QL17 G-III film advance problem

[denS]

Just recieved the camera. It's clean looking, New light seals (I replaced). Problem is : Put film in,wind 4 times until stops,fire shutter,hear click.Try to advance film but thumb winder will not allow.
Also when loading film the indicator(little window with "Barber Pole" red stripes) only "wiggles" when advacing to first frame. The frame indicator starts at "S" and I'd say 1/2 way to"0". The frame indicator,after winding the 4 times to load stops at "2" rather than the "dot" between "0" an "2"......The shutter can be fired at this point but the thumb winder "locks" and can't advance film any further.
Looking from back(door open) I can see the shutter open at aprox.correct speed.
From front looking into lens.Can see Aperature blades open and close as I turn ap. ring. After releasing the shutter the Winder Advance problem occurs the Aperature blades will only close up at this point and will not open again until I open door and reset camera.Then work fine until I fire shutter...etc
Do I need to Clean (Napha) or any thing else ???

 

[denS]

In addition just noticed that the jambing occurs only after I have advanced the winder the 4 times it takes to load the film....So,Open door/close,wind one time =shuter will fire advance thumb winder once more,shutter will fire,repeats up until the 4th wind then locks and shutter will not fire and thumb winder will not advance film.

 

[denS]

Thanks Greyhoundman....I'll follow up on your suggestions. Thanks for the link to drawings and inside pic's

 

[Krasnaya_Zvezda]

This "Thrift Store Find" QL17 I got yesterday does something similar: Winds ok for a few frames (I don't think it's a specific number) then locks. If I then put a little pressure on the back, just where my left thumb goes while shooting, it frees it up! Then shoot--shoot--shoot---lock---thumb pressure---wind, etc. Weird, but I can live with it.

 

[Krasnaya_Zvezda]

I'll check that out. I had already decided to go ahead and replace the seals anyway. Thanks for the tip.

 

[Canon Junkie]

I had this with my QL-17 GIII. Mine was problem with the SELF TIMER. The same exact lock would happen until the film door was open.... Then again, wind 4 times, fire... locks again. Anyway, make sure the self timer is all the way down. If it is, the problem is something else, if not, try flushing through the hole with a bit of ligher fluid while jenty wiggling the self timer back and forth... it may release. If it doesn't release, you can force it down until the shutter fires, but then your self timer is gone forever....

 

[denS]

Canon Junkie,
I will give this a try and report back....sounds good to me.Thanks
denS

 

[denS]

This "Thrift Store Find" QL17 I got yesterday does something similar: Winds ok for a few frames (I don't think it's a specific number) then locks. If I then put a little pressure on the back, just where my left thumb goes while shooting, it frees it up! Then shoot--shoot--shoot---lock---thumb pressure---wind, etc. Weird, but I can live with it.

The counter reset is likely your problem.Open door look under area of film advance lever. you will see a small slot at the top inside the opening were the door fits when closed...Make sure when you do the re-seal not to cover it.
denS

 

[Krasnaya_Zvezda]

The counter reset is likely your problem.Open door look under area of film advance lever. you will see a small slot at the top inside the opening were the door fits when closed...Make sure when you do the re-seal not to cover it.
denS

Probably so, since the self-timer on mine is all the way down... I thought maybe Canon Junkie's idea might apply to me, since I had messed with the ST to see if it worked when I first picked up the camera, but no, it's as far down as it gets. I'll see if anything is impingeing on the counter reset when I get this roll out.
Thanks for the suggestion.

 

[Krasnaya_Zvezda]

Upon further investigation, I find that my camera's problem and the one of denS are probably related. I removed the film in the camera. Examined the counter reset, could see nothing amiss. Left the back open, wound and fired the shutter 50 times without a hitch. Now, close up the back, wind and fire 4 times as described by denS, and the wind locks. I just give the back a little pressure as described before, and it winds. NOW what I notice is the small square window below the wind lever. As I understand it, this is to show red when ready to shoot, and white when the shutter is not cocked. What I see is white when I first close the back, a small amount of red after one wind, a little more after two--- after 4 winds, full red and the wind lever locks. I further noticed that when I sat the camera down in order to type this, the red window mysteriously turns white, so... repeat the experiment, this time a little tap on the bottom when the winder locks, , window shows white after the tap, and it winds.
As greyhoundman surmised, the back is slightly bowed, I believe, at least there is certainly a small amount of play. Clearly pushing in to straighten this out has something to do with the solution.
Unless there is a very simple repair involved in this, I'm not going to mess with it, since I can easily get past the problem (not by banging on it, though!), but I would be interested in what is causing this.

