NYT: Sontag Squared

Them that can, take photos. Them that can't get a doctorate degree and write drivel. Or words to that effect. It's a truism for a reason....it's true.

But I love those quotes Sparrow put up. If I have trouble sleeping, that sort of reading works wonders. And it has nothing to do w/ Sontag really, it's that whole, useless as t*ts on a bullfrog, idiotic sub species that is incapable of using clear and concise language. Because the truth is, if they ever did that, they would just sound ridiculous.
 
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GSNfan said:
Imo the best 'intellectual' book on photography is The Americans, and the best part about that book is that you don't need to read some pretentious nonsense, all you have to do is look at the photos and its all 'there'.
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I take it you skip the introduction?
 
Sparrow said:
yes, I'm being harsh I admit, but it is really just a pretentious way of stating the bleeding obvious
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Your quotes made me chuckle and of course you are right. I guess my filter was on when I read it and I ended up reading things that made sense in many respects, but as you say, presented in a verbose manner, complete with somersaults 😀
 
Renzsu said:
I find looking at photos so much more interesting that talking about them... some of my favorite photographers couldn't give a rats ass about all that babble, doesn't make them any less good 🙂
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Two pints (sic), if I may:-

1. "I find looking at photos so much more interesting that talking about them..."

100% in agreement

2. "...some of my favorite photographers couldn't give a rats ass about all that babble, doesn't make them any less good"

100% in agreement

I don't give a flying firkin for 99% of philosophical talk and debate that has gone on, goes on and is yet to be undertaken. Many, many people live in their own little worlds without true reference to reality. A picture is a picture is a picture. If another party wishes to read into that picture so be it, I just assume that they are taking a rest from reading tea leaves.

Al
 
Sparrow said:
..."Which means that every photograph is equivalent even as each one is distinct"

"... that they all capture a precise present and register its conversion into an irretrievable past"

"Photographs seem at once durable and fragile, trivial and powerful, and contemplation of their place in the world leads naturally to musings on loss, mortality — even apocalypse"....
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The problem I have with this is that I do understand it, and am entirely comfortable with the concepts. Yet I am about as far removed from the NY art-speak gallery and academic art worlds as you can get, a mere under-educated working stiff. But I find Sontag pretty accessible, along with Barthes'. Their work has informed my view of photography, of which I consider myself fortunate. What I don't understand is the Sontag phobia I see evident. But that's okay, each to their own. 😉

~Joe
 
JoeV said:
The problem I have with this is that I do understand it, and am entirely comfortable with the concepts. Yet I am about as far removed from the NY art-speak gallery and academic art worlds as you can get, a mere under-educated working stiff. But I find Sontag pretty accessible, along with Barthes'. Their work has informed my view of photography, of which I consider myself fortunate. What I don't understand is the Sontag phobia I see evident. But that's okay, each to their own. 😉

~Joe
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... and so do I, qualified and a forty year career in art and design ... she doesn't frighten me and it doesn't stop her talking twaddle, I speak so those who don't have the benefit of the education or experience don't feel they are missing anything
 
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Yeah, right, a picture is a picture is a picture. You should never "read into" it. For example, my cat pictures are no different from this:
TrangBang.jpg


And this is just a picture of a trike:
guide_g.jpg


It's fine if you don't want to engage in critical thought, but I wouldn't brag about it.
 
I should be used to this by now but I am always amazed at the vitriol towards the theoretical end of art and photography. A lot of people write about this stuff because there are a lot of ideas about it. Photography is not as clear cut as it seems- this should be obvious. A photo always says something whether or not you pay attention.
 
benlees said:
I should be used to this by now but I am always amazed at the vitriol towards the theoretical end of art and photography. A lot of people write about this stuff because there are a lot of ideas about it. Photography is not as clear cut as it seems- this should be obvious. A photo always says something whether or not you pay attention.
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I am not shooting from the hip and without aiming correctly IMO. Of course there is objective criticism and rightly so as we are passionate beings.
 
bensyverson said:
Yeah, right, a picture is a picture is a picture. You should never "read into" it. For example, my cat pictures are no different from this:


It's fine if you don't want to engage in critical thought, but I wouldn't brag about it.
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You are right of course "You shouldn't read into it" - well done. As for your trike picture, again you are correct, it is, ...a trike.

As for engaging in critical thought, there are many who purport to do this but in fact peddle 'subjective clap trap'
 
Frankly, I'll go with Sparrow here. This is the kind of over-intellectualizing of something which gives me a headache. "Ecology of images," indeed. Who the hell is Susan Sontag to dictate who shoots, and what to shoot?

But then Susan Sontag is an "intellectual." I remember Tom Wolfe quoting someone about the deftinition of an""intellectual." Something to the effect that an intellectual is someone who pontificates with great authority on a subject in which they have no real expertise at all (and I remember Mr. Wolfe referred to Ms. Sontag as an example of this.).

Guess my feeling is I'll take the picture because, well, I like the image--or the moment--and let someone else pump out a 5,000-word essay on "the meaning of it all."
 
Sparrow said:
... and so do I, qualified and a forty year career in art and design ... she doesn't frighten me and it doesn't stop her talking twaddle, I speak so those who don't have the benefit of the education or experience don't feel they are missing anything
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Every time I turn on the TV or go to the coffee shop I see folks who don't have the benefit of education or experience in art and design wringing their hands and wondering if they're missing something in Sontag's writing. You have a lot of work to do, Stewart. 🙂
 
benlees said:
I should be used to this by now but I am always amazed at the vitriol towards the theoretical end of art and photography. A lot of people write about this stuff because there are a lot of ideas about it. Photography is not as clear cut as it seems- this should be obvious. A photo always says something whether or not you pay attention.
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Take the time to offer some concrete reasons as to why people should read Sontag and where she makes sense if at all... I always find it disappointing that most discussion on the forums either become an exercise in trying to be cute and witty and on the flip side complaints and handringing. I really like to learn because then I don't feel guilty about my time spent on the forum - and I have learned a lot by forum discussions.
 
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