abenner
undecided
I'm thinking of getting an S2 to use with the Zeiss 50/1.5 Sonnar. I don't have other Nikon RF gear and don't plan on starting a kit; I have a Leica MP mated to a 35/2 and a CV 15/4.5 on an old Leica III, and the S2+50 would basically complete my setup. I really want one mostly for access to compact Sonnar, and I love the 1:1 finder for the 50mm length.
In the past I have briefly used a vintage SP as well as an S3 2000. I liked the cameras but couldn't stick with the Nikons because I just found it so much more difficult to focus compared to the Leica system. Of course it's tough to find a great finder in a vintage SP but I think my sample was pretty good. The S3 2000 finder was bright but seemed to lack contrast and I found myself searching a lot for proper focus.
I've heard good things about the S2 finder. Simple, bright, nice 50mm lines, 1:1 mag. But I've never seen one for myself and I don't have access to one to try before I buy, so I guess I'm looking for some advice or insight as to what to expect with an S2 finder.
Where does the S2 fit in terms of brightness, contrast, and ease of focusing? Is there hope for me liking it if I couldn't get used to the SP or S3? Is there a lot of variability between old S2's in terms of finder brightness and contrast, as there is with old SP's? If I do pull the trigger, is there anything else I should worry about?
Anybody got an old S2 with a nice finder sitting around they want to part with?
Cheers, and thanks in advance for any help.
In the past I have briefly used a vintage SP as well as an S3 2000. I liked the cameras but couldn't stick with the Nikons because I just found it so much more difficult to focus compared to the Leica system. Of course it's tough to find a great finder in a vintage SP but I think my sample was pretty good. The S3 2000 finder was bright but seemed to lack contrast and I found myself searching a lot for proper focus.
I've heard good things about the S2 finder. Simple, bright, nice 50mm lines, 1:1 mag. But I've never seen one for myself and I don't have access to one to try before I buy, so I guess I'm looking for some advice or insight as to what to expect with an S2 finder.
Where does the S2 fit in terms of brightness, contrast, and ease of focusing? Is there hope for me liking it if I couldn't get used to the SP or S3? Is there a lot of variability between old S2's in terms of finder brightness and contrast, as there is with old SP's? If I do pull the trigger, is there anything else I should worry about?
Anybody got an old S2 with a nice finder sitting around they want to part with?
Cheers, and thanks in advance for any help.
JohnM
Well-known
It's actually pretty good. It's not as bright as the S3-2000's finder, but it solves that camera's biggest issue - a lack of contrast in the viewfinder patch.
Obviously, it's a 1:1 finder with just the 50 framelines. Focusing with both eyes open is nice perk. The finder has a greenish tint to it with the patch being set off with an orange tint. I use mine with the reissued 50/1.4 and think it's very well-suited for use with a fast 50.
Focusing is precise with the long base length. Focus with the wheel or the lens' barrel.
I think you'd be all right with an S2. If not, you can always sell the beast for whatever you paid for it.
Obviously, it's a 1:1 finder with just the 50 framelines. Focusing with both eyes open is nice perk. The finder has a greenish tint to it with the patch being set off with an orange tint. I use mine with the reissued 50/1.4 and think it's very well-suited for use with a fast 50.
Focusing is precise with the long base length. Focus with the wheel or the lens' barrel.
I think you'd be all right with an S2. If not, you can always sell the beast for whatever you paid for it.
Stefcuoz
Established
i'm agree
i'm agree
As johnM have just say, the S2 is probably the " best shoter" in a reasonable range of price, with a bit of luck you can find a good one around 300$.
I have 3 of them, all have a very good shutter, and a good and clean finder... no CLA in the last 20 years!
i'm agree
As johnM have just say, the S2 is probably the " best shoter" in a reasonable range of price, with a bit of luck you can find a good one around 300$.
I have 3 of them, all have a very good shutter, and a good and clean finder... no CLA in the last 20 years!
> Where does the S2 fit in terms of brightness, contrast, and ease of focusing?
A good S2 finder is about the same as a good SP finder. But of course with no parallax correction and just the 50mm bright frame (actually a little tighter than the SP's 50mm frameline).
