The "slow" 21mm's - Se 21f3.4/SA 21f3.4/C Biogon 21f4.5 and more

[Tom A]

I have now put 20 + rolls through my Super Elmar 21mm f3.4 and can have some opinions about it.
It is very good, as it should be at $2500+. The MTF curves does not lie - at f3.4 it is amazingly even across the image field. Very little edge fall-off.
It is quite compact, fits the camera and hands very well - and compared to the venerable 21f3.4 Super Angulon - you can actually operate the aperture ring without using foul language!

Before you start asking, I dont see any significant difference between the C-Biogon 21f4.5 and the new Super Elmar 21 - supposedly the Elmar has a bit more distorsion but so far I haven't encountered any significant samples of it.

I thnk the biggest difference lies in that extra 3/4 stop you get with the Super Elmar. We were in N.Y. and Pittsburgh a couple of weeks ago. Pittsburgh was part of the LHSA annual meeting and the big draw for me was a chance to see Frank Lloyd Wrights "Falling Water" house. The interior is a bit "gloomy" and as no tripods are allowed, it was "available darkness" - mostly 1/4s or 1/8s and f3.4 with TriX @ 320.
I will start put up some shots with the Super Elmar and other "slow" 21's.

 

[Tom A]

This is "hope over experience" shot - 1/2 s @ 3.4. I did brace myself against one of the rocks in the wall. Love this staircase too - would take hours to get up as you would find books to read while climbing it!

 

[Tom A]

The living room of "Falling Water" - this shot is a bit deciving as I found the interior of this house a bit cramped and uncomfortable. Low ceilings (7 ft) and narrow doorways - and equally narrow stairs!
The Arts and Craft Movement did some nice stuff - but comfortable chairs was not one of them. Mr Kaufmann of Kaufmanns department store who commisioned the house, evidently brought in some of his own once FLW left the building.

 

[Alnitak]

Nice stuff, Tom. I haven't been able to get one--apparently the first batch were all recalled for some soft of flaw? Is yours a new one post-recall?

Jeff

The first batch could "bind" on some M9's so they recalled the small series that had been shipped and replaced the rear mount. Mine still has the first version mount - and now has become a highly collectible!!!!! There is no difference in performance. Supposedly they are starting to ship them as we speak.
Tom

 

[Tom A]

This is in my opinion F.L Wrights most successful building - The N.Y. Guggenheim Museum.
1/60 and f3.4 in flat evening light.

 

[santela]

These are very nice photos Tom! I'm getting my CB21 tomorrow as there's no way I could afford a $2500+ lens!
Hope to see some colors as well.

 

[Tom A]

Just for comparison, Zeiss C-Biogon 21f4.5 @ 4.5 and 1/15s. Musee De L'Automobile, Mulhouse, France

 

[Tom A]

Old shot with a Super Angulon 21f3.4 - TriX in D76/M4-2.
The SA 21f3.4 is a bit of a "drama" queen among the wide-angles - but it has look that is unique to it. Very sharp center - even at 3.4 - slight softening of the edges and significant vignetting - but who cares - it is a great lens.

 

[Tom A]

From another visit to Musee De L'Automobile. Leica MP and Voigtlander Color Skopar 21mm f4.0. Remembering the lightlevel there, probably at f4 and 1/15s. TriX/D76
The Color Skopar has a bit more vignetting, but less than the Super Angulon 21 - and it is amazingly straight rendering.

 

[Mr_Toad]

.

Snobs! Nary a Ford F-150 in the bunch.

.

 

[sebastel]

the schlumpf's(*) were into bugatti, not ford.

(the schlumpf collection was the starting point of the cite de l'automobile)

 

[Tom A]

.

Snobs! Nary a Ford F-150 in the bunch.

.

But there is a Bugatti pick-up truck in the collection - and i do agree, it does not have the best truck of them all, the Ford 150.
Tom

 

[Ezzie]

You make me miss my 21/f4 Color Skopar, even if it probably has nothing on the Super Elmar. Love the staircase pictures, dark yet fully detailed.

