The demise of film..has it started?

[wblanchard]

I'm a little nervous for the future of film. I've recently read where Ilford may discontinue PAN F and Kodak is starting plans to phase out film.

Personally, I cannot live without my Ilford or Kodak Portra film and don't want to shoot digital.

Whats everyones take on this?

 

[MP Guy]

It will eventuially happen 🙁 I think there will still be film available but the choice will be much less than what we have now. I am still a film fannatic!

 

[Pherdinand]

One of the problems is, that this is a diabolic circle. People talk about how film has no future and convince themselves/others to quit film and "go digital". Thereofre, film sales and processing possibilities go down, prices go up. Then people say "you see i told you the whole film thing is goin down" and they "go more digital" which drives digital prices down(a good thing) and film prices up. Friends of mine ask me frequently how's that possible that i can find film for my 6x6 TLR's. One of them thought recently about buying a cmaera and he asked me, if he can still get "normal" (135) film at shops and if they still process it "somewhere in town"...They just assume it's old and it's dead.
It's us who decide to kill or not kill film - not the supplying companies.

 

[Honu-Hugger]

Most of the reasonable opinions that I've read suggest that film will remain available for quite some time and that B&W film especially could be profitable for companies smaller than Kodak. I'm not sure if that's much of a consolation, though....

D2

 

[RML]

Don't let those announcements put you down. Better to anticipate the foreseeable future and start loading some other B&W film. Efke is cheap and quite readily available through J&C or FotoImpex in Berlin (check out here: http://www.fotoimpex.de/Home/films/e-127/e-127.html . Fomapan and ClassicPan are also films that get good reviews (check out here: http://www.fotoimpex.de/Home/films/films.html ).

I'm sure you'll like either of these films, maybe even both. 🙂

I think we'll just have to get used to small and reasonably unknown film brands becoming our B&W lifeline.

 

[GeneW]

If there's a market, someone will make film for it. There may not be as broad a range of choices, but I'm confident there will always be a supplier of film.

After all, you can still buy buggy whips, fountain pens, typewriter ribbons, pipe tobacco, tube amplifiers, and even newly-issued vinyl LP records ... 😉

Gene

 

[wblanchard]

Here is something odd and may offer a glimmer of hope. Most digital forums online show people who have the Canon 10ds and other toys are missing film cameras and their simplicity.They are going online to eBay and other shops to buy the classics.

 

[jdos2]

Film will fade but there'll always be a need/use for it in some form or another, and as such, we'll always have a ready supply of *something* with which to load our cameras.

I'm guessing that 135 and 120 will be the sole survivors, after 30 years, and they will be expensive but obtainable. B&W will be the easier to get, but even color will be found, if not slides.

Betcha a buck.

Anyone wanna touch bet? We meet back here in September, of 2039?

 

[Honu-Hugger]

(snip)

However the Leica Digilux 2 analog is tempting... 🙂

I almost jumped in with the Digilux 2, but before I did 5MP became the low end of the specrum for fine cameras and a Digilux 2 replacement was already being discussed -- digital continues to move so fast. Nikon just introduced 12MP with a DX size (2/3 the size of 35mm) sensor, it is rumored that Canon is countering with a 16+MP "full size" sensor next year that will replace their 11MP camera...who knows where the limits will be in the foreseeable future?

Instead of the Digilux 2 I ended up with a Sony DSC-V1; certainly not the equal to the Digilux but still 5MP and a Zeiss Sonnar zoom that performs better than I had hoped. Anything is possible, but for now I am content with this being my only digital camera. Between the camera and PhotoShop CS I have a full plate trying to digest all of this new technology😉

D2

 

[peter_n]

Nah, film's going to be around for a long time. I'm sure Ilford will carry on - maybe owned by somone else - but the brand is almost synonymous with B&W so it's valuable.

As Remy points out, there are also small European brands with high quality that are ready to step in, Efke and Foma to name just a couple. Also Efke is going to be rebranded Adox and the quality is going to improve - Efke sales have tripled over a year according to Mirko who runs FotoImpex. So we're OK for a while... 🙂

 

[digitalox]

I believe the Pan F has been discontinued. But I think that's one of the few if only films they discontinued, there are still lots of others. There's not much we can do about all this. It will continue to be around, but we will continue to see the less demanded items drop off.

By the way, I grabbed the last two rolls of Pan F off the shelves of my local photo store, and will sell them to you for a *small* nominal fee. 🙂

 

[wblanchard]

I believe the Pan F has been discontinued. But I think that's one of the few if only films they discontinued, there are still lots of others. There's not much we can do about all this. It will continue to be around, but we will continue to see the less demanded items drop off.

