Proud to be an American

[Keith]

Population in the US is given as 203million in 1970 and ~280million in 2010. So population growth would trend school bus fatalities to increase unless some other mechanism were at play. Given the dramatic reduction in fatalities, it is reasonable to assume that new laws regarding school bus safety have a positive effect.

The population of the EU is given as 500million.

I asked the European group about their numbers. Unless someone believes that they are off by a factor of 5, the fatality rate of children riding buses in the EU is much higher than the US.

This thread got strange within the first page. But I learned that stopping for school buses is something to be proud of.

You're forgetting that due to constant computer gaming children generally have much faster reflexes these days!

 

[ferider]

Population in the US is given as 203million in 1970 and ~280million in 2010. So population growth would trend school bus fatalities to increase unless some other mechanism were at play. Given the dramatic reduction in fatalities, it is reasonable to assume that new laws regarding school bus safety have a positive effect.

The population of the EU is given as 500million.

I asked the European group about their numbers. Unless someone believes that they are off by a factor of 5, the fatality rate of children riding buses in the EU is much higher than the US.

This thread got strange within the first page. But I learned that stopping for school buses is something to be proud of.

There might be other things at play, Brian:

1) soccer moms driving their kids.

2) I used to take a Bus to school in Germany. Most "school buses" in Germany are either from the Railway (DB) or from the Post (BP), are shared between school kids and other passengers, and they stop at designated stops - rarely in front of schools. Same is true for other European countries. It's a very different system, embedded in the general public transportation which practically does not exist in the US.

Regarding patriotism, maybe we need a poll "How many languages do you speak, and where do you live ?", do put things in perspective.

Roland.

 

[raid]

Saddam Hussein threatened to switch from US$ to EURO for oil deals. Look what happened to him.

Europe will not be allowed in the next 20 years to use the EURO for oil.

 

[raid]

There might be other things at play, Brian:

1) soccer moms driving their kids.

2) I used to take a Bus to school in Germany. Most "school buses" in Germany are either from the Railway (DB) or from the Post (BP), are shared between school kids and other passengers, and they stop at designated stops - rarely in front of schools. Same is true for other European countries. It's a very different system, embedded in the general public transportation which practically does not exist in the US.

Regarding patriotism, maybe we need a poll "How many languages do you speak, and where do you live ?", do put things in perspective.

Roland.

So did I, Roland.
When I was ten years old, I would each morning walk to a bus station close to the Bonn Bahnhof (railway station),and I would take a bus or a streetcar to Bad Godesberg. It was a regular public transportation bus or streetcar and not one for schools.

I went back over 40 years later. There was a kiosk on the way from the bus station to our home,and it was still there.

 

[TXForester]

You're forgetting that due to constant computer gaming children generally have much faster reflexes these days!

Maybe, but they aren't running across the highway from the bus on their thumbs. 😉

 

[Ranchu]

The Chinese need to purchase US debt to continue their mercantilist currency manipulations. If they stop rolling it over they will kill their imports, which they knew going in. The people who made those decisions never expected to get their money back, no matter how they posture. What's it to them? They just printed up the money they used to buy the debt in the first place.

Basically they got our manufacturing jobs, and we got free stuff. When it comes down to it, we don't need them to buy our debt as much as they need exports, and we have a press of our own and plenty of smarts, guts, and farmland.

🙂

No worries, man.

 

[atlcruiser]

Yes, but if 'being a part' is sheer accident, what is there to be proud of? It's like saying "I'm ashamed to be an American," an equally meaningless association of person and place. By all means be proud of what you've done, or even of an organization you joined voluntarily and support (I'm moderately proud of being a Fellow of the Royal Society of Arts), but I find it odd to be proud of being something that you are, without any effort on your part, and that you don't even necessarily agree with all the time.

The same, of course, goes for being ashamed.

Cheers,

R.

Interesting.....accident? A car hitting me as I cross the street is an accident.

