To M8 or not to M8, that is the question.

[rich_]

To me it seems like you have already made some rational reasons for owning an M8.

I had an M8 previously and it was a great camera, If you go into the purchase knowing its limitations then there isn't much stopping you!

I've never tried an Epson RD-1 so I can't comment on that. But I love the experience of shooting with the M's even if the pixel quality past dusk doesn't equal cameras of half the price.

If the M9 had the Rx-1 Sensor then i'd be a very happy man. I do not like the ergonomics and feel of the M-240.

I hope you buy a camera you enjoy!

 

[Rangefinderfreak]

With todays trend towards four thirds, I think it is a pity leica somehow deserted the M8.
With good parts availability and maybe better sensor, I think it would be a great camera, especially if it would be priced well under the M-E...

 

[jsrockit]

I was using a M8 along with my Fuji X100s and X-Pro1 and eventually I just sold the M8 because it sat around. The Fujis are much more versatile for my photography. The ONLY reason to buy a M8 is because you absolutely want a digital camera with mechanical rangefinder and cannot afford a M9.

 

[djonesii]

Owned Epson and Fuji ....

Owned Epson and Fuji ....

The Epson and Leica are the only true coupled range finder experience you will find in digital ....

For me, that experience is not enough to justify the the expense. Once I got in Micro 4/3rds the Epson sat, and the IQ was much worse IMHO .....

The Fuji solved all that, when I want full manual control, I have it, with AF .... for really critical focus, I can still MF, which I find easier with a non-rf system.

Best;

Dave

 

[TKH]

Go for it!
You never know if you will have the money for it in the future. 🙂

The rangefinder experience will let you take you pics you never think about with "modern" digital cameras:








Go for it!

Rainer

 

[jsrockit]

The rangefinder experience will let you take you pics you never think about with "modern" digital cameras

Like what?

 

[thompsonks]

I'll be the guy who says 'Don't do it.' Rather emphatically.

I used M8s and now use M9s, and recently acquired an X100s – like you already have. And IMO the Fuji doesn't yield in image quality to the M8 unless you couple it with a top-of-the-line M-mount lens.

So I wouldn't consider the M8 alternative. Either stick with Fuji or save for an M9. Its larger sensor makes a difference in IQ, if you make large prints.

 

[TKH]

Like what?

Easy. The non AF rangefinder camera is an every day training to "read and learn" distances and f-stops and pure camera position. After only a few weeks I can use the camera without to much thinking and take (more or less) nice pics in every strange way of holding the camera. You realise angels of view you never thaught about using an AF camera. High above your head, down on the floor, on your knees:




Its like hiking. Yes you can drive two weeks with a car in scotland and you know that you can stop at every interesting point in the highlands. Nothing can beat the feeling to go by feet two weeks and feel the highlands... 🙂

 

[jsrockit]

Easy. The non AF rangefinder camera is an every day training to "read and learn" distances and f-stops and pure camera position. After only a few weeks I can use the camera without to much thinking and take (more or less) nice pics in every strange way of holding the camera. You realise angels of view you never thaught about using an AF camera. High above your head, down on the floor, on your knees

I guess I just think of every camera as a framing device... I make the same photos with a Leica as I make with my AF Fujis. Not sure why I wouldn't. It sounds like you feel in love with your Leica and it was a catalyst in you thinking more about your photography and possibilities.

 

[TKH]

I guess I just think of every camera as a framing device... I make the same photos with a Leica as I make with my AF Fujis. Not sure why I wouldn't. It sounds like you feel in love with your Leica and it was a catalyst in you thinking more about your photography and possibilities.

First off all I have no Leica, only the Epson rangefinder.
And I bet you used rf cameras before your cameras today. You still learned your lesson. But I started ten years ago with DSLRs and never had the chance pf learning RF lessons.
Two of my photo friends working as wedding pros with big Nikon gear are fascinated from the new way for them to focus with my Epson. They are in the middle of the twentys and never in the live focused manual.

 

[froyd]

The Leica would be for my shooting enjoyment. Using a rangefinder is just plain fun! It's like hitting a target every time you nail focus. Even my Fuji X100s' digital split image focusing is not even close to feeling the same.

Ryan-

Since you are talking about enjoying the feeling of a mechanical RF, then go for it and get the M8. There are dozens of reason why you should not get one, but if you want the digital RF experience at sub-M-E prices, then there are only two games in town. Since you already have an x100s, for 35mm, you could consider the Epson for 50 and enjoy the 1:1 VF. The Epson IQ would be lower than Fuji, but your enjoyment might be higher.

Still, if your heart says M8, nothing else will do. I would not worry too much about reliability in your shoes, but buy from a reputable seller with return policy.

 

[filmtwit]

(Don't do it)

Plus it's like picking up a Canon 10D these days.

 

[jsrockit]

First off all I have no Leica, only the Epson rangefinder.
And I bet you used rf cameras before your cameras today. You still learned your lesson. But I started ten years ago with DSLRs and never had the chance pf learning RF lessons. Two of my photo friends working as wedding pros with big Nikon gear are fascinated from the new way for them to focus with my Epson. They are in the middle of the twentys and never in the live focused manual.

