Dan Daniel
Well-known
Fun stuff! I've heard that cleaning contacts can bring seleniums back in some cases. I've given up on selenium cells. Some time in the next couple of weeks, I am going to finally rip open a cheap 'solar-powered calculator' and see if there is a way to use the cell as a light meter cell. I have a couple of dead meters that I can experiment with.
PMCC
Late adopter.
Karl Bryan suggested to me that solar cell film material -- like the kind available from Edmund Scientific -- would work as a replacement for dead selenium cells.
KoNickon
Nick Merritt
I am learning a lot here. And one thing I'm learning very well is that I'm too cowardly to undertake any of this.
raid
Dad Photographer
Amazing work shown here! I could not even try planning such a venture in my dreams. The inside of a Rollei looks very complex mechanically.
Dan Daniel
Well-known
LOL. And here I am looking into buying a 2.8 in pieces in a box, sight unseen. Along with a 3.5 that needs a shutter overhaul. So far I have only emailed with a daughter selling for the father, so specific model numbers, use, etc. are unknown.
Hey look, I could be watching TV with my spare time! I figure rebuilding cameras is much less destructive to my brain, and I'm getting to where I need any edge I can get in that department.
Hey look, I could be watching TV with my spare time! I figure rebuilding cameras is much less destructive to my brain, and I'm getting to where I need any edge I can get in that department.
maddoc
... likes film again.
Disassembling a Rolleiflex ... 
you are a very brave man ! My hats off ! However, reading your report with the many illustrating photos is very interesting !!
you are a very brave man ! My hats off ! However, reading your report with the many illustrating photos is very interesting !!pinkarmy
Well-known
almost missed this thread...i love peeping (inside a camera i mean)
Sorry for the lack of reporting over the last week or so. A couple of Contaflice have intervened, as I got one going for a friend who wanted to try film, and another friend contacted me to request a working example for his friend's son who wants to shoot some film. All in a good cause, of course. So I have been finessing a couple of Contaflex Super models back into service. In between this, an old motorcycle injury left me with quite nasty recurring headaches I've been struggling to shake recently. I'm itching to get the Tele loaded with film and out being used, but I won't perform fine mechanical work whilst I'm on painkillers, for obvious reasons. Stay tuned for more progress in the next few days hopefully.
Regards
Brett
Regards
Brett
It’s turned into a very long weekend indeed. Progress (unreported to date, but I’m working on it!) has been made in the interim—however a stream of cameras for other owners has usurped the Tele project, until recently. Perhaps these may also be of interest to readers, so—if I can be forgiven for mentioning SLRs in the TLR forum—let's take a quick look at them.
Having developed more than a passing fondness for them, I’ve sorted around a dozen Zeiss Ikon Contaflice for myself or other fortunate owners (according to some of the Zeiss Ikon Illuminati "Contaflice" is the correct plural of "Contaflex"). This year it's been mainly the original Super model I've found myself looking at and have revived three or four of them—I find them to generally be an easy model to work on. The Super is the one in the centre of the following shot with the thumbwheel on the front of the rewind side, with a strip of tape covering the selenium cell to prevent deterioration.
Models from left to right, are: Contaflex (original, AKA retrospectively, as the Contaflex I); Contaflex II; the decidedly scarce Contaflex Rapid (cursive script); original Contaflex Super; Contaflex Super B; the penultimate Contaflex model, the Super BC and; the final Contaflex type, the S. Absent are New Super and Contaflex IV models being repaired, and also any of the inferior Pantar lens equipped models, which I've steered clear from (so far). The Contaflex III is proving somewhat elusive to date. It will be found in 2013...
Much more relevant to this forum is a Rolleicord Vb I sorted last month.
(Edit: Thread moved to Repair subforum).
The Rolleicord focus system is less complex than a Rolleiflex—making it a good primer for someone to attempt, before jumping in the deep end with a Flex. The patient in this case is the one on the far right of the upper shelf, in the previous photo. Next to it, from right to left are my 2.8C Xenotar (wearing the 0.35 Rolleinars off my Tele); a 2.8D Xenotar waiting for some TLC; a Rolleicord Va and; a Rolleicord V.
