Old school film any good? (and dirty cheap)

[vicmortelmans]

Hallo,

for a while, I was not taking notice about film types like Efke, which is mentioned quite a lot on this forum, but which I never saw in the regular shops. I assumed that it was a special pro-film, and quite expensive. Now I bumped into some online order sites (Freestyle, JanDC) and was surprised to see that there's a whole range of 'old-school' films (Efke, ADOX, Arista,...) and that these films are typically *cheaper* than the Ilford FP4+/HP5+ which I normally use.

Now, I'm considering to try this out, but have these criteria:

if I can go cheaper, I will, but I want reasonable grain (equal or finer compared to Ilford's) and easy development (Rodinal for the time being, low sensitivity to chemical residus and scratches).

Also I want to obtain the film from within the EURO-zone, because otherwise packaging and additional import taxes will reduce any price-benefit.

Please comment on following criteria for old-school films in general or Efke/ADOX 100 (those are identical formulae, right?) in particular, if you have experience with these films. I've already added a comment from myself, as based on literature.

- grain
claims to be 'good' but no idea how it compares to Ilfort FP4+

- pushable
no idea

- pullable
no way!

- exposure latitude
not as wide as Ilford FP4+; careful exposure technique is required

- how does it react to underdevelopment
no idea, I ask because I require low-density negs for scanning; I already have my doubts, because literature says to overexpose for better shadow detail when underdeveloping and pulling seems not to be on the old school feature list...

- on-the-shelf lifetime
no idea; the last of an order of 10 films will be on my shelf for 3 to 4 months... that's reasonable, I guess

- sensitive to scratching
no idea; I read something about old films requiring a fixer with 'hardener', but then again this would increase washing time dramatically... does this apply to 'new old-school' films as well?

- sensitive to chemical residu (bad washing)
no idea; see previous note


Thanks !!

Vic

 

[Jocko]

I wouldn't pretend to know enough to answer your questions. Vic, but this British dealer is a mine of information on a wide range of films, whilst their "technical" menu has many downloads that may go some way to sorting things out 🙂 -

http://www.retrophotographic.com/films.htm

Cheers, Ian

 

[Jocko]

I'm bouncing this post because it deserves a proper answer!

Cheers, Ian!

 

[rich815]

There really are not too many bad films. Just films that need to be learned in terms of development, exposure, etc. The cool thing is B&W is so expressive and subjective as to how you want to work with your tones, contrast, grain, etc. that it's best to find a couple films and concentrate on them to bring out their best attributes. There's nothing wrong with the old school films but I find many of them tend to curl a lot and can be more easily scratched. I know, a broad-brush and probably unfair description, and not all are subject to that, but it has been my experience with a few that I've tried.

In terms of cheap cost I find it better to find expired rolls or bulk rolls of the "good" stuff and get those for the same or cheaper price. I recently loaded up on expired bulk rolls Tri-X, HP5+, Plus-X, APX25 and Delta 100 and got them for as cheap or cheaper than the old school film costs. In years and years I've never had any problems with expired B&W films. I keep them in the freezer and I'm set for a good 4-5 years now on 35mm film.

Yes, I know I said emphasize just a couple of types but really only the HP5+ and Tri-X "overlap". Plus I'm still deciding!

 

[markinlondon]

I don't know much about the emulsions themselves, Vic but if you're looking for an EU supplier try www.fotoimpex.de. They sell the Efke/ADOX, foma, Forte and "Classic Pan" films. In the UK use www.retrophotographic.com. I think there are many foma fans here.

 

[titrisol]

EFKE/ADOX yes same film.
- Grain is small, similar to the old PlusX, comparable to FP4
- Latitude is there, I think it is as wide as FP4
EFKE 100 can be pushed a bit with the proper development
It is just a matter of what you expect

- The film makes more contrasty images than FP4 and has a different look. Try a few rolls and decide for yourself

 

[x-ray]

I use a great deal of Adox / Efke 25 and have used it when available since 1968. I've also used a considerable amount of 100. The 25 / old Adox KB 14 is super fine grain with nice tonality but can easily get very contrasty. Developement is quite critical for consistency and quality and exposure latitude is narrow compared to other films. I process in rodinal 1:100 for 12-14 minutes at 68 F with mild agitation. 35mm can make prints comperable to normal emulsion 6x6. The 100 is a beautiful film with moderate contrast and minimal grain. The negs look different and print different than my delta 100 or 400 negs particularly in the midtones. It yields very fine luminous prints and renders skin very nicely. I suspect it has a boosted red sensitivity. Rodinal is excellent as per directions. I started experiemting with Arista / Forte 100. It's truly an old style emulsion. I had forgotten what real grain looked like and how stunning the tonality could be. I ran it per the directions for Fortepan 100 and have shot both Forte and Arista (plain Arista not ultra) It's a very sharp film and has luminous tonality unlike any other film I have shot in the past thirty years. I find the grain sharp and tight but large. I recently started testing the film in Acufine at 1:1 for 7 minutes at 68F. Much finer grain and still beautiful tonality. I'm doing additional tests and feel it has potential. My primary films are Adox 25, Delta 100 and 400 and HP5 in acufine at 800. I've used this combo since the beginning of delta gilms and did testing for Ilford before they came on the market. Prior to that i shot thusands of rolls of agfa 25 and 100 but like the delta films much better. In the early days I shot exclusively Tri-x in 35mm but Tri-X is now a totally different film which I really dislike. (What was in your head Kodak!!!!!)