Super-XX pan

[rodneyAB]

Just acquired a box of 100 5x7 sheets, unopened, Super XX pan,
Is this maybe similiar to the 135 doubleX your shooting?

😱expired 1981

I suspect it is useless, but I do have a 5x7 back for my KMV, guess I could try it?

 

[Merkin]

how was it stored for the last 28 years?

 

[Gumby]

Golly, that was great stuff. You just nave to try it and let us know how good it still is. Good luck!

 

[Tom A]

Get some Benzotriazole (anti fog) and try out a couple of sheets. You might have to rate it a bit slower than box speed - but with the Benzo you should cut the fog level. As an initial trial, I would rate it @ 125 asa, develop it in Rodinal 1:100 as a stand developer for 60 min. Just add 10ml of 1% Benzo to the Rodinal mix.
I have found that stand developing works well with out-dated film. Super XX was a similar emulsion to the double XX movie stock. Biased towards mid-tones. It is not super fine grain - but with 5x7 that should not be a problem.
If you are using Pyrocat HD - dont use the Benzo - it slows the speed of the film down to a level that makes it unusable. Dont know why? Tri X rated @ 200 still looks 2 stop under!
5x7 looks great as contact print on 8x10 paper anyway.

 

[Freakscene]

All of Michael and Paula's work: http://www.michaelandpaula.com/mp/index_skip.html is done on this film. You can do incredible expansions and contractions with it and it responds incredibly well to pyro, amidol or glycin developers. Fog doesn't matter in 5x7 as long as it is even - you just print through it.

Marty

 

[Tom A]

Marty, thanks for the link. It is amazing stuff.
The Super XX in larger format was a slightly different formula. It was designed to be exposed and "manipulated" heavily in the process. It does take very well to it. I think Ansel Adams used it a lot for some of his stuff.
Years ago I tried it with the waterbath method (2min D23/2 min water/2 min D23 etc). Great tonal range and with larger format and contact print - no grain.
After 20+years the fog will be there and as long as it is even across, no problem - as you say, just print through it. Occasionally I have had sheet film with fog on the edges only and that does show up,
If this film has been kept cold it should be OK - and with a whole box available, it would be easy to establish speed and processing that is ideal for it.

 

[Trius]

Some day I will secretly discover a Kodak mineshaft with a life's supply of Super XX. 😀

I wonder if they would make space available, even rent, in one of their mineshafts?

 

[Tom A]

At least it would be a good place to load filmcassettes. Total, truly total. darkness! I suspect that the stuff stored in the mine-shafts are parent rolls - 4000ft long and 54" wide - you need a really big camera for that. As a guy I once met said (he was using 20x24" film in a converted process camera). "You dont shoot that much, but the contacts are incredible".

 

[Trius]

How about 54" x 54" -- Blad on super-steroids.

But still, if they'd rent me some space for roll film, I could own as much as I needed for the rest of the Earl time-continuum.

 

[Freakscene]

Thanks for the additional info Tom - one major difference between XX movie film and Super-XX is that one of the salts in Super-XX was gold based. As you can imagine it made it expensive to manufacture. The first time I did some analysis on a bit of old Super-XX emulsion I was stunned and thought that the machine was malfunctioning or the sample was contaminated. But it was right. There's gold in there.

There was a guy on the web a while ago who claimed he had found a huge store of Panatomic-X and Super-XX and was looking for assistance to buy and move it. I think maybe it was in Kazakhstan? It sounded like a scam, and no film ever appeared . . .

Marty

 

[Tom A]

Marty, the gold in the Super XX was news to me. Wonder if that would affect longevity and fog levels?
How did you test it? Beckman Spectro or something else?

 

[Freakscene]

Hi Tom,

I used to have access to a gas chromatography mass spectrometer. it's a good way to check on things like "Is Arista premium 400 Tri-X?" (The answer to that one is 'yes'). As i recall iw as trying to prove to someone that movie stock EK 5222 XX was not Super-XX.

Marty

 

[Tom A]

Marty, I think everyone should have gas-spectro system set up. They are fun! I used to work in clinical labs and we stuck all kinds of things in them. However, I never thought of checking film with one! OK, I was strictly a Tri X person back then (early 70's).
I shudder to think what Super XX would cost to make today with current gold prices.

 

[Freakscene]

Hi Tom,

Yes, they are incredibly handy. The silver price is bad enough, without contemplating gold. I don't doubt that the chemistry to make the gold salts was hazardous, to say the least, too.

Marty