 

[Krasnaya_Zvezda]

I believe it is indeed the counter reset button not being held in far enough by the door. It's engaged enough that the counter doesn't reset, but not enough to work properly.
I opened the back of the camera as before and wound/fired to my hearts' content. Then I used the side of a paper clip to hold in the counter reset, still worked fine. Closed the door, which should do the same job, but no; not unless I apply a little pressure on the door when I wind.
Maybe someone has an idea for a fix on this. I don't think I want to go bending on the door, like I said, I can live with it.

 

[Fedzilla_Bob]

An idea-- glue a small bit of plastic right where the door meets the counter rest tab. Or, adhere two or three small pieces of electrical tape in the same location.

I know its a pretty small space, but maybe you can cut it with an Xacto or something similar.

 

[Krasnaya_Zvezda]

An idea-- glue a small bit of plastic right where the door meets the counter rest tab. Or, adhere two or three small pieces of electrical tape in the same location.

I know its a pretty small space, but maybe you can cut it with an Xacto or something similar.

Great minds think alike (must have something to do with the booze). I intend to do something along these lines when I can open the back again. I threw in a roll of Tri-x last night, got to shoot that up first.

 

[denS]

I believe it is indeed the counter reset button not being held in far enough by the door. It's engaged enough that the counter doesn't reset, but not enough to work properly.
I opened the back of the camera as before and wound/fired to my hearts' content. Then I used the side of a paper clip to hold in the counter reset, still worked fine. Closed the door, which should do the same job, but no; not unless I apply a little pressure on the door when I wind.
Maybe someone has an idea for a fix on this. I don't think I want to go bending on the door, like I said, I can live with it.

This was indeed the problem with my camera....some adjusting took care of the lock-up,but watch that in the prosess you dont adjust so much as to cause a problem with the "Frame Counter"! You may affect the way the prawl that catches the gear on the counter wheel contacts. At first mine didn't count the frame advance then it would not release it when door opened....a little tweking and now all works well
While you have the top off to do thje adjusting.Clean and lube in there. Which I believe was the "Real" problem to begin with...
Good Luck All....and Thanks for all the help.
denS

 

[ftw1952]

Thanks Greyhoundman....I'll follow up on your suggestions. Thanks for the link to drawings and inside pic's

Still have those drawings for I sure can use them too. Having the identical problem with a rare black G-III:bang::bang::bang::bang:

 

[ftw1952]

Just recieved the camera. It's clean looking, New light seals (I replaced). Problem is : Put film in,wind 4 times until stops,fire shutter,hear click.Try to advance film but thumb winder will not allow.
Also when loading film the indicator(little window with "Barber Pole" red stripes) only "wiggles" when advacing to first frame. The frame indicator starts at "S" and I'd say 1/2 way to"0". The frame indicator,after winding the 4 times to load stops at "2" rather than the "dot" between "0" an "2"......The shutter can be fired at this point but the thumb winder "locks" and can't advance film any further.
Looking from back(door open) I can see the shutter open at aprox.correct speed.
From front looking into lens.Can see Aperature blades open and close as I turn ap. ring. After releasing the shutter the Winder Advance problem occurs the Aperature blades will only close up at this point and will not open again until I open door and reset camera.Then work fine until I fire shutter...etc
Do I need to Clean (Napha) or any thing else ???

If you look at Rick oleson's webpage on this camera you will see an article on the film lock device. It can be adjusted by about anyone with some knowhow and the right tools needed. The tang that moves at the lower part near the base of the camera presses on an arm that extends to the top section near the meter. That in turn presses the gateway lever to lock and unlock the film lever. Only way to show you this is impossible now unless I had one completely apart

 

[ftw1952]

Probably so, since the self-timer on mine is all the way down... I thought maybe Canon Junkie's idea might apply to me, since I had messed with the ST to see if it worked when I first picked up the camera, but no, it's as far down as it gets. I'll see if anything is impingeing on the counter reset when I get this roll out.
Thanks for the suggestion.

If you look at Rick oleson's webpage on this camera you will see an article on the film lock device. It can be adjusted by about anyone with some knowhow and the right tools needed. The tang that moves at the lower part near the base of the camera presses on an arm that extends to the top section near the meter. That in turn presses the gateway lever to lock and unlock the film lever. Only way to show you this is impossible now unless I had one completely apart