The importance of paper

John Bragg

John Bragg

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Hi, I have recently been using different paper in my Canon Pixma IP 7250 and liking the results. I have been trying Fotospeed Smooth Pearl for Black and White and for a RC paper, the results are very good. I also ran some prints on Ilford Galerie PRESTIGE Gold Mono Silk and the results were even better. In fact so good that they rival my best darkroom efforts. The Mono Silk just seems to have a glow and depth that is lacking in run of the mill photo paper. It is much more expensive, but I doubt I will be wasting much. It is certainly worth it for me in printing photos to display. What are your favorite fine art papers for high quality printing Black and White ? All my images are scans from Ilford HP5+.
 
John Bragg said:
Hi, I have recently been using different paper in my Canon Pixma IP 7250 and liking the results. I have been trying Fotospeed Smooth Pearl for Black and White and for a RC paper, the results are very good. I also ran some prints on Ilford Galerie PRESTIGE Gold Mono Silk and the results were even better. In fact so good that they rival my best darkroom efforts. The Mono Silk just seems to have a glow and depth that is lacking in run of the mill photo paper. It is much more expensive, but I doubt I will be wasting much. It is certainly worth it for me in printing photos to display. What are your favorite fine art papers for high quality printing Black and White ? All my images are scans from Ilford HP5+.
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John, I'm pretty cost-conscious and use non-rag papers, mainly from Red River. I can't live with $3 - 4 per sheet. When you put the print under glass, is that difference still apparent to you?

John
 
I really liked the Ilford Gallerie gold something or other (silk fibre?) I tried many years ago. But it wasn't considered an archival paper.

My favorites since have been Hahnemhule fine art baryta and Epson Exhibition fiber (I'm not sure on the archival qualities of these either, but I stopped caring).

Also I tried a roll of Red River Metallic and that's some really cool paper if displayed with some light.
 
johnwolf said:
John, I'm pretty cost-conscious and use non-rag papers, mainly from Red River. I can't live with $3 - 4 per sheet. When you put the print under glass, is that difference still apparent to you?

John
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Hi John,
I can see the difference. Some papers are out of my reach price wise. I think that 80p or so a sheet is dear enough for my use. Mono Silk is about that and cheaper if you are lucky. The Fotospeed Photo Smooth Pearl is 30p per A4 sheet and it looks great for most uses. The difference in that and Mono Silk is the difference between "great" and "Wow"
 
I usually only print when I have an exhibit or I have sold a print, so I don't worry about the paper cost for my exhibition prints and fine art prints I sell.

My favorite paper for BW is currently Ilford Gold Fibre Silk. I do not use the Mono Silk because that paper uses optical brighteners, which will fade over time. The Fibre Silk has a slightly warmer base tone due to the lack of those brightener chemicals, but I like the look.

If you like a cotton rag paper, or prefer matte surfaces, Epson's Velvet Fine Art is beautiful, and less costly than some other cotton rag inkjet papers. I used it exclusively for many years until the glossy fiber base papers that look like real photo paper came out.

For color, I like Ilford Smooth Gloss. Its an RC paper, but it looks gorgeous.
 
Thanks Chris. Gold Fibre Silk is one to try in the future. I for one am glad that Ilford are back in production. Great paper at a realistic price.
 
When I used to home print ink or color wet darkroom print, the key to not wasting paper was to make a small 4x6 and check color and density.

If necessary, use a corner of 8x10. Then make a second trial in a different corner.
 
John Bragg said:
Hi John,
I can see the difference. Some papers are out of my reach price wise. I think that 80p or so a sheet is dear enough for my use. Mono Silk is about that and cheaper if you are lucky. The Fotospeed Photo Smooth Pearl is 30p per A4 sheet and it looks great for most uses. The difference in that and Mono Silk is the difference between "great" and "Wow"
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Thanks, John. I used to print on Gold Fiber Silk and loved it, but it got too expensive. Maybe I'll try reducing my size.

I like 11x14 a lot, but most vendors don't offer that size. Red River does and I think I'll give their cotton papers a try.

John
 
To me it is two different prints. Not better, or worse, but different. Darkroom and inkjet are very different. Of course, both will be better on quality paper.
To step aside from something obvious, I like my inkjet prints on watercolor pads. Higher contrast and gamma does the trick to make it less grey.
 
My favorite paper when I had my darkroom by far was Kodak elite. It had more silver than most other papers so the stuff you could pull out of the shadows was insane if you had that info on the negatives. I always had sever boxes of grade 2, 3 and 4 on the shelf. In 8X10-16 X 20.

Right now my ink jet fav is Moab Exhibition Luster (Lasal). 13 X 19 and I usually print 12 X 18.
 
johnwolf said:
Thanks, John. I used to print on Gold Fiber Silk and loved it, but it got too expensive. Maybe I'll try reducing my size.

I like 11x14 a lot, but most vendors don't offer that size. Red River does and I think I'll give their cotton papers a try.

John
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You don't really want to print an 11x14 photo on 11x14 paper. You need some space around the image to all for it to be matted and framed, and to allow space for you to sign the print.
 
I print on rag fiber papers--the ones that are presumptuously called "fine art" papers. Not because I think my photos are fine art, I just like the look of prints on matte paper. By the time I closed my darkroom I had pretty much gotten disgusted with the quality of most photographic papers. I just printed on Ilford RC paper in the end because no fiber papers looked as good as the old Kodak Medalist or Kodabromide or Agfa Brovira or Portriga Rapid I had used in the past. In my opinion, today's best inkjet papers look as good as or better than the last good fiber photographic papers I used. I'm really happy to have such a range of choices these days.

