OT: Selling Prints

[GeneW]

Do any of you sell prints of your photographs?

I'm flattered that every so often a visitor to my pbase galleries inquires about buying a print. Trouble is, I have no prints -- I currently use the web for display.

As I ease into retirement, I'm considering getting a decent photoprinter (e.g. Epson R2400) or sending some of my stuff to a lab for printing, but then what? When you sell a print, do you charge sales and/or applicable VAT taxes on it? If yes, isn't the bookkeeping a lot of work if you're only selling a few prints here and there? Can print sales be considered 'services' rather than 'goods'?

Aside from the bookkeeping issues, how do you mail prints?

I'm not talking weddings and portraits, just the odd 'art print' for lack of a better phrase and as you can tell, I have zero experience in this area.

Gene

 

[cp_ste.croix]

What I have heard/sometimes done is to tally up all of your costs, including a reasonable hourly rate and then to double it...or, another way to do it is to look at other artists in your area and see what they're charging

I've only ever sold things 'under the table' as it were and haven't added taxes ever. I've never sold enough to consider writing things off or to keep actual books... Shipping is in a rigid carboard tube of the type draftspeople use.

Hope this helps...

 

[XAos]

If you're doing books - I suspect the tax man would frown on selling a print as $1.47 worth of photo paper and $80 worth of services.

 

[GeneW]

Chris, thanks for the info on mailing. I can figure out pricing okay, but it's the actually selling part I'm unsure of.

If you're doing books - I suspect the tax man would frown on selling a print as $1.47 worth of photo paper and $80 worth of services.

I'm not attempting to evade the tax man -- just trying to understand. If someone hires me for a photoshoot (as has happened) and I deliver my services, including lab-processed prints, I currently charge (in Ontario at least) only GST -- a services tax, not a goods (i.e. sales) tax. I'm trying to understand the difference, if any, between this and selling prints that I would make on a custom-request basis. I forgot to add that I have a registered business that I've used for years for freelance writing and it has always been service based. I dutifully file all my taxes (though not always right on time 😀 )

Gene

 

[David Doler]

Surf the net looking at other fine art photographer's print prices and adjust from there. If you're going to sell inkjet prints, you need to either use pigment based inks ir dedicated monochrome systems. Nobody will be happy if their print fades in a couple of months or years. Use the finest paper. To mail them, slip print into in a plastic sleeve from an archival supplies source, sandwich between two sheets of good cardboard (corrugated box type), tape the edges with 2" wide plastic mailing tape and you're in business. Also add a nice formal note describing the photo and more about you as the artist/photog. And get the check up front and cashed too before you mail it.

Not hard and good for the ego too.

Oh, by the way. Here in the States, I'm a sole proprietor. I include my profit into my usual earnings. Easy. Now you just have to figure out the marketing side of things. Currently I show some of my work in a local coffee shop. Generated only a handfull of sales, but thats OK. It's not really worth all the effort, but its fun anyway.

 

[GeneW]

Thanks David. Good points, and why, from what I am told, most pro's are using Epson 2200 and up printers because of the longevity of the inks.

Gene

 

[FrankS]

If just arranged to hang some (6-10) of my framed prints in an upscale furniture store that also sells wall art of local artists. They take a 20% commission on whatever sells. I'm planning to make most of the prints full frame 35mm on 8x10 with a 4 inch border. Matted and framed, minus commision, if I sell for $200 I'll make about $100 per image. Figure an hour total to print and assemble each picture. I may frame some larger ones (16x20) and also print up some postcard size pictures. I doubt I'll sell enough to make a tax declaration worth the trouble.

I stress a little about printing on RC paper rather than FB, but other photogs sell colour prints that are certainly not Cibachrome or dye-transfer, and i'm sure images on RC paper last at least as long as colour prints from negs. I jsut don't think the market will bear the additional cost (in labour) of printing on truly archival (if processed and matted properly) FB paper. (Has anyone seen a 100 year old digitally printed picture?)

So I echo Gene's request for info from anyone with experience selling photographic prints.