S2 finders seem to have held up better than vintage SP finders. Of the cameras I've checked, I'd guesstimate that around 75% of the S2s have been ok (25% with faded patches) whereas only about 50% of the SPs have been ok. Some S2's have faded though, so I'd suggest purchasing a camera that you can return if you're not happy with it.
A good S2 finder is about the same as a good SP finder. But of course with no parallax correction and just the 50mm bright frame (actually a little tighter than the SP's 50mm frameline).
S2 finders seem to have held up better than vintage SP finders. Of the cameras I've checked, I'd guesstimate that around 75% of the S2s have been ok (25% with faded patches) whereas only about 50% of the SPs have been ok. Some S2's have faded though, so I'd suggest purchasing a camera that you can return if you're not happy with it.
> I'm thinking of getting an S2 to use with the Zeiss 50/1.5 Sonnar.
That is the setup that I use. The finder is bright. However: you will need to adjust the Shim of the classic Sonnar to focus properly close-up and wide-open on a Nikon. I needs to be moved out about 0.5mm.
Some examples of photo's with lenses adjusted for the Nikon S2 here:
http://www.ziforums.com/showthread.php?t=242
That is the setup that I use. The finder is bright. However: you will need to adjust the Shim of the classic Sonnar to focus properly close-up and wide-open on a Nikon. I needs to be moved out about 0.5mm.
Some examples of photo's with lenses adjusted for the Nikon S2 here:
http://www.ziforums.com/showthread.php?t=242
BTW I had both M-mount and S-mount Zeiss Sonnar 50/1.5s (still have the S-mount version) at one stage and found the S-mount version easier to focus precisely at close distances and wide apertures mainly because of the long focus throw and 1:1 finder. Also, according to Zeiss, the S-mount lenses are optimised for f1.5.
> I'm thinking of getting an S2 to use with the Zeiss 50/1.5 Sonnar.
Vintage or modern version of the Sonnar?
Vintage or modern version of the Sonnar?
abenner
undecided
Modern Sonnar was the plan.
But I was hoping you'd tell me the S2 finder was better than the SP!
>But I was hoping you'd tell me the S2 finder was better than the SP!
It depends on the individual cameras. I have three Sp's with finder patches that are in perfect condition, as bright as an SP-2005 that I handled. Four of my S2's are as good as the SP finders. I had an SP with a patch that was usable, not great. And I have an S2 with a faded patch.
Unless you already have the S-Mount Sonnar, you might be better off with the M-Mount lens and a newer camera. The S2 and Leica M4P are comparable in price. Add in the money saved by getting the M-Mount Sonnar, you could get an M6.
It depends on the individual cameras. I have three Sp's with finder patches that are in perfect condition, as bright as an SP-2005 that I handled. Four of my S2's are as good as the SP finders. I had an SP with a patch that was usable, not great. And I have an S2 with a faded patch.
Unless you already have the S-Mount Sonnar, you might be better off with the M-Mount lens and a newer camera. The S2 and Leica M4P are comparable in price. Add in the money saved by getting the M-Mount Sonnar, you could get an M6.
I agree. Aaron might want to consider hanging onto the M-mount Zeiss Sonnar he's currently listing in the classifieds
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abenner
undecided
I agree. Aaron might want to consider hanging onto the M-mount Zeiss Sonnar he's currently listing in the classifieds
Looks like that's gonna happen whether I like it or not! But that S mount Sonnar is oh so tempting.
furcafe
Veteran
I used to have an S2, sold a while back to backalley/Joe, & have your old SP along w/an SP 2005 & S3 2000, & IMHO, the S2 was about the same as a good SP (for the record, the RF patch & VF on your late-model SP are nearly the same as the SP 2005). Per Jon's recent thread on inserting a colored gel/filter into the VF window of an S3, the S2 has greater contrast between the RF patch & the rest of the VF because of its green VF tint, but that comes @ the cost of a noticeably darker view (no free lunch, etc.). Personally, I'll take the brighter view of the S3 over greater contrast of the S2 because I shoot a lot in dark conditions (otherwise, I would be using a Contax II or IIa), but your preferences, like Jon's, appear to be different.