Rather than starting a new thread for The Cord—as a lot of the process is relevant to the task of correcting the Tele focus, I thought I’d include it in here—comparisons of both the similarities and differences between the two Rollei "siblings" may also be instructive.
One of my brothers had expressed an interest in acquiring a Rollei of his own, so I undertook to organise one in good working order for him. Of the ones I had on hand, the Vb seemed, at first glance, to be the best prospect. On closer examination this may not have been the case… The pictured example required extensive disassembly to clean the shutter and re-align the focus system. Of course, it is another one that was described as being in “mint” mechanical condition by the (specialist camera) ebay seller I bought it off. So what was wrong with it?
Well, the shutter needed cleaning for starters, as the speed escapement was stalling badly. Also, the lens board was not sliding evenly throughout the focus range. As the focus knob was turned, the board would "rock" slightly from top to bottom, instead of taking up evenly. At least a millimetre or so of play was evident in either direction.
Apparently a focussing mechanism in this condition is regarded as “Mint” in certain ebay circles. Personally I don’t think it’s acceptable for a Rollei anyone would actually want to take photos with (unless, that is, you wanted to use one as some sort of high-end Holga perhaps). The quick shutter clean and check I had anticipated, turned into a much more involved repair.
So let’s have a look at what’s involved in pulling a Cord down to align the lens board. We'll take a look inside the shutter on the way through, too.
Cheers,
Brett
Having developed more than a passing fondness for them, I’ve sorted around a dozen Zeiss Ikon Contaflice for myself or other fortunate owners (according to some of the Zeiss Ikon Illuminati "Contaflice" is the correct plural of "Contaflex"). This year it's been mainly the original Super model I've found myself looking at and have revived three or four of them—I find them to generally be an easy model to work on. The Super is the one in the centre of the following shot with the thumbwheel on the front of the rewind side, with a strip of tape covering the selenium cell to prevent deterioration.
Models from left to right, are: Contaflex (original, AKA retrospectively, as the Contaflex I); Contaflex II; the decidedly scarce Contaflex Rapid (cursive script); original Contaflex Super; Contaflex Super B; the penultimate Contaflex model, the Super BC and; the final Contaflex type, the S. Absent are New Super and Contaflex IV models being repaired, and also any of the inferior Pantar lens equipped models, which I've steered clear from (so far). The Contaflex III is proving somewhat elusive to date. It will be found in 2013...
Much more relevant to this forum is a Rolleicord Vb I sorted last month.
(Edit: Thread moved to Repair subforum).
The Rolleicord focus system is less complex than a Rolleiflex—making it a good primer for someone to attempt, before jumping in the deep end with a Flex. The patient in this case is the one on the far right of the upper shelf, in the previous photo. Next to it, from right to left are my 2.8C Xenotar (wearing the 0.35 Rolleinars off my Tele); a 2.8D Xenotar waiting for some TLC; a Rolleicord Va and; a Rolleicord V.
Rather than starting a new thread for The Cord—as a lot of the process is relevant to the task of correcting the Tele focus, I thought I’d include it in here—comparisons of both the similarities and differences between the two Rollei "siblings" may also be instructive.
One of my brothers had expressed an interest in acquiring a Rollei of his own, so I undertook to organise one in good working order for him. Of the ones I had on hand, the Vb seemed, at first glance, to be the best prospect. On closer examination this may not have been the case… The pictured example required extensive disassembly to clean the shutter and re-align the focus system. Of course, it is another one that was described as being in “mint” mechanical condition by the (specialist camera) ebay seller I bought it off. So what was wrong with it?
Well, the shutter needed cleaning for starters, as the speed escapement was stalling badly. Also, the lens board was not sliding evenly throughout the focus range. As the focus knob was turned, the board would "rock" slightly from top to bottom, instead of taking up evenly. At least a millimetre or so of play was evident in either direction.
Apparently a focussing mechanism in this condition is regarded as “Mint” in certain ebay circles
. Personally I don’t think it’s acceptable for a Rollei anyone would actually want to take photos with (unless, that is, you wanted to use one as some sort of high-end Holga perhaps). The quick shutter clean and check I had anticipated, turned into a much more involved repair.So let’s have a look at what’s involved in pulling a Cord down to align the lens board. We'll take a look inside the shutter on the way through, too.
