andrew00
Established
Hey,
Apologies if this has been covered already.
I'm looking at buying a M9 and the whole new/old sensor thing is a bit confusing.
From what I understand, Leica were replacing for free (now charging) sensors that showed corrosion.
Corrosion is inevitable at some point, but that it doesn't necessarily mean it will show up within a reasonable timeframe, i.e. it may 'never' appear.
So my question is this: Would you buy an M9 in 2017 that is NOT a new sensor camera? Assuming it does not currently show corrosion.
Or would you stick to new sensor cameras only that have the appropriate paperwork?
Basically I'm coming at this fresh so IDK what the word on the street is and am looking to find out if I should hunt for a regular M9 or stick to new sensor only's.
Cheers!
Apologies if this has been covered already.
I'm looking at buying a M9 and the whole new/old sensor thing is a bit confusing.
From what I understand, Leica were replacing for free (now charging) sensors that showed corrosion.
Corrosion is inevitable at some point, but that it doesn't necessarily mean it will show up within a reasonable timeframe, i.e. it may 'never' appear.
So my question is this: Would you buy an M9 in 2017 that is NOT a new sensor camera? Assuming it does not currently show corrosion.
Or would you stick to new sensor cameras only that have the appropriate paperwork?
Basically I'm coming at this fresh so IDK what the word on the street is and am looking to find out if I should hunt for a regular M9 or stick to new sensor only's.
Cheers!
mlu19
Established
My M9P is getting its sensor replaced at the moment. My M9P was 'freshly' upgraded back in 2014, and was mindfully cared for. If I were you, I would not be buying one with an old sensor unless you can find one price adjusted for that... Sooner or later, the sensor is bound to have the corrosion problem.
x-ray
Veteran
The new sensors haven't had enough time to prove themselves yet. Also you're buying a camera that has a tiny buffer, poor LCD and has had numerous other problems. In digital years the M9 is ancient.
Ko.Fe.
Lenses 35/21 Gears 46/20
I have seen M9 with new new sensor, which is not supposed to corrode for $2800, if not lower.
Good price, IMO, for digital M camera with new sensor and after service.
And I don't think it is hard to get one under this price. Just wait and keep on checking here and where.
Another option is less than five years old M-E and they will still replace it free (under current promise).
Also, if buying with old or new, but not new new sensor option is considered, here is location and from whom it is purchased factor.
I know in Moscow, they help Leica owners at local official location. Cameras are inspected and if necessary replacement is handled with Wetzlar. If you in Europe, it is also done in Wetzlar.
But if you register it and for the service it is NJ, it might take longer time and with not so much of communications.
Good price, IMO, for digital M camera with new sensor and after service.
And I don't think it is hard to get one under this price. Just wait and keep on checking here and where.
Another option is less than five years old M-E and they will still replace it free (under current promise).
Also, if buying with old or new, but not new new sensor option is considered, here is location and from whom it is purchased factor.
I know in Moscow, they help Leica owners at local official location. Cameras are inspected and if necessary replacement is handled with Wetzlar. If you in Europe, it is also done in Wetzlar.
But if you register it and for the service it is NJ, it might take longer time and with not so much of communications.
willie_901
Veteran
Absolutely not.
The root cause of the corrosion is water vapor.
Earth is a water-based planet. People are water-based life forms. Water vapor is truly ubiquitous.
Some corrode quickly. Some don't. Some corrode very slowly.
Sometimes the corrosion is extremely obvious. Or, the corrosion effects can be subtle. Some corrosion is so light it is only seen at very narrow apertures.
But they all corrode. None of them stop corroding.
froyd
Veteran
I think I would pay $1500 to $1800 for an M9 with old sensor and figure that I'll be out another $1000 when teh sensor has issues. Considering that M240 are little above the $3300 mark, I cannot justify the high cost of used M9s despite their more appealing svelte bodies and CCD sensors.
brennanphotoguy
Well-known
I wouldn't pay more than $2200 even if it had a new sensor to be honest. The files are cool but all the usual things that people hate about it play into that price and the fact that M240s are sub-$3k now privately really work against it as well.
Huss
Veteran
Yup and you're dreaming if u think Leica is going to support the M9 series a few years from now. No matter what they currently say - we've seen them already re-neg on their promise for this camera.
brennanphotoguy
Well-known
Fraser
Well-known
Its just as capable now as it was when it was new, as already said unless it was really cheap (£1200-1500) with a 12month warranty then I wouldn't buy one without a new sensor.
It is a quirky camera but I still have and use mine and would never sell it or the 35mm summicron that stays on it 99% of the time.
It is a quirky camera but I still have and use mine and would never sell it or the 35mm summicron that stays on it 99% of the time.
raid
Dad Photographer
I am using an M240 until I get back my M9 from NJ.
andrew00
Established
Thanks for the comments, all good advice.
