Too contrasty?

J

Jamie123

Veteran
Local time
7:39 AM
Joined
Nov 27, 2005
Messages
2,833
View My Gallery
I love to take pictures with my Bessa III but DAMN this lens is contrasty! Even with 'neutral' color film the contrast is pretty strong in sunlight. It's not necessarily a bad thing but I'm starting to wonder whether this kind of look is not something I can also get from my DSLR (blasphemy!). I shoot medium format film for the soft gradations it produces, not for the resolution.

Anyways, I'll thoroughly put the camera through it's paces on my vacation to the US in August. After that I'll have to evaluate whether or not I'll keep the Bessa or whether I sell it and 'downgrade' to a Mamya 7II.

Just some of my late night thoughts. Maybe I'll change my mind tomorrow 🙂
What do you guys who also have the camera think about this?
 
I don't have the camera but for sure that sharp contrasty lens must produce great results under direct sun with low contrast color negative film generously exposed... I meter Portra 160 NC at +2/3 with TTL camera metering: at ISO 100 with or without warming filter. And for more precise incident metering (and warming filter) at ISO 40. If you don't like the warming filter under direct sun, test a roll at ISO 50 incident: great color and controlled contrast...

Cheers,

Juan
 
Jamie123 said:
I love to take pictures with my Bessa III but DAMN this lens is contrasty! Even with 'neutral' color film the contrast is pretty strong in sunlight. It's not necessarily a bad thing but I'm starting to wonder whether this kind of look is not something I can also get from my DSLR (blasphemy!). I shoot medium format film for the soft gradations it produces, not for the resolution.

Anyways, I'll thoroughly put the camera through it's paces on my vacation to the US in August. After that I'll have to evaluate whether or not I'll keep the Bessa or whether I sell it and 'downgrade' to a Mamya 7II.

Just some of my late night thoughts. Maybe I'll change my mind tomorrow 🙂
What do you guys who also have the camera think about this?
Click to expand...

What kind of pictures are you making that you think it is letting you down on, subject-wise?

I seem to recall you have a Hasselblad also? I've not used a Mamiya, but it doesn't have the same lens signature syrup as the Hasselblad, from the shots I've seen.
 
In the limited time I had Australia's 'Travellig Bessa' I liked the camera but not so much the lens. Sharp and contrasty but not really a lot of character IMO.

I supect with long term ownership and more chance to experiment with different films that opinion might change ... two weeks is not long!
 
John NYC said:
What kind of pictures are you making that you think it is letting you down on, subject-wise?

I seem to recall you have a Hasselblad also? I've not used a Mamiya, but it doesn't have the same lens signature syrup as the Hasselblad, from the shots I've seen.
Click to expand...

I actually use it for everything from portraits to general street or landscape stuff. The thing is I'm using Portra 400NC (my standard film) but the colors are really punchy and the highlights are a bit too bright.
I used to have a Hasselblad but sold it and bought the Bessa III. The lenses on the Hasselblad were great but it was a bit too bulky a kit to lug around and I wanted to shoot 6x7. I know the Mamiya lenses don't have the same lens signature as the Hasselblad lenses but going back to Hasselblad is not really an option for me as I don't want to be restricted to the square.
 
akremer said:
I have seen lots of high contrast examples from the III - can you easily edit it out in post?
Click to expand...

It's a lot easier to increase contrast in post than to decrease it. You can dial down the saturation and recover some highlights by doing multiple scans with lower light intensity but it's a hassle.
 
Over exposure might help a bit. Tends to even out most of your scene and give you some even contrast. I normally rate my 400 NC at 250 and get some decent results.
 
kzphoto said:
Over exposure might help a bit. Tends to even out most of your scene and give you some even contrast. I normally rate my 400 NC at 250 and get some decent results.
Click to expand...

I'll definitely try overexposure. Actually, the Bessa's meter tends to underexpose a bit so that might be one of the reasons why I'm getting so much contrast.
 
kzphoto said:
Over exposure might help a bit. Tends to even out most of your scene and give you some even contrast. I normally rate my 400 NC at 250 and get some decent results.
Click to expand...

Yes, agree. Over-exposing Portra NC is really the "look" that most people think of when talking about Portra NC.
 
I've tamed high contrast lenses with a 2-bath developer. The compensating action gives you endless tonality. For anything up to 400 asa try Barry Thornton's 2-bath.
Completely idiot proof, costs pennies to make and produces outstanding results.
 
