Roger Hicks
Veteran
Dear Nescio, Dear Jan,
Thanks very much for the clarification. My Spanish is abysmal, but good enough to follow the arguments. Yes, 'falta' is probably best translated as 'offence', which (I suspect, being no expert in Spanish law) includes both of what would be called 'non-arrestable' and 'arrestable' offences in English, or 'misdemeanors' and 'felonies' in American.
Is there a Spanish equivalent of the ACLU? Because, with my long-abandoned LL.B. hat on, I'd have though that there's a lot of legal mileage in both "resistencia pasiva, junto a la desobediencia" and "put their lives at risk or endanger ongoing operations".
Once again, thanks ("Cheers" somehow doesn't seem appropriate),
R.
Thanks very much for the clarification. My Spanish is abysmal, but good enough to follow the arguments. Yes, 'falta' is probably best translated as 'offence', which (I suspect, being no expert in Spanish law) includes both of what would be called 'non-arrestable' and 'arrestable' offences in English, or 'misdemeanors' and 'felonies' in American.
Is there a Spanish equivalent of the ACLU? Because, with my long-abandoned LL.B. hat on, I'd have though that there's a lot of legal mileage in both "resistencia pasiva, junto a la desobediencia" and "put their lives at risk or endanger ongoing operations".
Once again, thanks ("Cheers" somehow doesn't seem appropriate),
R.
Nescio
Well-known
Dear Roger,
Thanks for kindly removing your "cheers" signature.
As far as I know there is no equivalent of the ACLU (had to look it up, damn acronyms!) but there are the - rather teethless - defensores del pueblo (ombudsmen). Also, Spain has a Constitutional Court that is widely used and abused to assay any kind of appeal to laws and its amendments. But the judicial system in Spain is also highly politisized... Sometimes they're fast, sometimes ultimately slow. But I have no degree in legal studies so I can be hopelessly mistaken on this.
Thanks again for your interest, keep up the good work and let's see what the future brings us (or will take away). Interesting times for sure...
Nescio (Dutch expat living in Spain, or should I say Catalonia... just like Jan I guess...)
Thanks for kindly removing your "cheers" signature.
As far as I know there is no equivalent of the ACLU (had to look it up, damn acronyms!) but there are the - rather teethless - defensores del pueblo (ombudsmen). Also, Spain has a Constitutional Court that is widely used and abused to assay any kind of appeal to laws and its amendments. But the judicial system in Spain is also highly politisized... Sometimes they're fast, sometimes ultimately slow. But I have no degree in legal studies so I can be hopelessly mistaken on this.
Thanks again for your interest, keep up the good work and let's see what the future brings us (or will take away). Interesting times for sure...
Nescio (Dutch expat living in Spain, or should I say Catalonia... just like Jan I guess...)
Jan Van Laethem
Nikkor. What else?
zauhar
Veteran
As the people in Quebec demonstrated, put enough people on the street and the cops can't do a f-cking thing.
It's like that kid's movie - the grasshoppers are afraid the ants will figure that out.
Randy
It's like that kid's movie - the grasshoppers are afraid the ants will figure that out.
Randy
v_roma
Well-known
Very troubling indeed. Keep us posted, please.
D.J.
-
I'm surprised nobody has mentioned the torturing of journalists and the illegalising of news papers.
It's been going on for years.
It's been going on for years.
Nescio
Well-known
Of course that was my 2nd guess, but by then I had my reply posted already and didn't feel like editing (oh! these arrogant dutchmen again) and went off to the supermarket instead... (if that ever was an excuse, now it hopefully is).
Nescio
Sparrow
Veteran
... I still think she looked better with the mustache and side parting
MartinP
Veteran
Then one gets a knock on the door at 4 in the morning, or unknown people pour 20 litres of petrol through your letter box. Greece is somewhat further advanced in this direction than Spain of course, with the merging of the police force and extremist political groups.
Nescio
Well-known
People do demonstrate, every week or so and there's many of them every month or two. AND get their guts beaten out if they're "at the wrong place at the wrong time". Local governours in Madrid already said that "there's no excuse anymore to say that one was just passing by" if beaten up by the riot squad (paraphrasing by memory). Passers by AND pro photographers have suffered serious eye injury caused by rubber bullets. I know these are called "incidents", but the incidents are becoming more and more regular meat for breakfast.