Cheers,
Brett
In order to get the bayonet cover off the flash locking lever must be removed from the end of the terminal. This has a blind screw with two small notches set into it for a pin spanner and undoes anti clockwise as usual. (There was a photo of the very similar part fitted to the Tele in a couple of the photos earlier in this thread—the Tele PC socket being fitted to the right, as you look at the front, instead of the left—as on the Cord.)
It’s possible, of course, to modify a screwdriver, socket or other hand tool to fit the notches in the screw. However even the best fitting tool can easily make small marks on this very visible fastener. How then, can it be removed without damage?
My approach is to simple but effective. I utilise a piece of old inner tube cut down to a small size, and apply friction to the fastener via the rubber. It’s possible to apply a surprising amount of force to smaller fasteners this way, either using your own digits, or perhaps via a flat surface when the fastener is attached to a larger assembly, such as a camera body. The beauty of using a clean piece of rubber is that it will impart absolutely no damage at all to a part, keeping it looking—dare I say it—mint.
The small knurled knob on the end of the cocking lever also has to be removed in order to slide the cocking/release lever out of the slot in the bottom of the bayonet cover. I tend to use a small pair of pliers or vice grips to carefully grip the knob without marking the knob excessively. A pair of tweezers or jewellers screwdriver can be used to fix the small screw behind the lever that helps retain the knob as you unscrew the knob.
Having gently peeled back the leatherette around the corners with a suitable tool, and removed the four fixing screws for what I call the bayonet plate—it includes the bayonet rings for filters, hoods etc—after detaching the plate the Rolleicord will look like this:
You can see that the leatherette is still mostly attached to the bayonet plate, as it’s not usually necessary to completely remove it, making it just a little easier to align it neatly for glueing on reassembly. Looking at the front of the camera you’ll see the small threads for the fixing screws of the plate near the corners.
All the control levers for: shutter; aperture; double exposure selection and; self-timer lever/flash synch selection, where applicable—this Vb is “X” sync only—easily disconnect from their counterparts connected to the shutter assembly proper. Visible in the above shot at about 2 o’clock on the side of the shutter housing is the actuating arm for setting the aperture, which is driven by the fork on the end of the external control lever. The shutter speed is adjusted by rotating the serrated ring around the outside diameter of the shutter front, via a pin on the inside end of the external shutter speed selection lever. As you lift the cover clear of the shutter/viewing len,s these external levers detach and remain with the bayonet cover. The cocking and release lever stays with the shutter assembly, not the cover.
(Re-assembly of this is simply a matter of ensuring the external actuating levers are set to the same state as those on the camera proper so that they engage correctly. Ensure all pairs are set to, Eg. Bulb/f3.5 or 1/500/f22; double exposure; M sync; etc. and, by carefully introducing the cover, it will snap into its seat when aligned without play—you will know when it’s correct, and when it's not, by how it feels—don't force it, of course.)
Previously the taking lens has been unscrewed from the shutter assembly (they are not generally very tight and usually easily removed with thumb and fingers).
As the previous image shows, if access to the shutter blades or shutter escapements is all that is required this may be the extent of disassembly needed to the camera front. The black retaining ring that fastens the front of the Compur shutter assembly can be seen on the inside diameter of the shutter. The small (around a millimetre) screw that locks the retaining ring to the shutter has previously been removed above.
On the subject of the fastening ring: it does not have to be particularly tight, and in fact, often unscrews with the aid of a thumbnail. Shutter or aperture control levers that are excessively stiff to adjust might well be symptomatic of an inept assembler fastening the retaining ring too tightly, as excessive tension will have immediate and noticeable impact on the “feel” of the setting levers.
OK. In the following image we’re starting to get a bit deeper inside a Rolleicord.
For completeness the front group of the 75mm f/3.5 Xenar taking lens can be seen on the right. Having removed the black shutter retaining ring (top left next to the camera body) the setting ring, speed cam and front plate can also be seen above the bayonet plate. The speed cam ring is the one with the various slots machined into it, that engage the pins on the escapements in different combinations in order to regulate the range of shutter speeds possible (Bulb, to 1/500, in this case).
