of grease used during the previous services. This Nikon lens helicoid is all brass and some casual petroleum-based greases can get very sticky after having damped some brass helicals for a while.

Special lithium grease, physically and chemically steady from very cold to very high temperatures is absolutely mandatory there.

If you also notice some changes in the damping stiffiness according to the external temperature, this is a clue confirming my idea.

Sending the lens out to DAG for a consistent and well done service with the appropriate lubricant would be the best solution if you value that lens and want to keep and use it for long. In case there was something wrong with the focusing helix alignment itself, he would be able to correct it on a bench. It's fully possible that the lens got hit at some point without having external signs of it, and as a result the two helix parts would be out of linear alignment and wouldn't be durably free enough, hence the recurrent focusing stiffiness in spite of two recent services...

Do you have contact information for DAG? I'm not familiar with this person or company.
Thanks.
Robert

 

[jonmanjiro]

Do you have contact information for DAG? I'm not familiar with this person or company.
Thanks.
Robert

Robert, here's the link. Email address is on the website.

http://www.dagcamera.com/

 

[Platinum RF]

I solved my 105 problem by using light helical grease. Mine is LTM easy to DIY

 

[Rob-F]

There is, or recently was, Gerry Smith at Kindermann Canada. Smith has a top reputation. The last time I was in Toronto, the sales person in a Leica shop told me that Kindermann is to the northwest area of Toronto.

 

[thirteen]

I'ved had great service from Camtech in Hamilton many times (shutter repairs, electronics and lens calibration).
http://camtechphoto.com/

 

[rbsinto]

There is, or recently was, Gerry Smith at Kindermann Canada. Smith has a top reputation. The last time I was in Toronto, the sales person in a Leica shop told me that Kindermann is to the northwest area of Toronto.

Kindermann is on Steelcase Road West across the street from where I used to work, and not far from where I live.
I'll call them on Monday and see if he is still there.
Thanks for the tip.

 

[rbsinto]

Try Winball Camera in Toronto. He does the repairs, his wife translates. He repaired my Nikon f4.

Raymond Fung retired at the end of 2012, and closed Winball down. He looked after my gear for so many years, that he said he'd do work for me when he's here (as he and Winnie plan to travel a lot) so it isn't easy or even timely to have him do work for me any more.

 

[Clay]

Sorry to hear that he retired. Was going to try him. I second the
lithium grease.
Best regards,
/Clay

 

[Phil_F_NM]

I haven't found a lithium grease doesn't have too much shear strength for many helicoids. Both the RF and SLR versions of the 105 f/2.5 have double helicoids that fight against each other when moving in and out. The best grease is a very light silicone especially with two helical surfaces that have (I think) 26 threads each. Pair high shear strength with cooler temperatures and a lens will just about lock up. Most Lithium will separate as well and can eventually leave oily deposits in places where the lighter weight fluid can migrate.

It took me a good amount of experimentation but I have wound up mixing watch repair silicone grease with liquid silicone to thin it out to a near liquid consistency but at this point it serves very well for all lenses I've worked on that have double helicoids, including some of the Leica RF lenses with upwards of 60 helical threads that need a very light shear strength in the damping grease.

Good luck!

Phil Forrest

 

[Clay]

Thanks for the info Phil, I didn't know that.

Best regards,

/Clay

 

[rbsinto]

CORRECTION
Winball Camera Repair is still open as Raymond has only semi-retired.
I spoke to them this morning and Winnie advised me that they are still working, and plan to do so for the next couple of years.
If you need them: 416-221-9368

 

[Highway 61]

I haven't found a lithium grease doesn't have too much shear strength for many helicoids. Both the RF and SLR versions of the 105 f/2.5 have double helicoids that fight against each other when moving in and out. The best grease is a very light silicone especially with two helical surfaces that have (I think) 26 threads each. Pair high shear strength with cooler temperatures and a lens will just about lock up. Most Lithium will separate as well and can eventually leave oily deposits in places where the lighter weight fluid can migrate.

It took me a good amount of experimentation but I have wound up mixing watch repair silicone grease with liquid silicone to thin it out to a near liquid consistency but at this point it serves very well for all lenses I've worked on that have double helicoids, including some of the Leica RF lenses with upwards of 60 helical threads that need a very light shear strength in the damping grease.

Good luck!

Phil Forrest

Very informative and interesting post, thanks Phil.

Robert, just keep us posted once the lens has been serviced.

 

[rbsinto]

I spoke to Gerry Smith at Kindermann yesterday and he'll take a look at the lens today. He suggested over the phone that it might be cheaper to buy another lens rather than CLA this one. Once he has it in hand he'll let me know.
I've never ventured inside a lens before, so I have no idea what's involved in a do-it-yourself CLA exercise, and likely don't have the tools to do it anyway, so I'll leave it to Gerry or Raymond Fung to guide me.
Thanks everyone for the advice.

 

[Highway 61]

He suggested over the phone that it might be cheaper to buy another lens rather than CLA this one.

This is the dumbiest suggestion that I've heard of, ever... 😱

Inside any lens you have glass serrated into the optics barrel, and the focusing helicoid (either simple or double).

Look at this.

If this can be done on such a crudely aluminium made lens, this can be done on a Nikkor with brass/bronze inwards.

I have CLAd a certain amount of lenses helicoids myself and I can testify that everything can be done once you have decided that it will be done.

Howzabout sending it to our fellow member Phil Forrest ?

They should not be "damped" IMHO -- just ruins them, as the ruined lens the OP is dealing with.

This lens isn't the least bit "ruined" IMO, it's just been serviced with some unproper thick/sticky/corrosive grease at some point, so now it's only a matter of cleaning the helicoids and very slightly re-lubing them with some well suited lithium or silicone lubricant.

Some people could say there is nothing as boring as an heavily used Nikkor lens with some dry, squeaking and very loose focusing action. Let's not see this problem in black and white.