 

[Tin]

If someone hires me for a photoshoot (as has happened) and I deliver my services, including lab-processed prints, I currently charge (in Ontario at least) only GST -- a services tax, not a goods (i.e. sales) tax. I'm trying to understand the difference, if any, between this and selling prints that I would make on a custom-request basis. I forgot to add that I have a registered business that I've used for years for freelance writing and it has always been service based.

Gene

From what I understand, you need only charge GST if your total annual sale exceeds $30,000. For you to charge GST now on your current business activities, I assume you must have a GST registration number. This makes sense as you are still running a business. But in the future when you become semi-retired, you may not have that sales volume. Then you may not need to be registered and charge GST. (I assume that if you sold your photos through a third party store, they'd have to charge GST as they certainly have a sales volume larger than $30,000). I am no tax expert, just happen to know a little bit on this topic. So I'd suggest that you should check with the taxman on the rules. Further, I don't know anything about the rules related to PST.

 

[Gabriel M.A.]

I did get a couple of inquiries myself from my PBase galleries, which prompted me to put an e-mail link for print inquiries. All I got was turbo entries into spam lists.

The problem was that the people who did ask about prints, I would write them back and did not follow-up, so I thought I'd probably set up a webpage with galleries of my own, with an option to "buy", yet discreet (I'm not into hypercommercialism).

I have launched my beta site: http://www.gmaphoto.com/

I have not promoted it yet, for the bandwidth is lacking a little and I'd like to talk to my provider about upgrading the service.

Anyway...I thought of printing some "small" prints with my Durabrite printer, but I know a couple of lab printers I've worked with before, so I feel rather comfortable sending my own prints off at the lab. The cost may depend on who you work with, and sometimes it's about the same, even cheaper if you're having trouble with a miscalibrated system (i.e. color profiling) and print lots of tests before getting it right.

I second FrankS' comments on paper; I have coated a few of my own prints which I've hung on my walls with UV protecting coating. It not only reduces glare, it prevents gas-fading. It is highly toxic, so you should do it only if you know what you're doing, with a mask, outdoors preferably.

 

[Gabriel M.A.]

If you're doing books - I suspect the tax man would frown on selling a print as $1.47 worth of photo paper and $80 worth of services.

But isn't that what a photo is? $1.47 worth of paper, and $80 worth of sweat and tears?

 

[24x30]

But isn't that what a photo is? $1.47 worth of paper, and $80 worth of sweat and tears?

at some of them you can smell sweat for more than $80 🙂)), that's the reason never to sell them 🙂

/rudi

 

[Byuphoto]

Gene, if you are going to print BW I would recommend the Epson and the dedicated BW ink system but since I do mostly color I use the excellent Canon I960 and i9900 pritners. I print up to 13x19 myself and get a local lab/wedding photographerto do up to 30x60. I have my own website and sell through it and also display in a local Dr.'s office and in the local library. I go to two arts/crafts shows per month and set up my laptop and printer. That way I am not tied to a large inventory of prints. When they choose one from ym display I print a copy fron CD and matte it right there. I also custom frame and make the frames myself. When I mail one I send unmatted in the aforementioned tubes and matted in bubble wrap mailers.
I do quite a volume of business this way.

 

[Byuphoto]

FrankS wrote: (Has anyone seen a 100 year old digitally printed picture?)

I think I have seen that some where ;-)

 

[canonetc]

I have a friend named Doug who selenium-tones his BW Epson-printed art prints in a wet darkroom. Don't know his actual selling ratio, but the idea seems to be a good one to increase archivalness. Adding metal to the paper (and thus the Epson inks) should increase the lifespan of the print.

I have another friend named Carlos who sells his wet-darkroom and digital fine-art prints exclusively on RC paper, arguing "It's made of PLASTIC, for God's sake! It will last forever. Plus, most people don't know or care about the difference." Right or wrong, I dunno, but I stick with fiber-based for print sales myself.

Limited editions allegedly increase value; if only 25 prints exist on the planet, you have the right to price them high (if, ethically, you make no more of that size!). Really, I groan over all the commercial considerations that can be made when it comes to selling works. But hey, that's part of the fun of being an "artiste". Beret anyone...? 🙂

chris