Time to Sell your M8 IF the M9 is near?

[roey]

Not yet ...

Not yet ...

I have been using my M8 for over 2.5 years. There have been problems with it, but they have been resolved and the M8 has been an amazing tool for me. If the rumors hold true I will buy an M9. Soon. Will there be problems with it? Most likely. It will be a new product, after all, and given the realities of the economy Leica needs to get it to the market as soon as possible. But I trust that Leica and my dealer will solve them quickly. I'll keep my M8 for a little while, though, as a backup should I have to send in the M9. I might lose more money on it that way, but I don't regard cameras as an investment.

 

[tbarker13]

I don't think I'll ever again buy a new digital camera - at least not a Leica at what Leica considers a good price. Unless, that is, I quit my day job and pursue photography as a career. Even then, I'd have to be really convinced that they've turned out a reliable camera.
Until M8.2 prices come way down, I imagine I'll just stick with my M8.

 

[Flinor]

Great, just when I decide to go for an RD-1 you spring this on me. If I sell all my gear and just wait I'll be back to film for a while. Wait.... that wouldn't be all bad.

In the immortal words of a female comedian whose name I can't remember: "I'm not buying another piece of technology until they guarantee me it's the last one."

 

[Richard Marks]

Well I did a straight swap of my M8 for a D700 about 1 month ago and this really was just to tide me over whilst having a bit of a break from rangefinders and waiting to see what happens with the M9. I have always kept my manual focus Nikon glass and thought i would just have a bit of fun. The manual focus Nikon glass is simply increadible on a D700 and the good thing is it is still inexpensive although i suspect it is going up in price. The D700 sensor is simply superb and I certainly will not be rushing into an M9. If a D4 were to be on the horizon I think I may pass on an M9. Still have my film M and that is always the keeper.

Incidentally i did ring leica UK tjust to see what they would say. They are even denying the existence of an M9 and certainly would not confirm any launch date. I am guessing it probably exists but there are still problems to be ironed out with the full frame issues. Time will tell. meanwhile the D700 rocks.

Richard



Richard

 

[Ben Z]

The cost per day model is a great way to calculate just how expensivea a camera is to use.

Even back in the old days the only thing I calculated was cost-per-photo. A digital camera depreciates quickly but you don't have to pay for film+developing. So for example my M8 has paid for itself in film savings compared to, say, had I bought an M7 and shot the same # of photos with film. The thing that's different for me today than in the old days was, back then I could indulge my GAS and not worry if a particular camera sat on my shelf 364 days a year. Nowadays, it's use it or lose it.

 

[ruslan]

The net is full of full frame M9 rumors predicting it is close to being announced.

IF that is true, what will it do to the used values of the RD1, M8, and M8.2?

The Epson RD1 is a cult camera and the lowest priced of the four digital M bodies. As the digital M entry point, I think used RD1 prices (all versions) will stay about the same with the M9.

The M8.2 is a MUCH improved camera over the M8, and will sell used for substantially less than a new M9 -- even with a lot of 8.2 owners selling them to get the M9. Prices may drop slightly, but demand and price point will keep prices substantial.

The ugly ducking of the foursome is the M8. It does not compare well with the 8.2, much less the expected M9. Worse, they are expensive to work on and many are going out of warranty by now.

Once the M9 is announced -- whenever that is -- I would not be surprised if used M8 prices took a 30% drop within four months. Time will tell.

Stephen

The M8.2 is NOT MUCH improved camera over the M8, actually it is a same camera without 1/8000 shutter speed and without 1/250 sync speed.

 

[CameraQuest]

The M8.2 is NOT MUCH improved camera over the M8, actually it is a same camera without 1/8000 shutter speed and without 1/250 sync speed.

I disagree. You forgot to mention the 8.2's much quieter shutter, more accurate framelines, scratch resistant LCD, and improved body covering. The most important improvement to me was the shutter sound. I hate the sound of the M8.

Have you ever shot them side by side?

After shooting the 8.2, shooting the 8 was not pleasant to me at all.

Stephen

 

[jaapv]

And different (not neccesarily better) framelines and a scratch-proof LCD and a stupid-mode and a better ISO change.

 

[rxmd]

I think it's great that there's disagreement on whether the M8.2 is substantially better or not. Those who think it is will contribute to a M8 price drop, about which those who think it isn't will be happy. In short, a win-win situation that we wouldn't have if everybody agreed.

 

[DerekF]

Selling your M8 now is probably the worst thing you could do. Even if the M9 rumours pan out, I doubt the M8 will nosedive in value overnight unless an M8-type camera is introduced at the same time at a much lower price or the M8.2 drops to around $3,000 US.

And if the M9 rumours don't pan out, I expect used M8 prices to rebound somewhat, in which case, you've lost $$$ because you sold too early...

 

[JNewell]

I'm sure not going to make any buy/sell decisions on the M9 until (1) it actually ships and (2) we have a feeling for whether it's going to be a repeat of the M8/M8.2 saga.

 

[Richard Marks]

Even back in the old days the only thing I calculated was cost-per-photo. A digital camera depreciates quickly but you don't have to pay for film+developing. So for example my M8 has paid for itself in film savings compared to, say, had I bought an M7 and shot the same # of photos with film. The thing that's different for me today than in the old days was, back then I could indulge my GAS and not worry if a particular camera sat on my shelf 364 days a year. Nowadays, it's use it or lose it.