 

[Tom A]

This is with the old Nikon F 21mm f4.0. By using the Voigtlander F-S adapter you can put this lens on a Nikon RF camera. Uncoupled - but with a 21 it is not a big problem, if you stop it down and dont do too close focussing. It is a pretty good 21, some edge fall-off. It is very compact as most of the lens protrudes into the camera and only about 20 mm sticks out - highly pocketable. There is an original version for the Nikon Rf - but it is a/ extremely expensive and b/difficult to find in clean shape. My Voigtlander adapter and the 21f4 in F-mount cost me about 10% what a RF version of this lens would be - and they are very similar in performance!
Nikon S2, Nikkor 21mm f4.0, Kodak 5231 (+X movie stock) in Beutler 1:1:10/6.5 min.

 

[Tom A]

In the 50's the 21 to have was the Zeiss Biogon 21mm f4.5. It was the best available - and even into the early 60's many working photographers were using M cameras, but carried a Contax II/III or a Nikon Rf with this lens on it. Until the arrival of the Zeiss C-Biogon 21f4.5 in M-mount - it was the straight drawing lens of them all. Minimal distorsion and though the new C Biogon improved upon it - it still can hold its own, even against the latest offerings.
Ergonomics "sucked" though. Miniscule engravings, black on chrome (aperture scale) and equally small distance scale! It is also heavy - but that is the build quality - second to none, even today.
Never found a hood for mine - dont even know if there ever was one!
In 1964 we got the Super Angulon 21f3.4 - more convinient - but the old Biogon still gets out now and then.
The shot is of a Camera Obscura at the University Of BC (UBC). The flare is not due to the lens - it is the film. It is Agfa Scopix X-ray film, rated a 100 iso and processed in Beutler, 1:1:10/10 min. This film lacks anti-halation backing, hence the flare. Very fine grain and a bit unpredictable results - I like it though, maybe just because of that.

 

[Nokton48]

Hello Again Tom,

Nice shots of Falling Water. I have been there four times myself, although each time I packed a 4x5 Sinar Norma to do exterior shooting. Did you check out the waterfalls and the views from downstream?

-Dan

 

[Tom A]

This is with my last "slow" 21 ( at least for the moment- who knows what will pop up at the next swap-meet?). This is with a limited production Ricoh 21mm f3.5 in screw-mount. It was just a small run of maybe 500 in black and 5-800 in chrome in 1995. Tiny little lens, very good performance. Small enough that aperture control is done with small lever as it is difficult operate otherwise.
This is the Tokyo International Centre - roof has a viking ship look to it - and yes, I know it is slightly tilted but a/ the world is round not flat and b/ the security guard was trying to stop me from shooting!
Neopan 100, Beutler 1:1:8 10 min. I think it was on a M2.

 

[Tom A]

Hello Again Tom,

Nice shots of Falling Water. I have been there four times myself, although each time I packed a 4x5 Sinar Norma to do exterior shooting. Did you check out the waterfalls and the views from downstream?

-Dan

Dan, I was wishing for a 4x5 or even a 8x10 when I was looking at the building. The 667W had to do. We had limited time there - and for most of time the weather was rather gloomy.
On the other hand, I was happy that I did not have to lug a 4x5/8x10 on those rather muddy trails. The downstream trail was impossible for me to tackle (my legs are rather crappy - so I pick my trails carefully). It is place one wants to back to - as is Pittsburgh and it's surroundings.
Tom

 

[helen.HH]

Oh Hello T
Really Love your first three shots : Falling Water/Super Elmar
Just Fantastic !!

The Drama Queen SA also won my Heart
Very Cool Slow Wide Lenses -
Thanks for All the Comoarisons in Glass

 

[kzphoto]

Tom, any preference for the Ricoh over the C-Biogon? I enjoy the Biogon however at times I desire a bit more speed. The Ricoh / Super Elmar are looking appealing as well as a converted G Biogon f/2.8.