I see. Yes, I've used Leica rangefinders on and off since the early 90s. I've always been more fascinated with the ergonomics and the no nonsense approach to a camera that Leica offered more than it being a tool that makes me see differently. But then again, I started photography using manual focus cameras when I switched to Rfs. I tried AF cameras later.

I guess my point is that if you are extremely happy with a camera, you'll will want to go out and use it... and when you are out using it more, you will think more about how you want to approach photography.

 

[SaveKodak]

The M8 is a lot of fun and if you don't get a dud you'll prolly dig it, but honestly save your money for a full frame M. Take that 2 grand and throw it in a bank, in a year or so you can probably double it and pick up an M9 or ME, or you never know, Fuji may have a FF solution, and Sony is set to release a FF NEX this year. I'd just rather invest more into the real deal, than a bit into an 'almost there' solution.

To tide you over, and build your lens selection, pick up a Bessa! You'll spend no money on it by comparison, and use RPL, Indie or The FIND lab to scan your film! You will be amazed by the quality of their scans, and film is better than it ever has been! Portra, Acros, Ektar, Velvia while we got it... You have digital cameras already, and the hybrid workflow has finally past it's growing pains stages to where you can shoot film professionally.

 

[Rotarysmp]

I bought an M8 last year, as my M2 and 50 Summicron had been gathering dust since digital came along.

Since then I bought a 28 Summicron (amazing), was given a 135 Hector (pretty lame), bought a VC 15 (amazing), was given a jupiter 12 (pretty good optically, but dull color and bad eronomics, and given a 28 2.8 Canon (truly aweful egonomics.

I have shot way more on the M8 than the my SLR in the last year. For all its quirks and failings, I just like it.

 

[froyd]

Take that 2 grand and throw it in a bank, in a year or so you can probably double it

I want to switch to your bank.

 

[SaveKodak]

I want to switch to your bank.

I mean, I'm assuming that he'll continue to contribute, not accumulate the money on interest alone.

 

[Keyne]

I LOVE my M8. If you can only afford an M8 then I would recommend buying it from a reputable shop that has a good return policy (KEH, Adorama,Tamarkin, etc.). Once it arrives test it for the dreaded line issue. I did that 2 years ago and returned the first one that had an issue. The second one I kept and seriously love it. It has totally changed my digital photo life. I learned photography as a kid with a Voitlander RF so I missed that experience with digital SLR's. If you want an RF then its a great great camera. To me it isnt all about the image quality (M8 is great enough for me) but the shooting experience. If you dont want an RF then you have many many options available to you but if you want an RF then your choices are obviously limited. An X100 is not an RF so...


However, if you can save up a bit more/longer I would consider an M9. Eventually I plan to buy an M9 but honestly even saying that makes me feel like I am cheating on my M8... it is a great friend and a blast to use. Goes wilth me everywhere.

Enjoy!

 

[crispy12]

I was using a M8 along with my Fuji X100s and X-Pro1 and eventually I just sold the M8 because it sat around. The Fujis are much more versatile for my photography. The ONLY reason to buy a M8 is because you absolutely want a digital camera with mechanical rangefinder and cannot afford a M9.

I'd just rather invest more into the real deal, than a bit into an 'almost there' solution.

I agree with these two posts wholeheartedly! The M8, wonderful camera as it is, is getting quite dated now. The IR issue is very annoying especially if you ever shoot fabrics (people in suits, weddings, parties etc) as it will completely destroy the picture. The filters are not cheap either, and you'd need to buy one for every lens you plan on using. Given the quite crappy high ISO quality, you'll probably end up searching for fast lenses and end up shooting everything at f2 or f1.4 just to get enough light in. This was my personal experience with the M8...

Given the price of ME and M9 prices dropping so much since the M240 came out, I'd really try to save for that. The Fuji will give you much reliably better photo quality (at the cost of user experience) but once you get the FF rangefinder, you will definitely notice the difference.

In the mean time, you can get something like an M6 to use and sell it at a later date for the same price when you get enough to upgrade to the M9.

If you do decide to get it though, just make sure you bring along a laptop to test the files for dead pixels or lines, or buy from a reputable dealer than offers refunds.

 

[AncientCityPhoto]

A m8 is s till a great camera, and is not just a has been since the m9.


The m8 gathers just as much light as any other camera. If you want to shoot hand held in dark environments, then yes, it's high ISO is not the greatest. No CCD camera is. The m9 is not either. I've shot both cameras at high ISO and gotten fantastic images. Know how to expose, and what the real limitations are and you are fine at high ISO. Is just not grainless perfection of modern CMOS from canon and Nikon. I have a P45 as well and you should see that even at ISO200. It's worse than the m8 at 1250. I don't see anyone complaining about those. Base ISO is fantastic on the m8. With so many people wanting the rangefinder experience, just pretend you have iso160 film loaded and can't change it.

The m8 sensor has fantastic resolution and. And it can also double as an infrared camera. Just use an IR filter to block visible light and you can even shoot handheld IR. it's not as fast as a dedicated IR camera, but only a few stops off. Not nearly like using a filter on a normal camera. I love having the option of a good IR camera with the m8 and not having to carry a second camera.

And shooting an m8 at 1/8000 of a second helps a lot if you do want to shoot at f/2 in daylight. The 1/250 sync speed is nice as well if you connect strobes. 1 stop makes a difference. The m9 has one stop better noise and look at all the praise people give it over the m8.