I'm going to hold out for a well price new sensor, or a cheaper old sensor that incorporates the cost of getting the new sensor.
I'm going to hold out for a well price new sensor, or a cheaper old sensor that incorporates the cost of getting the new sensor.
Rob-F
Likes Leicas
It has things that people hate? Quirky camera? I just felt a disturbance in The Force! My M9, presently in NJ getting its sensor replaced, must have sensed those words!
I can't imagine why the M9, that was a dream camera not long ago, is now hate-able or quirky. What's up with that?
brennanphotoguy
Well-known
Buffer sucks, it eats cards, can't use bigger cards, battery life is atrocious, the rear screen is horrible, etc. Those things were all relevant when the camera came out. Compound those things with horrible customer service and this sensor crap then you have a camera that is a risky purchase. Those are all issues people need to be aware of when buying this camera. I always think I want an M9 till I actually use one again. Personally, I wouldn't consider buying one until they drop below $2000.
Ko.Fe.
Lenses 35/21 Gears 46/20
So, if it is bellow $2000, then all of the problems will be gone.
But if camera is so bad as you describe, it is hypocrisy even to get it for free.
Where is Leica camera without screen and it is cool, yet, Leica camera with very usable screen is not cool.
Where is non Leica, not cheap cameras with less than M9 battery capacity, but it is no big deal.
And even M8 could use 64 GB card...
So, buyer beware of the bias
Agreed... I'd subtract $1000 from any M9 price I would normally pay. The fact that the M240 is sub $3000 makes me feel the M9 needs to be closer to $1500 these days. That's not reality yet, but it could be in the near future.
Fraser
Well-known
I don't mean quirky in a bad way, I still think M9 is great. I think if you want cutting edge technology don't buy Leica!
kipkeston
Well-known
I assume there is a market price for a sensor replaced M9 and a market price for non-replaced M9. Given that it's $1k to replace it, I would estimate the non-replaced price to be somewhere less than $1k of the replaced price (it shouldn't be exactly $1k less unless it needed to be replaced immediately as you get to have a working M9 for some undefined period of time). However the looming inconvenience of replacing it may drive the price down as well.
That said, I think that if you're in the market for an M9 in late 2017 you probably find the files irreproducible in another system (i.e. M240), so its drawbacks compared to more modern cameras is irrelevant.
That said, I think that if you're in the market for an M9 in late 2017 you probably find the files irreproducible in another system (i.e. M240), so its drawbacks compared to more modern cameras is irrelevant.
brennanphotoguy
Well-known
So, if it is bellow $2000, then all of the problems will be gone.
But if camera is so bad as you describe, it is hypocrisy even to get it for free.
Where is Leica camera without screen and it is cool, yet, Leica camera with very usable screen is not cool.
Where is non Leica, not cheap cameras with less than M9 battery capacity, but it is no big deal.
And even M8 could use 64 GB card...
So, buyer beware of the bias
No, it makes the cheap price worth the bull**** that comes with it. That's what we in the real world like to call "value." The camera is not as good as other cameras in it's class and price range. Hence the recent drop in price due to advancing technology. So therefore, to put up with lower technology you should pay a lower price. You say none of these things are a big deal but when you're paying over $2000 for a piece of digital technology that is approaching 8-9 years old they should be a factor in the purchase price. When you want to rely on an M9 for lets say, weddings, you need to be able to have a camera that you're not constantly changing batteries in or locking up on you causing you to remove the battery and turn it back on. Sometimes you need to check critical focus or open eyes in photos.
David Hughes
David Hughes
Hi,
If you look around you'll find someone selling one with a replaced sensor who has decided - whilst waiting - to get something "better" in that line. They (M9's) are cheap enough, handle well and fit almost all the old and new lenses we have.
The quotes around the word are because the M9 is more than adequate* to 99% of the population. Not all of us take pictures of black cats in coal cellars and then make posters or billboards.
Regards, David
* The expression "more than adequate" is British and usually means "blooming brilliant" but why not get some samples from all the camera test sites and print them to double check on this old fool's opinion?
And "blooming" is an euphemism...
If you look around you'll find someone selling one with a replaced sensor who has decided - whilst waiting - to get something "better" in that line. They (M9's) are cheap enough, handle well and fit almost all the old and new lenses we have.
The quotes around the word are because the M9 is more than adequate* to 99% of the population. Not all of us take pictures of black cats in coal cellars and then make posters or billboards.
Regards, David
* The expression "more than adequate" is British and usually means "blooming brilliant" but why not get some samples from all the camera test sites and print them to double check on this old fool's opinion?
And "blooming" is an euphemism...