Serious about photography?

KM-25 said:
1. There is most likely not any way I could ever know if I could have made more money in another profession other than photography because it is not a job for me, it is a life and lifestyle choice that pays me full time. Asking me this is like asking me if I could have made more money being another person.

. . .

I would not be nearly as happy doing photography as a hobby and having another job, I simply would have never lived the life I have in doing photography in the first place.
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That's pretty much how I feel, and is perhaps one definition of 'serious'. Far from the only one -- sure, an amateur can be 'serious' too -- but I was (and still am) interested in how others view it.

It sounds as though you've earned more out of it than I, but then, it sounds like you work harder too. As you say, a lifestyle choice. Once I have enough to live on, my motivation to do things I don't want to do (including trying to peddle my work) declines rapidly.

Cheers,

R.
 
I certainly earn more from what I do than I think I could from photography, but I'd love to be able to earn a living doing something I enjoyed.
 
I wish I could earn money as a photographer, but I'm not interested in taking pictures of the stuff people want to pay for. So, coding pays for my hobby. And as a hobby I get to enjoy it at my own pace.
 
I've been working with camera in all my adult life althou i have degree in life science and MBA. The brutal competition in photography is killing me, and finally made a switch to video-related industry. Last year i moved on to fully digital workflow, shooting VDSLR for music videos, wedding cinemas, and training DVDs. The money i made went into several investments in organic farming. So far it seems like a sustainable scheme, at least for me, my wife and son.

I reserve film photography as pure hobby now.
 
_larky said:
I wish I could earn money as a photographer, but I'm not interested in taking pictures of the stuff people want to pay for. So, coding pays for my hobby. And as a hobby I get to enjoy it at my own pace.
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you have no idea how similar that whole statement is for me. i have ZERO interest in taking pictures of what pays. it's a bit of a bugger right now. i find it just gets in the way of shooting the way and subject matter i am committed to. it isn't meant as a criticism of news work... those folks work hard in a pool of sharks where collecting payment owed can be a full time job unto itself. but man, i am not into it these days.

i am (possibly naively) focused on a book and a body of work (few complete stories) in the belief that sticking it out will serve me well. developing a respectable list of exhibitions... that sort of thing. in the end i may just go down in a big financial ball of flames but, i am pretty serious.
 
Ariefb said:
I've been working with camera in all my adult life althou i have degree in life science and MBA. The brutal competition in photography is killing me, and finally made a switch to video-related industry. Last year i moved on to fully digital workflow, shooting VDSLR for music videos, wedding cinemas, and training DVDs. The money i made went into several investments in organic farming. So far it seems like a sustainable scheme, at least for me, my wife and son.

I reserve film photography as pure hobby now.
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the competition AND (should you be in a freelance/agency sort of thing) the editors and outlets that have abandoned the photographers in the process. not all but way too many. i have had people take a damn YEAR to pay me. i sent a complete reportage (photo/text/research) to a magazine that asked me a year later, after a few emails, to 're-file it'?!?! i was asked to put together a portfolio for a BIG outlet. spent days going over it, sent it over and the fella just stopped calling me back or answering my emails

so not only is there THICK competition, the folks that you would assume should be standing in your corner are content to ignore you. even the ones who owe you.

this isn't 'John' beefing, i beefed about 6 months ago. just a 'heads up' i reckon.
 
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I was a professional photographer in the 1980s. It was exactly like being a rock star except for the drugs, the sex and the money. The rock & roll was the same though, because we had some killer speakers in the studio.
 
emraphoto said:
so not only is there THICK competition, the folks that you would assume should be standing in your corner are content to ignore you. even the ones who owe you.
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True, i found similar ethics problem here and there. Are photographers too abundant that agency people can simply ignore our value/existence?
 
well, i have had great relations with one of the big wire/image bank groups here. it has been timely and easy. wish i could say that was the norm.
 
The few times that I got serious and thought about doing photography as a profession, it came down to the fact that I liked the whole process wet and dry and on the professional/commercial side the advice was usually "get a good lab" and don't try to do it yourself kid. The other advice was "if you don't like pleasing others, rather than doing your own thing, go elswhere". I also heard that it was a great way to ruin a perfectly good hobby.
For me it was a good choice to not get involved in the business side of the craft. The scholar side suites me the best and I think it was a good place to be during the digital emergence.
Well, this is the way I see it in my rear view mirror......;)
Bob
 
I have worked in the insurance profession for 32 years and have been an obsessed photo-nut all that time and for years before. When I earned little, I supplemented my salary by shooting weddings and portraits (early 1980s) but I hated it. My passion is landscapes and travel. Without the time and money, getting to places and taking great, saleable shots is very difficult. Without the shots and income from them, it's incredibly difficult to afford to kick the "other" career into touch and develop as a photographer. I'm naturally cautious by nature and the thought of risking everything was anathema to me, even as a young man. Now that I'm 50, married and settled and the world is in a financial pickle, the risks are just too great. Maybe I just missed the boat - but maybe I just realised I wasn't good enough anyway.........
 
1 does not apply
2 hell no: I'm earning good money, and I wouldn't have the patience to be a good enough photographer to make more
3 Only in those moods where I regret everything...
 