My fathers family came here the 1750s to work for the crown then fight against it, his mothers family fled Ireland at the turn of the century for opportunity available here, my mothers father was born in Poland yet came here through Ellis Island to have a better life, my mothers mothers family was German/Polish...lost their land in one of the many eurpoean wars and fled here to get a new start in the 1880s, My girlfriend Loris' family fled Italy during the pre WWI economic crisis to come here for greater opportunities. None of those actions were accidents. They were decisions made in a effort to better themselves and their family.

I am proud of their work and I am grateful that their actions, decisions and hard work made it possible for me to be born in this country. None of that was an accident.

 

[bigeye]

Each American embassy comes with two permanent features – a giant anti-American demonstration and a giant line for American visas. Most demonstrators spend half their time burning Old Glory and the other half waiting for green cards. - PJ O'Rourke


.

 

[Rayt]

Each American embassy comes with two permanent features – a giant anti-American demonstration and a giant line for American visas. Most demonstrators spend half their time burning Old Glory and the other half waiting for green cards. - PJ O'Rourke


.

That was more or less Pat Buchanan's argument against Mexican immigration (legal and illegal) that the Mexican aliens are not patriotic by cheering for the Mexican team and not the US team during soccer games.

 

[jan normandale]

Yes, you just fabricated your own back story as a setup for a mini-rant against bankers, LOL! 🙄

no I don't think so. I think the media boys are on a continuing saga on this one from Goldman Sachs, GM, to Bank of America. I happen to be in this community and it's a fact. Frankly I'm astounded by how this continues. "Those that fail to learn from history are doomed to repeat it" or something like that.

Flip side to your comment is that Brian Sweeney talking about school bus accident stats is also a "set up". I'd suggest you like the "it's all about me / America thing" and want the flag waving to continue

Then again maybe you're one of the lenders/Wall Street Investment dealers and you're touchy about the subject.

LaL, rolls eyes

 

[Bill58]

The more I spend out of the good ole' USA, the more I appreciate the country (esp. Texas) and it's fine people. I took a lot for granted during the 55 years I lived there--no more.

 

[kossi008]

You're forgetting that due to constant computer gaming children generally have much faster reflexes these days!

But they probably think they have several lives, then?

 

[Gabriel M.A.]

A lot of Europeans act like they can't wait to see the USA and our people reduced to poverty.

Emm...is this because you know a lot of Europeans, or because of what you read about what they think they think? Somebody just pointed out that your comments about Indiana, living there, don't mesh with those heard outside of Indiana. Perhaps...maybe...it's the same with "Europeans" and factories "going" to China and Mexico (it's China and India, btw...the Mexico thing was a crying rally by business-friendly politicians in the 90s...which is why China and India seemed "so far away" and not being "across the border" and hence more politically palatable).



Why do these discussions spiral down towards the Yankees vs. Red Sox arena?

 

[kossi008]

A lot of Europeans act like they can't wait to see the USA and our people reduced to poverty. I think that you're right, Fred, that it will damage everyone if the USA 'falls'. Even if it didn't hurt them, it is sad to see people wishing to see others suffer.

Well, if I may speak for the German part of Europe, I think this is not true at all. Germans, as a rule, like Americans, and even those who don't very much look over the ocean in concern about the USA's economical and political problems.

+1 on that. Couldn't let it stand as Chris stated it.

 

[Jamie123]

What I find funny about Americans and patriotism is that this usually not only means loving the US but also having the firm belief that the US is the greatest nation on the planet. When you watch presidential campaigns it is a given that each candidate states this belief clearly.
But what the hell does it mean for any country to be the greatest in the world? Greatest in what?

Even though I find this kind of patriotism highly ridiculous I have nothing against America or Americans at all and I certainly do not enjoy seeing anyone suffer.

 

[Paul T.]

Europeans and others would have to admit that they find this notion of Americans, that their country is special, unique, somewhat irritating. Maybe it's more irritating because it is obviously, to some extent, true.

But of course, like anything, you need to be careful to don't believe your own press.

 

[Sonnar Brian]

You're forgetting that due to constant computer gaming children generally have much faster reflexes these days!