By the way, I grabbed the last two rolls of Pan F off the shelves of my local photo store, and will sell them to you for a *small* nominal fee. 🙂

I'm a sucker for contrast..I really enjoy my black and white to look black and white and not brown or grey...i'll be in touch about the film once the drought starts on Pan F😀

 

[peter_n]

Pan F appears to be in plentiful supply. Ilford Imaging here in the US says it's "business as usual". You can get a 50 roll brick of 36exp Pan F for $149.50 from B&H in NYC. That's $2.99 a roll.

 

[sfaust]

Yes, its started with a bang in home photography, and even amateur photography. Its taken over press and largely entwined in magazine and editorial photograhy. Its made some in-roads into professional photography, but its far from dead by any means.

Eventually, yea, its gonna be RFs! A small number of dedicated enthusists will still be using it, but the masses would have moved on. But I dont see that for the forseeable future (20+ years). There are lots of markets besides consumer and professional photography, which will keep the supply flowing, but we will loose more and more choices and time goes on.

Films wicked cool. But then, so is digital. And I'm tired of supporting both camps. Eventually, my personal photogaphy will be film, and my professional will be completely digital. Maybe another 5 years, or slightly longer....

 

[wblanchard]

Nah, film's going to be around for a long time. I'm sure Ilford will carry on - maybe owned by somone else - but the brand is almost synonymous with B&W so it's valuable.

As Remy points out, there are also small European brands with high quality that are ready to step in, Efke and Foma to name just a couple. Also Efke is going to be rebranded Adox and the quality is going to improve - Efke sales have tripled over a year according to Mirko who runs FotoImpex. So we're OK for a while... 🙂

I have wanted to try the European brands for awhile now. Can you recommend anything with very little grain?

 

[RML]

Efke KB25 perhaps? The last iso25 film, IIRC.

Besides, grain also depends much on the developer you use and development process you follow.

 

[JohnL]

-- digital continues to move so fast. Nikon just introduced 12MP with a DX size (2/3 the size of 35mm) sensor, it is rumored that Canon is countering with a 16+MP "full size" sensor next year that will replace their 11MP camera...

The Canon 1ds Mk II was announced a few days ago - full frame and 16.3MP. Shipping in November, they say.

Regarding the "film is dying" controversy, I think it depends what you mean. I am certain that film will exist for many years yet, but at the same time it is gradually going to become harder to find and more expensive. As others have observed the diversity of choice will decline. There will probably be a high-price niche market for custom B&W printing services and such things, at least for a while, but film's share of the total market, amateur and professional, will fall inexorably until it ceases to be a part of mainstream photography.
Just my opinion, John

 

[wblanchard]

The Canon 1ds Mk II was announced a few days ago - full frame and 16.3MP. Shipping in November, they say.

Regarding the "film is dying" controversy, I think it depends what you mean. I am certain that film will exist for many years yet, but at the same time it is gradually going to become harder to find and more expensive. As others have observed the diversity of choice will decline. There will probably be a high-price niche market for custom B&W printing services and such things, at least for a while, but film's share of the total market, amateur and professional, will fall inexorably until it ceases to be a part of mainstream photography.
Just my opinion, John

I ordered a Canon D20..I can't afford the one you mentioned. 😉
I'm a wedding photographer and this one will be perfect for me. I did notice when shopping that people were selling their Canon D10 and Nikon D100 for less than a thousand. Digital does not keep a value. My Contax G2 will always sell at a good price..IMO

 

[taffer]

Well, some people even said that rangefinders were a dead market 😉

Honestly, I sincerelly doubt that the latest digital introductions are affecting B&W film market at all, as the consumer market was using mainly 100-400 asa color print film since a bunch of years ago, and even color slides were @rare@ and odd...

Oth, sales reduction on these consumer films, may affect film brands thus making them readjust some production lines, B&W film among them.

But a company producing B&W film exclusively could get IMO a pretty nice market, people using mostly b&w film 5-10 years ago will probably keep using it, maybe digital doesn't make such a huge difference/improvement for them.

Just my 0,01 (the other cent went to some of my cookie crumbs) 😉

 

[SolaresLarrave]

Most of the people who swear film will be out within months forget other countries and continents where digital labs and such aren't as ordinary as in the US. In African and Latin American countries, film is still the way to photograph. So, before we start driving the nails in the film coffin, make sure there aren't forgotten users out there. And not unless digital gizmos go down in price as low as film cameras can do, these emulsions we like so much will continue floating around.

Have a nice day! 🙂