Still mounted around the inner shutter housing is its cocking rack (meshed to the gear pinion for the mainspring at around nine o’clock). This partly obscures the speed escapement, (the train of gears in the housing at 11-12 o’clock inside the shutter). Of course, this is frequently the heart of your problems if your Rolleis slow speeds begin to stutter or stick open. The components are small in size, indeed, and small amounts of old, evaporated organic lube the factory originally used will see the plot grind to a halt.
Indeed, if the shutter functions correctly at other speeds cleaning the star wheel and pallet (not visible above, located inside the escapement near the inner housing) with a single drop of lighter fluid and exercising the shutter for a while may be all that is required to get the slow speeds springing back into life. Repeat once, or twice, perhaps, until smooth running is maintained. A speck of Moebius synthetic watch oil on the pallet will prevent further problems recurring for years to come.
I’ll start a new post for the focus mechanism and all its quirks—still working on that one, coming up soon (promise!).
Cheers
Brett
It’s possible, of course, to modify a screwdriver, socket or other hand tool to fit the notches in the screw. However even the best fitting tool can easily make small marks on this very visible fastener. How then, can it be removed without damage?
My approach is to simple but effective. I utilise a piece of old inner tube cut down to a small size, and apply friction to the fastener via the rubber. It’s possible to apply a surprising amount of force to smaller fasteners this way, either using your own digits, or perhaps via a flat surface when the fastener is attached to a larger assembly, such as a camera body. The beauty of using a clean piece of rubber is that it will impart absolutely no damage at all to a part, keeping it looking—dare I say it—mint.
The small knurled knob on the end of the cocking lever also has to be removed in order to slide the cocking/release lever out of the slot in the bottom of the bayonet cover. I tend to use a small pair of pliers or vice grips to carefully grip the knob without marking the knob excessively. A pair of tweezers or jewellers screwdriver can be used to fix the small screw behind the lever that helps retain the knob as you unscrew the knob.
Having gently peeled back the leatherette around the corners with a suitable tool, and removed the four fixing screws for what I call the bayonet plate—it includes the bayonet rings for filters, hoods etc—after detaching the plate the Rolleicord will look like this:
You can see that the leatherette is still mostly attached to the bayonet plate, as it’s not usually necessary to completely remove it, making it just a little easier to align it neatly for glueing on reassembly. Looking at the front of the camera you’ll see the small threads for the fixing screws of the plate near the corners.
All the control levers for: shutter; aperture; double exposure selection and; self-timer lever/flash synch selection, where applicable—this Vb is “X” sync only—easily disconnect from their counterparts connected to the shutter assembly proper. Visible in the above shot at about 2 o’clock on the side of the shutter housing is the actuating arm for setting the aperture, which is driven by the fork on the end of the external control lever. The shutter speed is adjusted by rotating the serrated ring around the outside diameter of the shutter front, via a pin on the inside end of the external shutter speed selection lever. As you lift the cover clear of the shutter/viewing len,s these external levers detach and remain with the bayonet cover. The cocking and release lever stays with the shutter assembly, not the cover.
(Re-assembly of this is simply a matter of ensuring the external actuating levers are set to the same state as those on the camera proper so that they engage correctly. Ensure all pairs are set to, Eg. Bulb/f3.5 or 1/500/f22; double exposure; M sync; etc. and, by carefully introducing the cover, it will snap into its seat when aligned without play—you will know when it’s correct, and when it's not, by how it feels—don't force it, of course.)
Previously the taking lens has been unscrewed from the shutter assembly (they are not generally very tight and usually easily removed with thumb and fingers).
As the previous image shows, if access to the shutter blades or shutter escapements is all that is required this may be the extent of disassembly needed to the camera front. The black retaining ring that fastens the front of the Compur shutter assembly can be seen on the inside diameter of the shutter. The small (around a millimetre) screw that locks the retaining ring to the shutter has previously been removed above.
On the subject of the fastening ring: it does not have to be particularly tight, and in fact, often unscrews with the aid of a thumbnail. Shutter or aperture control levers that are excessively stiff to adjust might well be symptomatic of an inept assembler fastening the retaining ring too tightly, as excessive tension will have immediate and noticeable impact on the “feel” of the setting levers.
