EtoileFinder
Established
I'm planning to buy an epson r-d1, but I need to know how it's the level of noise on high iso. I like to shoot with natural light and in low light condition, so my plan is to use fast lens with the r-d1, I want to know what is the quality of the pictures in low light condition with the r-d1. Your opinion and suggestion will be very appreciated.
By the way, would you buy a new r-d1 for 2000$ or an old one for about 1500-1700$ ?
By the way, would you buy a new r-d1 for 2000$ or an old one for about 1500-1700$ ?
yanidel
Well-known
I have read (someone can confirm?) that Epson seems to charge a standard fee of around $500 whatever the repair outside of warranty. So basically, it depends on your assessment of the used unit your are buying. One single problem and you would have been probably better off buying new. Now you could also take it to an independant repair shop but I don't know what they would charge. You can also bet on your good luck and have no repairs 
As for low ligh, I would stay pretty good up to 800 as the grain is pleasing.
1600 loses a lot of sharpness but the grain does not look as "electronic" as other devices. Hot pixels are also more present at 1600. But still, I like the 1600 look, it is a bit painterly too me. In general, I have read on this forum that low light performance is better than the M8, but I could not compare myself.
As for low ligh, I would stay pretty good up to 800 as the grain is pleasing.
1600 loses a lot of sharpness but the grain does not look as "electronic" as other devices. Hot pixels are also more present at 1600. But still, I like the 1600 look, it is a bit painterly too me. In general, I have read on this forum that low light performance is better than the M8, but I could not compare myself.
Tuolumne
Veteran
I almost always shoot my R-D1 at 1600 for theater photography. Results are fine. I sometimes use Noise Ninja to clean things up, but it isn't necessary. NN removes almost all the noise without objectionable softening. I just run it in auto mode. Personally, I would buy a new R-D1 from Matrsuiyastore on eBay.
/T
/T
morgan
Well-known
I think up through 800 the images are great. I'm finding 1600 a mixed bag. Some are usable and fine, some not. I've been going with a slower shutter speed on 800 whenever possible. But the noise itself isn't unpleasing, especially in b&w. I still prefer fuji 1600 though.
sonwolf
Established
If you can afford the new price, I would probably choose that option. Just be prepared for even the new unit to have problems. I purchased a new R-D1 and straight out of the box the rangefinder was misaligned.
The R-D1's low light capabilities are a mixed bag. Noise levels are relatively low at 800 and moderate at 1600. The levels are still higher than the better current DSLR's. Noise patterns are better visually integrated, more like film grain, than many other digital cameras. Here is a web page with ISO comparison images: http://www.trustedreviews.com/digit...1/08/Epson-R-D1-Digital-Rangefinder-Camera/p5
In my experience and personal testing, the R-D1 falls short of its ISO rating in Tungsten environments. My Canon DSLR produces a higher exposure level at the same settings. On the plus side, there is a great selection of fast lenses available so the ISO deficiency can easily be equalized.
Under Tungsten lighting, especially with a very low color temperature, the R-D1 can display unbalanced colors. Even when white balancing with a gray card, the image will display color casts. For example, neutrals will not balance and very dark and black objects can show a magenta cast. All of these problems can be corrected in Photoshop.
Despite these problems, I use my R-D1 regularly in low light environments and pleased with the results.
The R-D1's low light capabilities are a mixed bag. Noise levels are relatively low at 800 and moderate at 1600. The levels are still higher than the better current DSLR's. Noise patterns are better visually integrated, more like film grain, than many other digital cameras. Here is a web page with ISO comparison images: http://www.trustedreviews.com/digit...1/08/Epson-R-D1-Digital-Rangefinder-Camera/p5
In my experience and personal testing, the R-D1 falls short of its ISO rating in Tungsten environments. My Canon DSLR produces a higher exposure level at the same settings. On the plus side, there is a great selection of fast lenses available so the ISO deficiency can easily be equalized.
Under Tungsten lighting, especially with a very low color temperature, the R-D1 can display unbalanced colors. Even when white balancing with a gray card, the image will display color casts. For example, neutrals will not balance and very dark and black objects can show a magenta cast. All of these problems can be corrected in Photoshop.
Despite these problems, I use my R-D1 regularly in low light environments and pleased with the results.
Tuolumne
Veteran
Note on rangefinder alignment. The R-D1 is manufactured by Cosina-Voigtlander. I have always had problems with their out-of-the-box RF alignment, even on their film RFs. So, this is just a problem you have to live with. You can fix it yourself, or any competent RF repair person can fix it for you.
