Nikon going out of the film camera business

[ch1]

Is this a problem? How many slrs do you intend to buy in the next 5-10 years. How many has Pentax, Minolta, Nikon, Suzuki, just checkin' to see if you're reading, and others have made in the last 10-15 years that are still fully functional. I just bought a nearly new X700, Minolta for those uninitiated to the big M, and that with my X370 will last till I die, I'm 59 as of today. So, again, how many new film cameras can we buy? As long as film is available, I won't have any problems, and I don't think most of you will either. Buck up boys, there's film to burn!!! This is to cheer you all up!

Precisely Rich,

This is NOT "bad news". It is a corporate rationalization that we all expected.

What exactly has Nikon "abandoned"?

I suggest it is the production of cheapo, plastic-bodied, mass produced SLRs using questionable AF zooms that could be "crumpled" in your hand! Quite frankly, as a Nikon-phile, I found their later series of "prosumer" SLRs to be embarrasing.

I would hazard to guess that within a few years, Nikon will abandon camera body production almost altogether!

Figure it out. Digital cameras are "commonditized disposables". Typical product cycle is under 2 years.

No one is going to spend upteen thousand dollars every two years just because it has "Nikon" on the viewfinder!

Better then to narrow your body production to one or two "high end" offerings to preserve your "lens mount" technology while concentrating on lens production. And also "milking" the latter by continuing to license it to Sigma, Cosina, Tamron etc. as well as, now, Zeiss.

This is all coming together - there is a big "shakeout" happening in the camera/lens industry. It is partly due to the continuing evolution of the digital format. But it is also driven by the fact that a big new entrant, China, will quickly move from imitative to innovative in the imaging industry as it is doing in others.

 

[back alley]

worse comes to worse...i'll just look at stuff...😉

 

[Bertram2]

I am sure the other big makers will follow. So hang onto your F3
http://www.nikon.co.uk/press_room/releases/show.aspx?rid=201.

Means if my F80 breaks I have to invest in a F6. So what ? Makes me drooling anyway since a while.......... 😉

Bertram

 

[Uncle Bill]

What happened to the FM3a? Talk about the sky falling and it looks like I am sticking with my 2 F's, one NIkkormat FTn and F2 which is on the way. Rationalisation is not surprising in this case.

Bill

 

[peterc]

That is a nice camera

I may be able to trade in my F80 on it which will greatly reduce the price too.

Peter

 

[VinceC]

I think, at this point in the evolution of digital, the people who want to stick with film are: A) those who have a film camera and want to keep using it, and B) those who are real traditionalists. Group A by definition isn't buying a new camera and Group B is more likely to purchase a classic used camera. So Nikon, like Leica, has discovered that its main competition is its own older cameras that won't die.

That doesn't mean there's no market for film cameras. But 45 years ago, Nikon made the decision to abandon an excellent rangefinder line, leaving that niche market to others, in favor of throwing its photo division fully into SLRs. This isn't very different.

 

[back alley]

'That doesn't mean there's no market for film cameras. But 45 years ago, Nikon made the decision to abandon an excellent rangefinder line, leaving that niche market to others, in favor of throwing its photo division fully into SLRs. This isn't very different.'

deja vu all over again!
that's kinda true but i hadn't thought of it in those terms before.

but they both used film tho...

ah, digital can't be that bad eh?

 

[Gabriel M.A.]

I'm really not surprised. Nikon and Canon are spearheading the "prosumer" and "professional" DSLR market. Canon's rumor mill had leaked as much about a year ago that they too would be abandoning film body production except for the EOS-1 line; I didn't hear people fainting over that one. I don't think people will faint over this one either, as long as they keep the F6 in production (for now).

It's not a good sign for "us", but they are in a position to do this. Kodak, on the other hand, oy --and they're a special case because of their film business. But Nikon and Canon? They have their stakes solidly on the digital turf.

Now, give me a full-sensor DSLR for under $900 and a great film rangefinder. A dream? Let's see in a year and a half...

 

[ch1]

I'm really not surprised. Nikon and Canon are spearheading the "prosumer" and "professional" DSLR market. Canon's rumor mill had leaked as much about a year ago that they too would be abandoning film body production except for the EOS-1 line; I didn't hear people fainting over that one. I don't think people will faint over this one either, as long as they keep the F6 in production (for now).

It's not a good sign for "us", but they are in a position to do this. Kodak, on the other hand, oy --and they're a special case because of their film business. But Nikon and Canon? They have their stakes solidly on the digital turf.