abenner
undecided
I thought that the finder on the old SP I had was reasonable, but I really just found it difficult to focus outside of bright light, when it didn't matter as much anyway. Of course PJ's have done it for decades with great success, so it probably speaks more to my eyes and RF skills than anything else. I suppose it makes more sense for me to keep my ZM Sonnar and go for an M3, which is arguably the best body for a 50mm anyway.
furcafe
Veteran
I hear you. While it may be "heresy" to say so here on the Nikon RF part of the RFF, I think the Leica M RF/VF is still the best overall of all the great RF cameras, especially for low-light shooting (& the primary reason why I bought into that system). From your perspective, the M3 may also be ideal because of the extra RF patch contrast provided by its slightly tinted VF.
gzuiko
Established
S2 Finder
S2 Finder
Having never used any of the other Nikon Rangefinders I'm at a disadvantage, but I find that my S finder is the best of any rangefinder camera I own, and I own a lot of them. In terms of contrast with the rangefinder patch, it's great in low light and especially outsude where it's bright, which is where most of my other finders get difficult to focus with. I am used to it not being 1/1 now, and that's not an issue. When I hear about the later finders being dim or hard to focus with, I wonder what they did wrong after getting it so right originally...
S2 Finder
Having never used any of the other Nikon Rangefinders I'm at a disadvantage, but I find that my S finder is the best of any rangefinder camera I own, and I own a lot of them. In terms of contrast with the rangefinder patch, it's great in low light and especially outsude where it's bright, which is where most of my other finders get difficult to focus with. I am used to it not being 1/1 now, and that's not an issue. When I hear about the later finders being dim or hard to focus with, I wonder what they did wrong after getting it so right originally...
Any Leicas in your collection? The OP's reference point is an M3 and a special edition MP - the Leicas with arguably the best finders.
I don't own an S, but I've checked quite a few in the stores in Tokyo. They're certainly no better than a good S2 or SP finder in terms of contrast with the rangefinder patch. In fact, I'd rate the SP 2005 as the best overall, followed by a good SP (if you can find one) and then the S2. The average S2 is probably about the same as the average S, but of course you get the 1:1 finder.
Anyhow, I know that the OP recently sold his MP and purchased an SP 2005. So I hope he revisits this thread to let us know how he's getting on. I for one, am certainly interested
gzuiko
Established
Just a IIIa from the 1930's. Not horrible, but not anything like an M Leica I'm sure.
Maybe I got a really good example of the Nikon S, or maybe I'm easy to please?
Maybe I got a really good example of the Nikon S, or maybe I'm easy to please?
abenner
undecided
Anyhow, I know that the OP recently sold his MP and purchased an SP 2005. So I hope he revisits this thread to let us know how he's getting on. I for one, am certainly interested
Hello Jon.
I actually haven't found a taker for the MP yet. It's resting in it's box since I've sold all my Leica glass.
Still getting used to the SP finder. I love the 1:1 magnification, but still find myself hunting a lot for proper focus. With time I think I'll get better...
Let me know if you get any leads on a 105/2.5 Jon.
Cheers.
notraces
Bob Smith
The S2 is a dream to use -- I have several Leica M's - and the MP is by far the best finder -- but the S2 is quite good -- I think it's a lot better than the S3 2000 -- not as good as the SP. I love shooting with the S2 - I have two of them - both just freshly overhauled. The 50mm framelines are perfect for me since I mainly shoot with 5cm glass.
The S2 is a fun camera - I liken it to my M3 - all manual - well-built - good finder - and very dependable.
The S2 is a fun camera - I liken it to my M3 - all manual - well-built - good finder - and very dependable.
David Murphy
Veteran
I think the Sonnar will have noticeable focusing errors on an S2 - A Nikkor 50/2 or 50/1.4 is preferred and just as good if not better in performance (the 50/2 is not very expensive). The S2 finder is OK, but nothing to write home about. Leica M finders far exceed it in performance. Overall though the S2 is a good choice for a classic rangefinder, but I'd not pay more than $500 with a lens.