OK. In the following image we’re starting to get a bit deeper inside a Rolleicord.
For completeness the front group of the 75mm f/3.5 Xenar taking lens can be seen on the right. Having removed the black shutter retaining ring (top left next to the camera body) the setting ring, speed cam and front plate can also be seen above the bayonet plate. The speed cam ring is the one with the various slots machined into it, that engage the pins on the escapements in different combinations in order to regulate the range of shutter speeds possible (Bulb, to 1/500, in this case).
Still mounted around the inner shutter housing is its cocking rack (meshed to the gear pinion for the mainspring at around nine o’clock). This partly obscures the speed escapement, (the train of gears in the housing at 11-12 o’clock inside the shutter). Of course, this is frequently the heart of your problems if your Rolleis slow speeds begin to stutter or stick open. The components are small in size, indeed, and small amounts of old, evaporated organic lube the factory originally used will see the plot grind to a halt.
Indeed, if the shutter functions correctly at other speeds cleaning the star wheel and pallet (not visible above, located inside the escapement near the inner housing) with a single drop of lighter fluid and exercising the shutter for a while may be all that is required to get the slow speeds springing back into life. Repeat once, or twice, perhaps, until smooth running is maintained. A speck of Moebius synthetic watch oil on the pallet will prevent further problems recurring for years to come.
I’ll start a new post for the focus mechanism and all its quirks—still working on that one, coming up soon (promise!).
Cheers
Brett
Dan Daniel
Well-known
I've brought back three Roleicord shutters from slow speed drag by a little surface cleaning. I'll take the cocking ring off, one step past when Brett shows directly above. This is the upper ring that covers the escapement and has the teeth from about 7-9 o'clock right near the center of the shutter. There is a small spring that hooks at about 3 o'clock that will need to be re-attached on assembly.
A wipe-down of all the parts removed. A drop or two of lighter fluid on the bearing points of the escapement. Re-assemble and exercise- working slow speeds! I haven't needed to even adjust the 1-second speeds.
Looking forward to the focus description, Brett. That is my weakest point in overhauling Rolleis, so any hints and directions will be very welcome.
A wipe-down of all the parts removed. A drop or two of lighter fluid on the bearing points of the escapement. Re-assemble and exercise- working slow speeds! I haven't needed to even adjust the 1-second speeds.
Looking forward to the focus description, Brett. That is my weakest point in overhauling Rolleis, so any hints and directions will be very welcome.
Hi Dan,
thanks for your post. I'm not quite at the focus adjustment of the Tele Rollei yet, although I have stripped nearly all the wind side parts down for access. What's interesting though, are both the similarities and differences between the Flex and Cord focus design. I do have a Contaflex here I really must get finished for its owner before Christmas, but I will try to jot down the next instalment in the series this evening. I think you may be selling yourself short, though, because having read various comments from you about Rolleis in the past I have no doubt you'd be up to getting one focussing properly again if you needed to.
Cheers
Brett
thanks for your post. I'm not quite at the focus adjustment of the Tele Rollei yet, although I have stripped nearly all the wind side parts down for access. What's interesting though, are both the similarities and differences between the Flex and Cord focus design. I do have a Contaflex here I really must get finished for its owner before Christmas, but I will try to jot down the next instalment in the series this evening. I think you may be selling yourself short, though, because having read various comments from you about Rolleis in the past I have no doubt you'd be up to getting one focussing properly again if you needed to.
Cheers
Brett
Platinum RF
Well-known
wah, brave skillful man
Not so sure about that but thanks.
Since I posted the last update work on the Tele has progressed. I have a stack of images along the way but have been holding off pending some positive developments. Not that it is bad news, it will live again, hopefully in the next month or so.
The current status is waiting for some parts needed to sort out the fault. This has since been identified as badly worn cam followers, one side of which has fractured or broken and does not make effective contact with its cam until well under infinity distance. Hence the lopsided way it moved off the infinity stop. There's no signs of a major impact anywhere on the front of the Tele. I suspect a combination of age, use, and the strain of transporting the formidable weight of the two 135mm lenses has simply taken its toll. I have a contact who may be able to supply the required parts, in which case the Tele can begin to go back together.