Now, give me a full-sensor DSLR for under $900 and a great film rangefinder. A dream? Let's see in a year and a half...

Excellent points.

The simple reality is that there is no longer a "prosumer" film SLR market for Canikon to make cameras for.

Heck, given Sony and Panasonic and their TTL imaging system s- our "traditionals" are going to be hard-pressed to even preserve even the DSLR format!

The whole world as we knew it is splitting. I expect that before long we will only use the term "photograhy" to refer to film-based picture taking. The newer alternative of digital "image processing" will be considered a fully distinct activity.

Does this mean the end of film and film cameras? I do not really think so - I think film-based picture taking (I'm being deliberately careful and simplistic with my language here) will become a high-end "enthusiast" activity.

In the past, such a development might have been a death knell. But with the web and the ability to globally develop niche activities - film photograhy will remain a viable and enjoyable activity. At least until it's adherents "disappear".

So, what are you (we) doing to bring some young folks into the "fold"?

 

[bmattock]

http://www.counselingforloss.com/article8.htm

1) Denial.
2) Anger.
3) Bargaining.
4) Depression.
5) Acceptance.

You'll be a lot happier when you can just accept that film and film-based cameras, are on life support with a flat-line EKG. How long will they linger? What does it matter? They patient is not going to take up their bed and walk.

Once you accept that it is over, you can relax and enjoy the best of the low prices for used (let's face it, dumped) high-end kit, experiment with films you might not otherwise have tried, and just have fun while you take the time to bring yourself up to speed with what the new digital world will offer once it gets itself sorted. Life goes on.

Personally, I find this all extremely fascinating. We're living through a major paradigm shift, the fastest technological change of all time (to date), and it is happening while we watch it. Great days to be alive.

Best Regards,

Bill Mattocks

 

[back alley]

'Personally, I find this all extremely fascinating. We're living through a major paradigm shift, the fastest technological change of all time (to date), and it is happening while we watch it. Great days to be alive.'

maybe we should take a picture.
a kind of photo documentary of this change.

i'd do it myself but i'm stuck here...waiting for the ice man!

😉

 

[enochRoot]

i think there will no longer be any sub-professional level "cameras" at all. i had read that cellphone cameras would be up to 5 megapixels soon (if they aren't already). so a whole market segment will no longer use a camera to take their photos. it's moving to hand-held media devices that will be phones, mini computers, cameras, dvd players, and tvs. so only high-level pros will be using *any* type of camera (digital or otherwise), as the mass consumer market...and even some hobbiests, i would think...will get enough resolution out of their "all-in-one" handheld device. just my take on things.

oh...and wouldn't all the radiation from the nuclear blast fog our film?! unless it was just an EMP they let off. now that would suck! all these manual cameras that so cleverly need no electronics...and an entire world full of fogged film.

 

[ch1]

'Personally, I find this all extremely fascinating. We're living through a major paradigm shift, the fastest technological change of all time (to date), and it is happening while we watch it. Great days to be alive.'

maybe we should take a picture.
a kind of photo documentary of this change.

i'd do it myself but i'm stuck here...waiting for the ice man!

😉

Joe,

Actually, we are taking a picture. This thread too, like everything else in cyberspace is just a google away from being reviewed!. 😎

Oh, and does the iceman cometh yet? 😉

George

 

[ch1]

i think there will no longer be any sub-professional level "cameras" at all. i had read that cellphone cameras would be up to 5 megapixels soon (if they aren't already). so a whole market segment will no longer use a camera to take their photos. it's moving to hand-held media devices that will be phones, mini computers, cameras, dvd players, and tvs. so only high-level pros will be using *any* type of camera (digital or otherwise), as the mass consumer market...and even some hobbiests, i would think...will get enough resolution out of their "all-in-one" handheld device. just my take on things.

oh...and wouldn't all the radiation from the nuclear blast fog our film?! unless it was just an EMP they let off. now that would suck! all these manual cameras that so cleverly need no electronics...and an entire world full of fogged film.

You mean you didn't bury some Kodachrome when the rest of us did? 😕

 

[enochRoot]

You mean you didn't bury some Kodachrome when the rest of us did? 😕

crap...i'll get started on the lead basement this weekend! 3 day weekend, you know...