I've had a few career goals, the last one I was serious about and was encouraged by others to pursue was being a pilot. I went to flight school and got my private certificate. Then I discovered photojournalism. And I wanted to go to college to pursue that goal. I could no longer afford the time or the money for flight school.

I've made a living as a photographer. Enough to get by and it has been great. I was laid off 3 months ago due to budget issues. And now I find myself with a resume very specific to photojournalism and there is no one hiring. And for me to apply to anything else with my resume would be a joke.

I think I would be happy in either field but I've made my choices and this is how it has panned out. There are a lot of jobs outside of flying for airlines. Delivery companies, charter companies, law enforcement, corporate/private jets. If you get a helicopter rating you can fly tours. I don't think I would have made more money, but there would definitely be more job security.
 
"Job security" - what a wonderful concept. Truth is that you are as safe as management's last bad decision. I'm struggling, aside from plumbers and hairdressers, to think of a trade or profession that hasn't consolidated to a major extent over the past 30 years. It's incredibly difficult not to become hyper-cynical when you hear top brass trotting out the line about "cutting jobs and generating cost efficiencies that will lead to improved customer service". I'm sorry to say that I cannot think of any significant business that's shrunk its workforce and simultaneously improved its bottom line and its customer service.
 
Paul Jenkin said:
"Job security" - what a wonderful concept. Truth is that you are as safe as management's last bad decision. I'm struggling, aside from plumbers and hairdressers, to think of a trade or profession that hasn't consolidated to a major extent over the past 30 years. It's incredibly difficult not to become hyper-cynical when you hear top brass trotting out the line about "cutting jobs and generating cost efficiencies that will lead to improved customer service". I'm sorry to say that I cannot think of any significant business that's shrunk its workforce and simultaneously improved its bottom line and its customer service.
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'Management', by the sort of person who reckons that 'managing' a hospital is the same as 'managing' a widget manufacturing department or a warship.

And probably accountancy.

Cheers,

R.
 
I'm going to answer your questions but first a little context.
I loved photography when I was a teenager so I took a degree course in it and then worked briefly in commercial studios. But my idea of what I wanted to take pictures of and those of the commercial clients I was working with were far apart.
There are lots of contradictions in my experience of photography. Like I learned more in my first 6 weeks working with a pro than in 3 years on my degree. Like I was full of motivation to study it - but the college tutors only asked me what every single image I took meant. 'Yes, yes it looks very nice, but what does it MEAN?'
Having studied Bill Brandt and Walker Evans and Martin Parr & co my first real photography job offer was to shoot hardcore porn in Spain! I fancied the romance of the photojournalist til I met a few of them and they told me life was SH*T! And on and on. The guy I worked for earned £36k in one week of furniture store promo work we did back in 89. So...

1 If I'd wanted to continue advertising work in the studio/in the field I don't think I could have earned more. I'm no medic/architect/lawyer. But I really didn't want it. So earning potential and money wasn't the motivator for giving it up.

2. I'm now a film editor which is not terribly badly paid and has a strong link to photography/imagery and the art of composition (can I say pacing?) within an image. I love editing way more than I ever loved commercial photography. And no one has ever seriously asked me what my editing means... ha ha let them try it!

3. I got a kind of writers block - photographer style as a result of my degree course. I couldn't work creatively because there was always this sniping voice within asking me whether what I was doing was 'meaningful'. and whether I was conveying that meaning. It's a bogeyman I only just decided to shrug off, and still fear if I'm honest. So if I regret anything it's that for the last 23 years - until now - I haven't taken a single photograph in anger.

Discovering film again has been a bloody revelation! And being able to post images on here and actually have people saying they like them is great. I chose the relatively boring life of a film editor (sitting in a small darkened room going over and over someone else's film day after day) and one divorce down I'm not massively keen on dominant career paths - my children are going to grow up and I'm going to be there with them. So I reckon I'm as 'embedded' in family life as any photo reporter so that's where my new photographic career should begin.
 
I have a "fallback degree" and I tried to be a sheep but I just couldn't do it. People in companies are unhappy and only seem to want to argue about the fact that they don't feel coddled. I've zero patience for other people's emotional problems, those corporate types seem to just want to argue about things that don't matter. I also recognized that I would work ten times harder for myself. I completely don't care about how much quantity I have, I care about the quality I have so more money means nothing to me. I live simply and I do my best to save for the lulls in business.

I don't regret photography as a choice one bit. Photography is to me the perfect profession where I get to blend all different talents to produce a product. I have no problem whatsoever taking shots of anything I'm asked to, I consider it a challenge to make it interesting. Photography is pretty much all I care about, all I think about on an everyday basis and can't imagine working for or doing anything else. I'm just hardheaded enough to never give up and I'm going to keep doing it until I make a name for myself. I can't even imagine giving up on my dream.
 
I went the opposite way than you did, Roger.

I studied FA Photography in NYC in my late teens, and later at "elite" universities both here and abroad, but could NEVER envision myself doing it to earn a living. That would have taken all the joy out of it.

Instead I went to law school and became a lawyer, but my first love has always been my photgraphy. I'm good with that, as I probably couldn't earn what I do as an artorney, and practicing as a pro would have killed the love I have for the process.
 
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