My standard paper is Epson Hot Press Natural. It has a smooth matte surface with natural whites. I like the depth of the blacks with this paper. Epson's Velvet Fine Art is a nice looking paper with brighter whites and a slightly textured surface. A few other of my smooth matte favorites, but at higher prices, are Canson Velin Museum Rag (AKA Arches), Canson Rag Photographique and Canson Printmaking Rag (AKA BFK Rives). I will mention Ilford Galerie Prestige Gold Cotton Smooth (what a mouthful!) as another favorite, however, this paper was recently discontinued and I haven't tried the replacement. You might be able to locate some at closeout prices. It was a great paper, extremely thick with great tonality for black and whites. I'm lucky to have a few boxes left.

I don't use much textured paper but when I do it's mostly Epson Cold Press Natural or Hahnemuhle Museum Etching.

Lots of good papers out there to choose from, both rag and baryta fiber types. Best thing to do is just try a lot of them and settle on some favorites.
 
I no longer have a darkroom so I send mine out. I like a (wet) chemically developed prints from a digital file (laser exposed). MPIX has a true Black and White paper that has been great. If others use this method I'd like to know if any other companies do the real B&W paper.

For color I use Costco which also uses wet chemicals on Fuji Crystal Achieve paper. Believe it or not their quality is top quality. I don't know about other Costco stores but the Danville, CA is excellent. Don't use their mail service; not RFF quality.
 
John,

I like Baryta coated papers. My friend Gil at B&H tells me that Canson Baryta Photographique is his most sold paper, but it is cellulose based and not rag. The Canson Platine Fibre Rag has the same look and smoothness, but is a 100% Rag, so in my case I use the Baryta Photographic for work prints and proofing, and Platine Fibre Rag for exhibition prints or portfolio prints. Gil tells me out of all the big players the Canson Baryta Photographique is the most sold paper because of cost and quality.

Richard Rodreguez, the Canson Artist in Residence, taught me the rag papers are really great in a folio because when a possible buyer or art dealer handles and feels the weight and texture of a rag paper that it can be a strong selling point, but behind glass he prints on cellulose for cost savings.

Also Canson makes a new Baryta paper called Prestige that I see as closely related to my other two Canson papers. A bit more heavier weighted and to me a bit smoother finish for added detail.

I print a lot and I like big print size so costs are very important to me. The reason why I stick with Canson Baryta papers is because of costs, but I also like the quality.

Another reason is that Walker Blackwell is a "Canson Head" and also a R&D developer at Piezography. It seems apparent that the new Piezography Pro system glossy is kinda optimized for my choice of papers. The blacks and shadow detail is incredible with the new Piezography Pro inkset/system.

Cal
 
I am another one using Ilford Gold Fibre Silk. I use it for both black and white and colour. I have not heard there were problems with its archival qualities, as Gnuyork mentioned.
 
Good paper and good inks are essential to getting excellent print quality. While expensive if you're printing a lot at bigger sizes, I tend to print to fairly modest sizes ... 6x8 inch image area on 8x10 to 9x15 inch on 11x17. While gigunda sized gallery prints are always impressive to see when done well, I have neither the space to display nor store them. Most of my print sales have been for more modest sizes... Few people have space to display huge prints in my experience; most seem to want fairly modestly sized prints as well.

I like matte surface and cotton rag paper. Some experience:

  • I've got my last few sheets of the original Somerset Velvet to go (11x17 sheets, but a corner has been damaged when the box was dropped, so I mostly print 11x14 sized out of them). A lovely paper but (far as I know) no longer available.
  • Epson Velvet Fine Art is almost as good and is nice and pliable for making quarter page fold-over cards, I use that a lot.
  • The warmth and texture of Hahnemühle Bamboo appeals to me for certain work, as does Epson Hot Press Natural. I use both of those a lot too.
  • Epson Exhibition Fiber prints B&W that is almost an exact duplicate of what I used to produce in the darkroom with Kodabromide Glossy, dried without ferrotyping. Color work on it sings too. Lovely stuff.
  • Ilford Gold Fibre Silk produces lovely results too. I've only used a little of it so far, but I'll probably buy a good sized box of it when I re-stock my paper.

You've got me thinking ... Have to get the printer running and catch up with a few of my newer images. I used to print a few every week, but that's dropped back to about every six weeks in the past half year.

G
 
sevres_babylone said:
I am another one using Ilford Gold Fibre Silk. I use it for both black and white and colour. I have not heard there were problems with its archival qualities, as Gnuyork mentioned.
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Apologies. Disregard my comment. I think I was confusing it with an earlier Ilford paper (Smooth Pearl), which I liked but for some reason I thought it was not considered archival (resin coated?)

Anyway. I have in fact tried one box of the Gold Silk Fiber too, and I recall liking it, but I seemed to have stuck with the Epson Exhibition (which is excellent) at the time. Maybe it was because I could get a better deal on it. I remember doing a inkjet trial pack of Baryta style papers and my favorites still were the Epson and the Hahnemhule, although the latter much more expensive.

I haven't printed in quite a while, maybe I'll give Ilford Silk a try again soon.

Sorry for the confusion.
 
Apology accepted, gnuyork. It's easy to get confused with similar sounding names, and my "I have not heard..." was a concession that I might have missed something. I'm not at home right now, but I know I tried an Epson Exhibition matte paper that was very rich in tone with good shadow detail; I'll check when I get home.
 
I bought a bunch of sample packs from different manufacturers and printed the same image on 20-30 different papers. I settled on Canson Baryta Photographique as being closest in gloss and texture to my fiber based darkroom prints. I usually print either 6x9 on 8x10 and frame 11x14, or 10x15 on 11x17 and frame 16x20.
 
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