Harry Lime said:
I've tamed high contrast lenses with a 2-bath developer. The compensating action gives you endless tonality. For anything up to 400 asa try Barry Thornton's 2-bath.
Completely idiot proof, costs pennies to make and produces outstanding results.
Click to expand...

Does it do color C-41? 🙂
 
As Harry, I thought you were thinking your lens produces high contrast in general, and not that all C-41 films produce high contrast in general... 🙂 Now seriously, that 2-bath development goes beyond pulling, and can be decisive when both sunny and shadows areas require a good tonal range... As in a church with a light beam through a window, where more exposure and less development just aren't enough to make it... Forum member charjohncarter has posted great examples...

Cheers,

Juan
 
Last edited:
Remember that with negative film, there's a printer or scanner between the neg and what you see... The lab setup affects the output.

Over-exposing C41 films about a stop does indeed reduce contrast a bit, increases shadow detail and overall smoothness and color saturation.
 
I share your pain about the weight of the Hassy. I finally gave up on carrying mine on a strap and found a little side case for it at the thrift store. It works much better that way, as long as it's on one of those wide elastic straps. Nothing I did got it to hand properly on a strap.

Are you scanning your own negs? It's a simple process to turn down the contrast in Photoshop, and/or desaturate the shot at the same time. There's also some Fuji films out there (someone will have to help me out on this because I seldom shoot color, but I know it's available) that have a less saturated look. That's generally the first area to look at. Switch films and see how that goes.
 
Juan Valdenebro said:
As Harry, I thought you were thinking your lens produces high contrast in general, and not that all C-41 films produce high contrast in general... 🙂 Now seriously, that 2-bath development goes beyond pulling, and can be decisive when both sunny and shadows areas require a good tonal range... As in a church with a light beam through a window, where more exposure and less development just aren't enough to make it... Forum member charjohncarter has posted great examples...

Cheers,

Juan
Click to expand...

Harry is right about the two bath method. It does reduce the 'too contrasty' problem. But I think Harry and I, although we use slightly different methods, will use these methods with any lens (not just 'too contrasy' lenses). Of course, Harry and I are talking about B&W film.

My problem with the OP statement is that I'm not sure that C-41 is inherently high contrast. My experience is even with a high contrast lenses C-41 will produce acceptable results. I recently took these in Mexico under blazing sun with a very cheap camera (Canon AS-6):

Shady side, into the sun:

4667461830_90e14c668f.jpg


Heavy sun but shaded side is still not blocked:

4667462692_85b4bceaf9.jpg


Just a note I did find a few complaints about Bessa III and a high contrast lens. Just how significant that is, is out of my knowledge level.
 
Last edited:
Juan Valdenebro said:
As Harry, I thought you were thinking your lens produces high contrast in general, and not that all C-41 films produce high contrast in general... 🙂 Now seriously, that 2-bath development goes beyond pulling, and can be decisive when both sunny and shadows areas require a good tonal range... As in a church with a light beam through a window, where more exposure and less development just aren't enough to make it... Forum member charjohncarter has posted great examples...

Cheers,

Juan
Click to expand...

Oh, I wasn't trying to suggest that all C-41 films produce high contrast in general, I was really just talking about this lens. What I meant was, while a two bath developer sounds like an adequate method for black&white film it doesn't do me much good because I almost exclusively shoot color c-41.
 
Steve M. said:
I share your pain about the weight of the Hassy. I finally gave up on carrying mine on a strap and found a little side case for it at the thrift store. It works much better that way, as long as it's on one of those wide elastic straps. Nothing I did got it to hand properly on a strap.

Are you scanning your own negs? It's a simple process to turn down the contrast in Photoshop, and/or desaturate the shot at the same time. There's also some Fuji films out there (someone will have to help me out on this because I seldom shoot color, but I know it's available) that have a less saturated look. That's generally the first area to look at. Switch films and see how that goes.
Click to expand...

I'm scanning my own negs on a Nikon 9000ED so I have quite a lot of control over the process. I'm also sufficiently proficient in PS to do the required adjustments in order to get the colors I want. My problem however is that I'm starting to feel that I can't quite get the soft gradations I'm used to with medium format film with this lens. For me this has always been the 'medium format advantage' and it's the reason why I'm still shooting film next to digital.
As for the film I'm pretty set on Kodak Portra 400NC which is pretty neutral.
 
Jamie123 said:
As for the film I'm pretty set on Kodak Portra 400NC which is pretty neutral.
Click to expand...

I've got a roll of 400NC in my Bessa III right now. I'll let you know how mine turns out. Believe it or not, this will be the first time a roll of Portra NC has been in this camera for me!
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom