Thinking Of Going LTM...

[photogdave]

I need another camera like I need a car accident but I've been haunted by this pretty little black Leica III at a local shop.
The owner is selling it out of his private collection so I think I'm supposed to make an offer. It's a black III from 1935 according to the SN#. It looks in pretty good shape overall - just a couple of scratches and minor brassing. The shutter fast and slow speeds sound about right, the curtain looks solid and the VF and RF are clean.
Any thoughts on what this should be worth?
It has a 28 f/6.3 Hektor mounted to it. I know this is a collector lens so I think I'll just go for the body and look for a 50 Elmar.
Is loading film into one of these things as scary as I've heard? Is it REALLY necessary to trim the leader?
Any thoughts/tips are greatly appreciated!

 

[Artorius]

You need it

You need it

I don't care what LTM you are looking at, But IMO a LTM will make you think about your shots, thus improving your pics. I have Leicas M8, M3, M6, M4P, D-LUX 3, and 2x IIIc. I still have my Nikon DSLR's. My opinion makes me think of the photo before I shoot off a shotgun blast of images., IMO is improving my shots.
Any rangefinder, Nikon, Canon, Leica, is going to make you MORE aware of the pic you want to take. It takes time, but it id worth it.
I have Nikon DSLR's, and still use them, but they are regulated to less use than they used to be. But then again, I am retired and I can now choose what and where I want to shoot.

 

[Pickett Wilson]

Yes, it's really necessary to trim the leader. But, once that is done, learning to load them eventually becomes second nature. The finder is squinty and inaccurate (get an external bright line finder). But they are tiny, beautifully made mechanical devices that feel good in the hand and will make you appreciate what HCB accomplished. 🙂

 

[wlewisiii]

It's a good body, offer a low ball price and then work up to someplace both of you are happy with.

But you will want a different lens, as you've already realized. I'd say find yourself a collapsible LTM Summicron, but hey, that's worth more than the body these days 😱 Seriously a good Elmar is a sweet thing on a barnack body.

Oh, yeah, it really IS necessary to trim the leader, but the reality is that it isn't any big deal. When I owned my Canon IVSb (damn I should NOT have sold that :bang: :bang: :bang🙂 I would trim a dozen or so rolls in advance so that I wouldn't have to worry about it when I was out and about. Did annoy the bleep out of the gal that processed 90% of my C41 at the neighborhood Walgreens 🙂

Buy it & enjoy it.

William

 

[mh2000]

Ok, I have a IIIc, not a III, but the cameras are nice to use. The big problem I have with loading is that you need to cut the film and if you are out and about without a precut film you just might have to buy another pair of scissors... that is a pain IMO. Once the film is cut loading isn't so bad, but you do have to kind of juggle the film, loose spool, loose bottom and your camera... sounds worse than it is, but it is certainly less easy than other cameras. Don't let it scare you though. You don't have to be very precise cutting the film... just tell your lab that it's cut or they may freak out.

I guess I can't imagine not having a Barnack camera just because they are so pretty and old, but honestly, I shoot my Retina IIa much more...

 

[thomasw_]

Ahoy Dave, Yes trimming back 24 sprockets or 4" on the inner side of the film is a key. No biggie, just pre-trim a few rolls before heading to shoot. Another tip is re-insert the tag end of the leader into the cassette so that no sprockets are exposed at all on the inner side of the leader. You will then easily get the spool and cassette inserted; you will be able to see the sprockets engaged with gears as you tighten any slack with the rewind knob and do one film advance w/o the baseplate attached.

 

[hjagis]

I need another camera like I need a car accident but I've been haunted by this pretty little black Leica III at a local shop.
The owner is selling it out of his private collection so I think I'm supposed to make an offer. It's a black III from 1935 according to the SN#. It looks in pretty good shape overall - just a couple of scratches and minor brassing. The shutter fast and slow speeds sound about right, the curtain looks solid and the VF and RF are clean.
Any thoughts on what this should be worth?
It has a 28 f/6.3 Hektor mounted to it. I know this is a collector lens so I think I'll just go for the body and look for a 50 Elmar.
Is loading film into one of these things as scary as I've heard? Is it REALLY necessary to trim the leader?
Any thoughts/tips are greatly appreciated!

I dont trim . Set the camera to B without lens and release the shutter so you can see the pressureplate, then ease the film in by pushing lightly on the p plate. Hjalti

 

[john neal]

I dont trim . Set the camera to B without lens and release the shutter so you can see the pressureplate, then ease the film in by pushing lightly on the p plate. Hjalti

I think you mean "T"? If you use B, then the shutter will close on your fingers as son as you release the button - or do you have curiously prehensile fingers?

I have done this too, and the trick with a business card, but ONLY when I didn't have a trimmed leader or any way to trim one. In my mind, the added risk of misloading is just not worth it. I can load a Barnack while walking along, providing I have trimed the leader, so it can't be that hard - not sure I could walk, talk, chew gum AND load a Barnack though 😉

 

[Mr_Flibble]

Strange, I've never had any shop complain about me handing in trimmed film.
There are some ways to load the film without trimming (as you can read in the pinned topic in this section on Loading Barnacks), but I find trimming the easiest thing to do. And even if you trim the film, you can still use it in any other camera without a problem.

My Leica III is my current daily companion, until the roll is finished.

 

[richard_l]

Trimming the leader is no problem at all, and it makes loading a triviality, but I still don't do it. I just don't want to freak out the lab people.

 

[semrich]

I have a IIIf and had it out this weekend with the collapsible Elmar, no camera bag, light meter in one coat pocket with some film and just slip the camera into your pocket.

Once you get used to focusing and shifting your eye to compose it is real easy. I carry the smallest Swiss Army Knife and either use the knife blade with the film against a had surface or the little scissors to trim the film when I reload, with a little time it is no big deal.

 

[Keith]

I love screwmounts, they are such a pretty camera and the film loading thing is a bit of a myth IMO as it's not really that bad.

I don't agree with the theory that they'll make you a more thoughtful photographer though.

 

[Nikon Bob]

I had one bad experience loading a IIIc without trimming the leader and wound up with broken bits of film in the camera. That was before I knew about trimming the leader and none after doing so. They are a little fiddly to load if you don't use one too often. I did have one lab not process my film as they thought something was wrong with the roll because of the long leader. I now just tell the lab person that the roll has a long leader and no trouble since.

Bob

 

[John Lawrence]

As others have said you do need to trim the film leader to load, but it really isn't a big problem. I use the ABLON trimmer, and there are copies of this usually available from sellers, and on Ebay, if you want to go down this route. However, it's not a problem to trim with scissors. Loading is not a problem either, and much easier than many would have you believe!

The III is a nice camera which is very easy to carry around due to its small size, particularly with a collapsed Elmar. I find the viewfinder to be a bit small for my taste, so use the SBOOI finder.

 

[hans voralberg]

I don't trim the leader, after 2 rolls I can load my IIIf blindfolded 😉

 

[George S.]

I trim with scissors, once you get used to it, you won't need a trimming guide. And, one biggie that no one mentioned- make sure you cut the edge of the film leader BETWEEN two sprocket holes or it could catch and jam, or it'll tear some piece of film off and jam that way too.

 

[BillP]

There is a straightforward response to the "trim or not to trim" debate.

There is a trimming template called, as I recall, an ABLON. The day someone shows me a genuine, period accessory shaped like a small business card ("CARDO", anyone?) I shall believe that Leitz intended us to stick foreign objects into our cameras. Until then I shall trim assiduously.

Regards,

Bill

 

[Frank Petronio]

You can do it either way, the first few times will be quite slow and it is a good idea to sit at a table with good light, remove the lens, set the shutter speed to "T" and check the film gate to make sure the film has loaded properly and is advancing. After some practice it still is slow but much easier.

I've chewed up film inside a LTM body and it is not a happy thing to do, but in my case I was able to shake it out and it went on working fine. I could see how it could require a trip to the camera doctor should you not be as lucky.

As for whether the slower operation will improve your photography, I think it does, sort of like weight training. It's not the ideal all-around camera, but in the same way that a larger format camera slows you down, so does a LTM.

IMHO the best combo is a IIc or IIIc with a 50/3.5 Elmar (or a IId). What is the point of trying to replicate a modern look with late-model high end glass? A funky Elmar has a lot of character and provides an alternative look to your other 35mm systems. They are also very compact, well made, and relatively inexpensive.

 

[John Lawrence]

There is a straightforward response to the "trim or not to trim" debate.

There is a trimming template called, as I recall, an ABLON. The day someone shows me a genuine, period accessory shaped like a small business card ("CARDO", anyone?) I shall believe that Leitz intended us to stick foreign objects into our cameras. Until then I shall trim assiduously.

Regards,

Bill

My thoughts exactly!

 

[Melvin]

I always thought those black Leica IIIs were very pretty.

Loading screw mount Leicas is really blown out of proportion, people saying you have to take the lens off, set the shutter to "t" etc etc...

The fact is that they load exactly the same way as an M2, they just don't have a back door, so you have to peek down to see that the sprockets have engaged. And you must trim the leader. According to Sherry Krauter it can jam the shutter if you don't.