Cheers
Brett
It has been a while since I updated this discussion but there has been a positive development recently.
Per the previous post I have been delayed re-assembling the Tele Rolleiflex pending procurement of certain parts for the focus system. In the interim I've investigated the possibility of using alternative materials in place of the originals. I've been reluctant to do this, though. A substantial of dismantling is needed to reach the parts on the camera wind side, and it can be a tedious and fiddly process to shim the parallelism of the lens board within factory tolerances. The last thing I wanted to do was to re-assemble the camera, only to find a few weeks or months later that non-standard parts had worn prematurely, for example. And of course the focus action would be unlikely to feature the same superb, silky, gliding feel a factory Rollei in good order possesses. But with genuine "Gleitplaettchen" (Gliding Piece) material seemingly impossible to find anywhere on the planet—Franke & Heidecke used to supply these in 10 centimetre lengths to be cut to size and shaped by the repairer—what to do, what to do?
I should add that this material is not specific to the Tele Rolleiflex, although, I can't imagine any other model being as hard on them in normal use as a Tele, (unless one was in the habit of using a Mutar on a regular basis, perhaps?). But the same gliding piece material is used in the focus system of a number of different TLR models, including 2.8 & 3.5 standard Rolleiflexes and various Rolleicords. You can see them as part numbers 26 & 28 in the attached grab from the Rollei repair book diagram.
As most parts of these cameras generally age very well with reasonable care and sympathetic use, badly worn gliding pieces can be a big problem, because, without these items in good condition, it can be impossible to set the focus as accurately and smoothly as when they were new and with no excessive play, so it can be a show stopper.
Having contacted a number of businesses and specialists without success, I recently received a positive email to the effect that 8 centimetre pieces of the material could be supplied at a very reasonable price. I've since ordered same, and when these are received I should, I hope, have the final missing piece needed to get the Tele back in working order. Fingers crossed for another update in a few weeks!
Cheers,
Brett
Per the previous post I have been delayed re-assembling the Tele Rolleiflex pending procurement of certain parts for the focus system. In the interim I've investigated the possibility of using alternative materials in place of the originals. I've been reluctant to do this, though. A substantial of dismantling is needed to reach the parts on the camera wind side, and it can be a tedious and fiddly process to shim the parallelism of the lens board within factory tolerances. The last thing I wanted to do was to re-assemble the camera, only to find a few weeks or months later that non-standard parts had worn prematurely, for example. And of course the focus action would be unlikely to feature the same superb, silky, gliding feel a factory Rollei in good order possesses. But with genuine "Gleitplaettchen" (Gliding Piece) material seemingly impossible to find anywhere on the planet—Franke & Heidecke used to supply these in 10 centimetre lengths to be cut to size and shaped by the repairer—what to do, what to do?
I should add that this material is not specific to the Tele Rolleiflex, although, I can't imagine any other model being as hard on them in normal use as a Tele, (unless one was in the habit of using a Mutar on a regular basis, perhaps?). But the same gliding piece material is used in the focus system of a number of different TLR models, including 2.8 & 3.5 standard Rolleiflexes and various Rolleicords. You can see them as part numbers 26 & 28 in the attached grab from the Rollei repair book diagram.
As most parts of these cameras generally age very well with reasonable care and sympathetic use, badly worn gliding pieces can be a big problem, because, without these items in good condition, it can be impossible to set the focus as accurately and smoothly as when they were new and with no excessive play, so it can be a show stopper.
Having contacted a number of businesses and specialists without success, I recently received a positive email to the effect that 8 centimetre pieces of the material could be supplied at a very reasonable price. I've since ordered same, and when these are received I should, I hope, have the final missing piece needed to get the Tele back in working order. Fingers crossed for another update in a few weeks!
Cheers,
Brett
Attachments
hanskerensky
Well-known
With so much work and investigation put into it you deserve a positive outcome Brett !
Thanks so much Hans. Your own repair activities posted on your Flickr stream continue to be a frequent source of new knowledge and fresh ideas, and I am often encouraged by reading of your successes.
Best,
Brett
Best,
Brett
Wouter2
Established
Reviving this old thread ... how did the Tele repair work out? Any more pictures to share maybe ... I found this highly interesting.