Leica LTM Shutter only winds part way - Nicca IIIs

[wern0122]

Howdy all,

Today I got a Nicca IIIs from an ebay listing that said it's in perfect working order, but when it arrived and unpacked it that does not seem to be the case. I'm hoping that there's something simple I need to do to fix it, though, given sage advice from this forum.

The first thing I did when I got the camera was turn the wind knob so that I could fire the shutter, of course, but the wind knob didn't cock the shutter properly! Ahh! The collar around the shutter button turned properly, so it's not stuck in rewind. The shutter speed knob doesn't start to rotate until the very end of the film advance motion, so the shutter only cocks about a quarter of the way. The curtains, likewise, move only about a quarter of the way over from the right. Then, there's a hard stop. Pressing the shutter button then releases the shutter and it the curtains go back to their low-tension position on the right.

Here's a video of what happens:
https://youtu.be/50jinlrEDQY

Any ideas? If this is a simple fix, I'd prefer to just do it myself and have a working camera, rather than sending it back. I've taken apart and fixed a number of issues in a Zorki 1, Zorki 3M, and a Fed 2 (including a jammed shutter on the zorki 1), which are all working and accurate (enough) cameras now. But with this particular issue, I don't know where to start, and if it's a difficult problem to fix then I guess the right thing to do is to return it, since I just got it today. Obviously, if I did something invasive like taking it apart would morally preclude me from returning it to the seller. And, this is my first "nice" (non-Soviet) LTM camera. Please let me know what you think, thanks!

Cheers,
Jeff

 

[wern0122]

Basically: If you think it's obvious what the problem is, and it's fixable, then I'm willing to go ahead and fix it based on advice here. However, if it could be a difficult to fix problem, then I should send it back, which means I should just leave the camera as it is and not try to fix anything. As of now, all I've tried to do is wind it and fire the shutter, so it's still fair to return it as being not as described, I would think. Thank you all so much for your time! I search these forums regularly and I've learned a ton already, tho this is my first post. 🙂

 

[wern0122]

Note to self: If I do end up trying to fix this, it seems likely to be the following mechanism that is messed up somehow:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DGFA1wD2oTQ

 

[xayraa33]

That problem could be as simple as the flat leaf spring at the base of the camera not adjusted properly to the Nicca being taken apart and not put back together properly before you got it, to unglued shutter tapes or curtains...to missing teeth in gears or gears not indexed properly...all problematic to fix yourself and that Nicca model is not particularly rare or super valuable.

Send it back if you bought it as fully working...why go into that boondoggle of taking it apart with a 50/50 chance of resolving the problem.. then the seller will have a right in not accepting it back if it has been tampered with .

 

[wern0122]

That problem could be as simple as the flat leaf spring at the base of the camera not adjusted properly to the Nicca being taken apart and not put back together properly before you got it, to unglued shutter tapes or curtains...to missing teeth in gears or gears not indexed properly...

Thanks xayraa33 - it sounds, then, like this may not be a common easy fix. Your mention of the shutter tapes or curtains being unglued is interesting, because the seller said in the description that they replaced the shutter curtains. So, it's possible something came undone, then...(they do indeed look like nice new curtains!)

 

[xayraa33]

Thanks xayraa33 - it sounds, then, like this may not be a common easy fix. Your mention of the shutter tapes or curtains being unglued is interesting, because the seller said in the description that they replaced the shutter curtains. So, it's possible something came undone, then...(they do indeed look like nice new curtains!)

If they were not glued properly and are unravelling or not made to the exact size then problems will be the rule of the day.

EG: Even if I was a top notch car mechanic and bought a used car described as fully working and with a warranty then it is going back to the seller if it fails the test as fully working, just my 2 cents.

 

[Mr_Flibble]

Also might just be bits of film in the shutter running channels or between the winding gears.

Take a look inside on the side of the take-up spindle, see if anything's messed up with the connecting gears there.


I don't think this is the problem in this case, but I've had winding knobs jam because they were screwed down too deep on the spindle. Or the locking screw wasn't tightened enough so the knob would screw deeper and deeper onto the spindle with use and eventually jam.

 

[wern0122]

Thanks everyone! I just wanted to follow up and record the outcome from this problem. The seller agreed that it was a very unusual malfunction, and asked that I return it for a refund. The shutter wasn't "jammed" - it was the opposite:
winder turned freely but did not catch the shutter or wind it properly. The seller investigated, found that a spring had failed, and he replaced the spring. I bought the camera from him again happily, and it is working amazingly smoothly now, like new!! Happy ending!

 

[Mr_Flibble]

Sweet. Enjoy the Nicca! My 3-F is one of the smoothest operating Barnacks in my collection.

 

[wern0122]

This is a late follow-up post, but just in case the outcome to this problem will be helpful to some random person in the future, here it is!

This winding problem was not due to any kind of common or easily fixable issue. A spring in the shutter mechanism had failed. And, the seller was very understanding and refunded it immediately. He also repaired the camera in a matter of days, put it up for sale again, and I bought it again! (It was seller nordako on the bay of e, if it's okay to mention things like that here?) I'm very happy - it's an extremely smooth, quiet, perfect little leica clone. Since then, I also purchased a Leica iiif BD, but I don't see much of an advantage to the actual Leica other than gaining the 1/1000 shutter speed. Everything else about the shooting experience is absolutely identical. (they're both working great, though, and fun to use!)

Thanks everyone for the advice!