That and European cars have gun sights for hood ornaments.

I will add that to my suggestions to the European consortium for making school bus rides safer.

 

[Roger Hicks]

The number of school bus related deaths in the US is quoted as being reduced by about 2/3rds since 1975 in the US. Population is up, that is an impressive reduction.

From this quickly googled source, it looks like kids in the US are safer on a school bus than other modes of travel:

http://www.trb.org/Main/Blurbs/The_Relative_Risks_of_School_Travel_A_National_Per_161028.aspx

From a second source regarding fatalities in the US, showing a large drop since the 1970s:

http://www.schoolbusfleet.com/Chann...02/23/Big-jump-in-danger-zone-fatalities.aspx

Statistics on the European fatalities are not as easily found. I can keep checking.

I will Email the European group and ask them why they have not suggested having drivers stop for school buses.

Dear Brian,

One reason may be that dedicated school buses, painted yellow, etc., are extremely rare in most of Europe. Many pupils still use ordinary public transport (and you can't really ask drivers to stop for ALL buses) and many 'school' buses are just ordinary buses chartered to carry chidren twice a day.

In other words, I'm not sure that the figures could be gathered, let alone that they have been gathered.

Also, on further thought about saving children's lives, I realized that the adoption of the sort of 'simple, commonsense law' that another poster suggested would, for most Europeans, include the establishment of a National Health Service. We are all shaped by our history...

Cheers,

R.

 

[pakeha]

Perhaps a change is a comin
3rd Paragraph `the gates doctrine


http://english.aljazeera.net/indepth/opinion/2011/06/201162812411022924.html

 

[Roger Hicks]

Interesting.....accident? A car hitting me as I cross the street is an accident.

My fathers family came here the 1750s to work for the crown then fight against it, his mothers family fled Ireland at the turn of the century for opportunity available here, my mothers father was born in Poland yet came here through Ellis Island to have a better life, my mothers mothers family was German/Polish...lost their land in one of the many eurpoean wars and fled here to get a new start in the 1880s, My girlfriend Loris' family fled Italy during the pre WWI economic crisis to come here for greater opportunities. None of those actions were accidents. They were decisions made in a effort to better themselves and their family.

I am proud of their work and I am grateful that their actions, decisions and hard work made it possible for me to be born in this country. None of that was an accident.

Dear David,

You must surely know the phrase, "an accident of birth". Through an "accident of birth" my brother has dual Maltese and British nationality (born in Malta to British parents, father serving in Royal Navy). YOU personally had nothing to do with where YOU were born. By all means be proud of what your forebears did, but pride in where you were born? That's pretty weird and irrational.

And I know it is. As I said in another post, I'm glad to be a Cornishman, and feel sorry for others who do not have that good fortune. As soon as I examine my own feelings, though, I can see that for the joke that it is. We are all capable of irrationality. It's just that some of us are also capable of recognizing it when we think about it.

Even when I was a child, the following R.L. Stevenson poem from the 19th century was regarded as a textbook example of how silly it is to imagine that our own society is the summa summarum of the world.

LITTLE Indian, Sioux or Crow,
Little frosty Eskimo,
Little Turk or Japanee,
O! don’t you wish that you were me?

You have seen the scarlet trees
And the lions over seas;
You have eaten ostrich eggs,
And turned the turtles off their legs.

Such a life is very fine,
But it’s not so nice as mine:
You must often, as you trod,
Have wearied, not to be abroad.

You have curious things to eat,
I am fed on proper meat;
You must dwell beyond the foam,
But I am safe and live at home.

Little Indian, Sioux or Crow,
Little frosty Eskimo,
Little Turk or Japanee,
O! don’t you wish that you were me?

Finally, the whole idea of "leaving for a better life in America" can quite easily be turned on its head. Perhaps there are those who are proud that their ancestors didn't run away to a foreign country, but stayed and built the nations in which they were born. Put like that, it sounds like an insult. But then, "America is the greatest" can sound like an insult too, if it carries the implication that all other nations are inferior.

Cheers,

R.