Dear Ben

The cost per shot is a bit more complicated. The calculation as quoted assumes that had you been using film you would have taken the same number of pics and printed the same number. I very much doubt that is true for many of us. Then there is the quality issue. One might simply fire of digital shots randomly claiming that money is being saved. Personally i am trigger bappy with digital but somehow still think differently when shooting film and have a greater motivation to make things count. Would we behave differently if digital SD cards just held 36 images and were not re useable!!

Richard

 

[tbarker13]

I disagree. You forgot to mention the 8.2's much quieter shutter, more accurate framelines, scratch resistant LCD, and improved body covering. The most important improvement to me was the shutter sound. I hate the sound of the M8.

Have you ever shot them side by side?

After shooting the 8.2, shooting the 8 was not pleasant to me at all.

Stephen

I've used both. And I'd certainly agree that given a choice between the two, I'd take the M8.2 without question. However I wouldn't pay $2,000 to move from the M8 to the M8.2.
Personally, I think the sapphire screen on the M8.2 is a waste of money. They could put gold screws in the thing, and it wouldn't increase it's value as a photographic tool.
I do like the body finish, but again, that has no photographic value.

Really, it comes down to how much value you place on that quieter shutter and the more accurate frame lines. They're nice, but I don't think that puts the M8.2 miles ahead of the M8.

 

[Roger Hicks]

Really, it comes down to how much value you place on that quieter shutter and the more accurate frame lines. They're nice, but I don't think that puts the M8.2 miles ahead of the M8.

I do -- and I have both. If I could only keep one, it would be the M8.2. This applies even if I could keep the M8 for nothing and had to pay $2000 to keep the M8.2.

Cheers,

R.

 

[johannielscom]

...It would make it easier to check the collimation on Jupiter-3's and other lens hacks.

The very reason I will not sell my M8 lightly.

I fail to see the benefit of a possible FF camera, with the M8's focal lengths moving up one length on almost all lenses (21=28, 28=35, 35=50, etc.) and the 50mm turning into a highly valued 67mm portrait lens.
I would be happy with a camera with accurate frame lines and without the need to mount and unmount filters all the time, but I haven't got access to the funds required to buy an M9.

The lens hacking I find much fun to do every now and again, so the M8 is gonna stick with me until it dies. By that time, the M9 will have dropped in price for sure.

EDIT: When people start unloading M4's or M5's to finance an M9, I'll buy one for sure🙄.

 

[johannielscom]

Off-topic:

Just had an e-mail from the Leica forum on a server crash they suffered today.

It also says they are moving to a new, bigger&faster server because they are expecting much more traffic.

...
New Server Is Coming

The fault that led to the data crash was made while we prepared our move to a new server. The old computer has served us well during the last years but is now replaced by a much faster machine. You see - I'm counting on an increasing interest in the Leica Forum...

...

Another sign the M9 is eminent, I say!


Back on topic!

 

[tbarker13]

I do -- and I have both. If I could only keep one, it would be the M8.2. This applies even if I could keep the M8 for nothing and had to pay $2000 to keep the M8.2.

Cheers,

R.

Oh I have no doubt there are people out there who see the M8.2 as being far superior to the M8. But I believe they are in the minority.
Again, I'm not disputing that the M8.2 is a better camera. But in many ways, it's nothing more than a dolled-up copy of the preceding model.

Show me a version of the camera that doesn't need IR filters. Or one that writes raw/jpg file combos faster. Or one that lets you change exposure comp without going into the internal menu. Slap enough of that stuff on there, and you'll have a camera that's truly superior.

 

[Keith]

Speaking of saphire screens I just put a $5.00 (eBay) LCD protector on my M8. It fitted perfectly, it can't be seen on and it appears to be extremely scratch resistant ... why anyone would pay 800 Euros or whatever it costs for the upgraded LCD escapes me?

Now if I can just quieten that damned staple gun disguised as a shutter down a little I'll be content! 😛

 

[ruslan]

I disagree. You forgot to mention the 8.2's much quieter shutter, more accurate framelines, scratch resistant LCD, and improved body covering. The most important improvement to me was the shutter sound. I hate the sound of the M8.

Have you ever shot them side by side?

After shooting the 8.2, shooting the 8 was not pleasant to me at all.

Stephen

Yes, I had 8.2 and sold it cause no 1/250 flash sync, now I have only M8, same camera with almost same shutter sound, also for frame lines M8 is more accurate for me cause I'm using only Summicron-C with 35 frame, which is more accurate with 40mm that M8.2, I have now new sensor replaced by warranty, very happy.

 

[victoriapio]

The M8 may be the ugly duckling (runt of the litter) of the four but realistically it has the same IQ as the 8.2! If you can live with the noisier shutter, soft LCD screen and slightly less accurate frame lines then it's the bargain of the bunch IMO.

I agree with Keith on this issue.
1. The M8.2 has a quieter shutter but I am losing my hearing anyway, and I have NEVER heard anyone - except for photographers here - complain about the shutter noise to me after I took their picture.
2. The M8.2 has "different" frame lines as no way they are acurate at all focus distances so I would have to get used to a different scale of inacurate lines.
3. I have a $1 protector on my LCD screen, and need nothing more.
4. Even with the Summarit 75mm ( a great, sharp and tiny 75mm/100mm on M8) I use 1/8000 at ISO 160!!!
5. Do not need easier changing ISO.
6. Do not need "scene" settings.

So my M8 has exactly the same image quality as the 8.2 at thousand$$$$ less, it has never given me a bit of a problem (mine was bought used and is a "later" M8) and will probably be a backup to the M9.

The only thing that would have swayed me to purchase the 8.2 was a better image. Not happening. But that is the only thing that can get me to buy the M9 combined with getting some of my original wide angle lenses back to a view I am used to.