As fas as white balance goes, the R-D1 will give you much better tungsten balance if you set the color balance for tungsten, rather than auto white balance. The tungsten setting is much better and more reliable than the auto setting with indoor lighting. On the other hand, with heavily mixed lighting, sun, tungsten and fluorescent, the "A" mode is very good. Better than the"A" mode on many high-end dSLRs.
/T
As fas as white balance goes, the R-D1 will give you much better tungsten balance if you set the color balance for tungsten, rather than auto white balance. The tungsten setting is much better and more reliable than the auto setting with indoor lighting. On the other hand, with heavily mixed lighting, sun, tungsten and fluorescent, the "A" mode is very good. Better than the"A" mode on many high-end dSLRs.
/T
morgan
Well-known
I'll also throw in that I dial in some exposure compensation. It always seems to be about 2/3 under...
sonwolf
Established
I agree using the Tungsten White Balance setting in a low color temperature environment is the best option, even if you are shooting Raw. This provides better histogram accuracy.
The color problems, in low Kelvin lighting, I was referencing transcend the white balance setting on the camera. Even shooting Raw and using a Macbeth Color Checker or WhiBal card for white balancing, I find the R-D1's images display greater color error than my comparable Canon Raw images.
EtoileFinder
Established
Thank you all for your answers. Finally I order a new r-d1 from matsuyastore. Now, I will eat macaroni and chesse for months. I'm broke. Just hoping that the purchase was not a mistake.
Gid
Well-known
I'm sure you will be very happy with your RD1. I've had mine for three and a half years with no problems apart from VF/RF alignment which is a quick and easy DIY fix. As far as high ISO is concerned, 1600 is usable, especially in B&W. It is very much better than the equivalent on the M8 (I know because I have had both). As far as the Canon comment above is concerned, Canons tend to be about a third stop more sensitive than their stated ISO and this would account for a difference in exposure readings. As far as exposure is concerned, the RD1 has a tendency to under expose by about 2/3 of a stop.
FWIW most of the images in my RFF gallery are from the RD1.
Enjoy your new camera.
FWIW most of the images in my RFF gallery are from the RD1.
Enjoy your new camera.
mobilexile
Well-known
I bought mine from from them four weeks ago. Never looked back. It's a great camera. You'll be happy.
MCTuomey
Veteran
my take on the metering is that the r-d1 underexposes in low light conditions by about 2/3 stop. not so in average or bright light, where it seems about right (no e/c needed). which means i can't just leave the ec at +2/3. strange, but that's what i've found.
good luck with your new camera ... and your temporary diet. i wish i could say i sacrifice for my art, when it's really just for my gear ...
good luck with your new camera ... and your temporary diet. i wish i could say i sacrifice for my art, when it's really just for my gear ...
ampguy
Veteran
tomasis
Well-known
look at the picture at Leica M thread "show your leica". I did take this shot on m3 at iso 3200 (pushed 1600 a stop). Rd1 can do usable iso 3200 but sometimes I get vertical "banding" in out focus areas.
ampguy
Veteran
pphuang
brain drain...
Set at 1600 and underexpose by 1 stop (exposure compensation by -1), then "push" the exposure in software...
ampguy
Veteran
RIVI1969
Established
These are shots I took last Thursday at iso 1600 with my R-D1 and the 50mm Leica Summicron wide open at f2. I never use any kind of noise reduction at all since I love the natural coarse look of the files. I am having a blast with my camera and I hope you enjoy yours too!
Cheers
Ricardo
Cheers
Ricardo
Attachments
__hh
Well-known
Ricardo,
those low light pics are great.... I gotta be more confident with my R-D1s and not be afraid of noise .... and when all else fails, convert them to B&W!!!
Thanks for the 'inspiration'.
those low light pics are great.... I gotta be more confident with my R-D1s and not be afraid of noise .... and when all else fails, convert them to B&W!!!
Thanks for the 'inspiration'.
RIVI1969
Established
Hunghang, thank you very much, I am glad you like those pics.
Yes, you can be confident using the whole iso range with no problem. Just remember to use RAW to really squeeze all the juice from your sensor and get a wider tonal range and a more analogue look in your images. The jpgs at iso 800-1600 will have that ugly watercolor effect that most people hate so much!
Cheers and post some images with your new camera! did you decided what lenses are you going to use?
Ricardo
Yes, you can be confident using the whole iso range with no problem. Just remember to use RAW to really squeeze all the juice from your sensor and get a wider tonal range and a more analogue look in your images. The jpgs at iso 800-1600 will have that ugly watercolor effect that most people hate so much!
Cheers and post some images with your new camera! did you decided what lenses are you going to use?
Ricardo