Trade M3 for M4?

[Rayt]

I think an M4 would be a perfect companion to the M3, one for a 35mm and the other for 50mm and longer, certainly not a replacement. Given a 50mm is usable on either the M3 and M4 (and M2 etc), it depends on whether you favor the 35mm focal length vs a 90mm when deciding on an M3 or not.

 

[Glenn2]

I started my Leica journey back in the late sixties, was looking for a more compact camera for traveling. Must have been complaining about the bulk of SLR’s when a friend said “you should try one of these” and placed his M2 in my hands. Perfect, the rounded ends must have been influenced by the broom handle Mauser. ;-)

Couldn’t find an M2 but was able to pick up an M3, even bought a second one. 35mm was the problem, I had the googled 35 Summicron and hated it. Bulky and the goggles were finger print magnets. Got a pair of M4’s in 1969 and knew I had perfection. Loading and rewinding advances were welcome changes as well. Horst in Vancouver did a CLA on them before his passing. Still have them along with a bunch of Leica lenses but at 81 am feeling like my wandering days are over. :-(

What ever the choice, use it/them as often as possible……..

Glenn

 

[Retro-Grouch]

I'm not sure I understand this discussion. Obviously you want.....no, I mean you NEED both. Why are we talking this way?

How many of us have an M3, and an M2, and an M......so on..... ?
And then the digital Ms?

Should I be ashamed? 😬

We are all shameless equipment whores here on RFF. Worry not; you are amongst friends. But do be careful what you say to outsiders! 😉

 

[Disappointed_Horse]

We are all shameless equipment whores here on RFF. Worry not; you are amongst friends. But do be careful what you say to outsiders! 😉

What happens on RFF, stays on RFF.

 

[chuckroast]

We are all shameless equipment whores here on RFF. Worry not; you are amongst friends. But do be careful what you say to outsiders! 😉

EXCUSE ME??? I, sir, am a "Shameless Equipment Executive Escort".

 

[Retro-Grouch]

EXCUSE ME??? I, sir, am a "Shameless Equipment Executive Escort".

Hey, if it looks like a duck, and walks like a duck...

 

[JSteed#2]

This is a heretical thought, or perhaps offensive question since we all shoot very old Leicas, and our Leicas are likely to outlive us all.....All things being equal, is the M4 is likely to last longer before requiring service or packing up mid roll????

Please don't hate me. I still shoot my IIIb among other Leicas....Love them all.

 

[Retro-Grouch]

This is a heretical thought, or perhaps offensive question since we all shoot very old Leicas, and our Leicas are likely to outlive us all.....All things being equal, is the M4 is likely to last longer before requiring service or packing up mid roll????

Please don't hate me. I still shoot my IIIb among other Leicas....Love them all.

Probably no difference, since both cameras are built to the very highest standards. There are no electronics to fail, so the need for service is going to be a question of how they're used, where they're used, your local climate, etc. Every mechanical camera should see a CLA periodically, but the frequency depends on those factors. And you'd be amazed by the improvement you can feel in a camera's performance after a CLA, even when that camera seems to be working fine.
One thing you can't control with these cameras is the treatment they received before you owned them. A used camera's history is usually unknown.

 

[Shac]

Are there sometimes problems with M3s if they need rangefinder parts, whereas with the M4 no such problem (currently)?
Also the M4 is younger. Just my 10cents worth

Goo luck with the decision

 

[chuckroast]

Hey, if it looks like a duck, and walks like a duck...

The verb you are looking for is "sashays" like a duck ...

 

[chuckroast]

This is a heretical thought, or perhaps offensive question since we all shoot very old Leicas, and our Leicas are likely to outlive us all.....All things being equal, is the M4 is likely to last longer before requiring service or packing up mid roll????

Please don't hate me. I still shoot my IIIb among other Leicas....Love them all.

Yeah I have a super clean IIIf that is in my rotation. Apart from replacing the original takeup spool with the later version that could actually be extracted by human hands and a CLA, the only thing I've ever had to do to it - and this was done today - was replace the plastic frame around the view/focus windows. Mine cracked but aftermarket replacements are abundant.

I also abandoned the legacy Leica LTM glass on this camera in favor of LTM Voigtlander Color-Skopars. I find them just as sharp but more contrasty than the legacy Leitz optics. In fact, I like the 21mm f/4 LTM Color-Skopar so much, I use it on my M bodies with an adapter ring.

The one exception is that I kept an uncoated 50mm f/3.5 collpasible Elmar because that lack of coating makes it do beautiful things with light sources and specular highlights.

 

[Mackinaw]

Probably the most photographically satisfying day I had last summer was photographing "behind the scenes" stuff at our County Fair. I just took along my dual-stroke M3, a 35mm Summicron ASPH (fitted with a 35mm finder) a few rolls of Tri-X and my light meter. I could have took along my MP, but the M3, for me, is just more satisfying to use. As they say, different strokes for different folks.

Jim B.

 

[chuckroast]

Probably the most photographically satisfying day I had last summer was photographing "behind the scenes" stuff at our County Fair. I just took along my dual-stroke M3, a 35mm Summicron ASPH (fitted with a 35mm finder) a few rolls of Tri-X and my light meter. I could have took along my MP, but the M3, for me, is just more satisfying to use. As they say, different strokes for different folks.

Jim B.

Wouldn't that be "Different double strokes for different folks"?

 

[shawn]

Are there sometimes problems with M3s if they need rangefinder parts, whereas with the M4 no such problem (currently)?
Also the M4 is younger. Just my 10cents worth

Goo luck with the decision

The mirror coating on the prism in the m3 can oxidize and eventually render the rf dead. Took 3 tries for me to get a m3 without this problem. YYe pointed this out to me on the first M3 I brought to him. No parts from Leica. One company can resilver it. I think the other problem is the prism can need to be recemented, but more people are willing to fix that.

 

[Mackinaw]

The mirror coating on the prism in the m3 can oxidize and eventually render the rf dead. Took 3 tries for me to get a m3 without this problem. YYe pointed this out to me on the first M3 I brought to him. No parts from Leica. One company can resilver it. I think the other problem is the prism can need to be recemented, but more people are willing to fix that.

Kanto can fix the viewfinder/rangefinder on M3's.

Repair & Restoration

Jim B.

 

[Talus]

Add a viewfinder magnifier to a 0.72x magnification M-body, and presto, you get all the benefits of the greater mag of the M3 (or even more mag than the M3), and can have crank rewind and easier loading too.

A 1.4x from LLL will provide life-size viewing.

Not a bad idea.

 

[CMur12]

Hey, if it looks like a duck, and walks like a duck...

I think you misspelled whore.

- Murray

 

[d_c]

Kanto can fix the viewfinder/rangefinder on M3's.

Repair & Restoration

Jim B.

My understanding is that this is something that Cameraworks-UK can also do - Rangefinder Work | website.

 

[Jonathan R]

One other point about the M4 - I hate, hate, hate the quick load takeup spool on that camera. For some reason, I struggle to get it to grip the film.

Is it just me?

Try operating the lever wind before inserting the film. For me, this simple action resolved a decade of frustration, where often the tulip would grip the film, but sometimes not. Now it always grips.

 

[chuckroast]

Try operating the lever wind before inserting the film. For me, this simple action resolved a decade of frustration, where often the tulip would grip the film, but sometimes not. Now it always grips.

Interesting. Any idea why a cocked camera loads more reliably?