But I don't want to turn this thread into a political discussion. We're here to discuss about photography and also as a sidekick its limitations imposed by local governments on pushing our innocent triggers (wouldn't be the first time; London subway comes to mind, shooting children etc.).
But I wouldn't mind to go political on another site though.
Nescio
rlouzan
Well-known
The whole thing was triggered by two separate incidents:
1) When some protesters recognized a burly undercover cop, between the crowd, in front of a tv crew.
2) When another, wounded, undercover cop was pinned to the ground by several riot police officers, while he screamed at the top of his lungs that he was "un compañero" - also recorded by demonstrators and tv crews.
1) When some protesters recognized a burly undercover cop, between the crowd, in front of a tv crew.
2) When another, wounded, undercover cop was pinned to the ground by several riot police officers, while he screamed at the top of his lungs that he was "un compañero" - also recorded by demonstrators and tv crews.
Bruno Gracia
Well-known
It's a shame the vision You have of Spain.
I'm spanish, Living in London, and firstly The Minister have to create a project of law, later discuss, aprove... You know, the justice minister is just an ultra catholic men, like the opus dei, is "jesuita".
So please, don't be "scare" about anything, is just an idea. Probably goes to nowhere.
I'm spanish, Living in London, and firstly The Minister have to create a project of law, later discuss, aprove... You know, the justice minister is just an ultra catholic men, like the opus dei, is "jesuita".
So please, don't be "scare" about anything, is just an idea. Probably goes to nowhere.
rlouzan
Well-known
Yeah, let's see how long it takes them to approve it 
.
Robert
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
"Maldita sea la tierra que no le da de comer a sus hijos."
-Mi bisabuelo
.Robert
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
"Maldita sea la tierra que no le da de comer a sus hijos."
-Mi bisabuelo
rlouzan
Well-known
Damaso
Photojournalist
http://elpais.com/elpais/2012/10/18/inenglish/1350588780_276075.html
The director general of police, Ignacio Cosidó, announced on Thursday that the authorities are studying the possibility that the next update to the Public Security Law could include an article prohibiting the recording, processing or circulation on the internet of police officers performing their duties, if doing so would endanger them or the operation in which they were engaged.
The police chief said the reform to the Public Security Law, which is being studied by the Interior Ministry, would seek to “strike a balance between the protection of the rights of citizens and those of members of the security forces. Only in recognition of the immense labor of the security forces are we able to progress toward achieving a more just, safer and peaceful society.”
The reform to the law could also include a penalty for taking part in a protest with a covered face.
.......
After the police chief’s declarations, one of the largest unions, the Unified Union of Police (SUP), expressed its concern that Cosidó’s comments were “wishful thinking, we hope not demagogic, that doesn’t mention how to prevent the recording of images, something that would appear to be impossible in the technological society in which we live.”
The director general of police, Ignacio Cosidó, announced on Thursday that the authorities are studying the possibility that the next update to the Public Security Law could include an article prohibiting the recording, processing or circulation on the internet of police officers performing their duties, if doing so would endanger them or the operation in which they were engaged.
The police chief said the reform to the Public Security Law, which is being studied by the Interior Ministry, would seek to “strike a balance between the protection of the rights of citizens and those of members of the security forces. Only in recognition of the immense labor of the security forces are we able to progress toward achieving a more just, safer and peaceful society.”
The reform to the law could also include a penalty for taking part in a protest with a covered face.
.......
After the police chief’s declarations, one of the largest unions, the Unified Union of Police (SUP), expressed its concern that Cosidó’s comments were “wishful thinking, we hope not demagogic, that doesn’t mention how to prevent the recording of images, something that would appear to be impossible in the technological society in which we live.”
rlouzan
Well-known
Damaso,
He already promised it to police unions.
It's going to be the same as US and UK cops claiming the "terrorist act" to do as they please.
Robert
He already promised it to police unions.
It's going to be the same as US and UK cops claiming the "terrorist act" to do as they please.
Robert
Nescio
Well-known
Well, let's be positive. In some way or another old fashioned M's may well become the photojournalist weapon of the future. Any old Rolleiflex with a long, long cable release, will be greatly apreciated!
Nescio
Well-known
You ought to know beter than that. The way around is called a decreto ley (executive order say's wikipedia).