 

[bmattock]

i think there will no longer be any sub-professional level "cameras" at all. i had read that cellphone cameras would be up to 5 megapixels soon (if they aren't already). so a whole market segment will no longer use a camera to take their photos. it's moving to hand-held media devices that will be phones, mini computers, cameras, dvd players, and tvs. so only high-level pros will be using *any* type of camera (digital or otherwise), as the mass consumer market...and even some hobbiests, i would think...will get enough resolution out of their "all-in-one" handheld device. just my take on things.

You could be right, but people have been predicting the grand harmonic digital convergence since the first VCR/TV combo, and it just never seems to happen - they are always such compromises, or you end up paying a lot for features you may not care about yourself, etc. Plus, when one part breaks, it is all down for the count.

I guess it could happen, but my gut tells me no. I think there is a bigger market for cell phone cameras than I originally thought there was, so I could be wrong.

I think the various manufacturers are settling around several design niches, which Steve at Steve's Digicams seems to have a handle on.

I'm still waiting for a digicam with a non-zoom lens and an optical viewfinder - no LCD and very low shutter lag.

Best Regards,

Bill Mattocks

 

[Finder]

The real news is there are no more producers of large-format lenses in the 600mm to 1200mm range.

 

[ch1]

crap...i'll get started on the lead basement this weekend! 3 day weekend, you know...

Now your crackin'. And don't forget to put a tube-radio down there together with the rotary-dial phone! Be prepared, that someboy's motto! 😀

Have fun, keep shooting picimages!

George

 

[ch1]

You could be right, but people have been predicting the grand harmonic digital convergence since the first VCR/TV combo, and it just never seems to happen - they are always such compromises, or you end up paying a lot for features you may not care about yourself, etc. Plus, when one part breaks, it is all down for the count.

I guess it could happen, but my gut tells me no. I think there is a bigger market for cell phone cameras than I originally thought there was, so I could be wrong.

I think the various manufacturers are settling around several design niches, which Steve at Steve's Digicams seems to have a handle on.

I'm still waiting for a digicam with a non-zoom lens and an optical viewfinder - no LCD and very low shutter lag.

Best Regards,

Bill Mattocks

Bill,

Great points.

Once we get loose of these damned digital imagetakers, photography can re-emerge as a true art form.

Kind of like how the artistic painters did after leaving "realism" to the photographers.

Evolving technologies create alternative uses for prior formats.

Remember, they still make canvas and oil paints and calligraphers can still buy parchment and quills! 😀

 

[enochRoot]

You could be right, but people have been predicting the grand harmonic digital convergence since the first VCR/TV combo, and it just never seems to happen - they are always such compromises, or you end up paying a lot for features you may not care about yourself, etc. Plus, when one part breaks, it is all down for the count.

yes...i know what you're saying. but i fear this time it might come to pass. less and less is the burden to purchase hardware put on the consumer. corporations learned long ago that you give them the "thingy" for free, and then charge for the service. that is why cellphones are so cheap. the cellphone companies subsidise them to get the service contract. this helps w/ the whole "engineered obsolescence" thing too. that is just an operating cost for the service providers. so in that regard, people no longer have to worry about things breaking, as they'll be getting a new one next year anyhow. that is why i mention this (as someone said the market for the camera bodies is not worth it to the big producers anymore...since they are outdated so fast). so this way...as things are designed to break in a couple years anyhow...people will not worry about it. they will pick the best service, and the place that subsidizes the best phones. and naturally these would be the phones w/ the greatest resolution, the number of features, etc. i HATE this. i grew up w/ modern digital technology (born in 74)...so i am of "this generation". but i'm suffering a digital backlash, and embrace all things analog. but surprisingly enough, people like my parents are FINALLY embracing the digital. and they love all the features crammed into one thing. so do my little brothers (got one on film luckily). and quite frankly i am shocked at how many friends no longer have little P&S (or is it POS) digis for their snapshot duties. they just use their phones. really, only time will tell. but i think the cheap digital camera is going the way of the dodo. and if they do start getting 5, 6, 8, 10 megapixel imaging systems built into tiny cellphones...even the higher echelons of the consumer market would flock to these devices (as they no doubt like to have the latest and greatest phone, text messaging system, etc, etc). interesting times indeed!

Now your crackin'. And don't forget to put a tube-radio down there together with the rotary-dial phone! Be prepared, that someboy's motto!

hehehe...oddly enough, my other hobby is designing and building tube amps!! long live analog technology. oh...and i don't own a cd player. records only. 😀