squirrel$$$bandit
Veteran
Massive dev chart has two entries. One says 8 minutes, the other says 6.75. Which one's right?
Thanks!
Thanks!
bmattock
Veteran
Depends on the dilution, tank size, what speed you rated the film at, and temperature. I use D76 with Tri-X 1+1 for 10 minutes @ 68 degrees Fahrenheit.
D76 and Tri-X is bog stock, so Kodak has the data you seek, and their info should be depended upon. If it were cross-manufacturer or some weird coupling of developer and film, then Massive Dev Chart is the way to go.
http://www.kodak.com/global/en/professional/support/techPubs/j78/j78.jhtml
D76 and Tri-X is bog stock, so Kodak has the data you seek, and their info should be depended upon. If it were cross-manufacturer or some weird coupling of developer and film, then Massive Dev Chart is the way to go.
http://www.kodak.com/global/en/professional/support/techPubs/j78/j78.jhtml
kbg32
neo-romanticist
6.75 is the recommended development. Develop a roll and see how the negatives look. Too thin, develop longer or lower the ASA rating on your camera. Too dense, expose and develop accordingly. Some people agitate every 30 seconds. Some, once every minute. There is no real standard. These are suggested times.
photophorous
Registered User
It is common to see more than one time on the Massive Development Chart, because it usually includes times for older versions of the film. Look to the right and you will see a hyperlink that says "Notes," for one of the entries. Click on that and it takes to this, "Development data is taken from a previous version of this film. Starting point time remains the same."
Paul
Paul
aparat
Established
I have had good success with TX 400 (the current version of Tri-X in 400 speed) in 6:45 (stock) and 9:45 (1:1) at 20C. In my experience, stock will give you less visible grain than 1:1.
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lawrence
Veteran
With the greatest respect to other posters, 8 minutes is correct! Anything less and your negs will be too thin. I was caught out by the shorter time and it's a mystery as to why Kodak shows this time, however I guess that's why Digitaltruth continues to show the old time "Development data is taken from a previous version of this film. Starting point time remains the same." My time for 1+1 is 11 minutes.
squirrel$$$bandit
Veteran
Heh heh, perhaps I'll try 7.37 minutes...
...I'm using stock solution, BTW. Very new to developing, so I'm just now beginning to find out what works for me, and what I like.
Thanks!
...I'm using stock solution, BTW. Very new to developing, so I'm just now beginning to find out what works for me, and what I like.
Thanks!
Ronald M
Veteran
What is right is what is right for you. You are required to test.
For me, ISO 400 D76 1:1 for a condenser enlarger is 9.75 min. If I use stock solution time is 6.5.
Your water PH is different than mine. Your agitation is perhaps different. Your enlarger is more or less contrasty than mine. You camera and enlarging lenses are different.
You need to test.
For me, ISO 400 D76 1:1 for a condenser enlarger is 9.75 min. If I use stock solution time is 6.5.
Your water PH is different than mine. Your agitation is perhaps different. Your enlarger is more or less contrasty than mine. You camera and enlarging lenses are different.
You need to test.
michaelging
Established
All the above posters are correct,that is that there is no one perfect time for everyone. I rate my Tri-x by the contrast of the scene. Flat lighting, such as heavy overcast, I rate the film at 650 and dev it in D76 straight for 9 min at 68 degrees. Normal contrast I rate the film at 400 and develop it at 8 min straight or 10 min ,1 to 1. For Bright sun ,(Arizona in the summertime) I rate my Tri-x at 200 and develop it for 8 min at 1 to 1. Try a time ,see if the negs work for you, and adjust so that you get a neg that is best for your photography. I fine that its better to add contrast to your final image, not by developing longer as this adds grain, but instead doing it with photoshop, or a higher grade paper.The trick is doing it the same way with each step, every time so you are consistent.
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squirrel$$$bandit
Veteran
ay caramba, I have a lot to learn...
jan normandale
Film is the other way
Michael, I'd be very interested in seeing some shots taken as you describe above here
"For Bright sun ,(Arizona in the summertime) I rate my Tri-x at 200 and develop it for 8 min at 1 to 1."
That's one full stop over exposure in AZ sun. I'm surprised by this since I would think it blows out highlights etc. Could you include an image in this thread. I'm intrigued to see how this looks. I'd have gone for some underexposure and rated at say 640 ISO. Thanks
"For Bright sun ,(Arizona in the summertime) I rate my Tri-x at 200 and develop it for 8 min at 1 to 1."
That's one full stop over exposure in AZ sun. I'm surprised by this since I would think it blows out highlights etc. Could you include an image in this thread. I'm intrigued to see how this looks. I'd have gone for some underexposure and rated at say 640 ISO. Thanks
eavis
Member
I use Tri-X with 1:1 D76 all the time for a range of ISO ratings. I have never veered from the Kodak tech sheet times. They always work exactly as I'd want. Here's the tech sheet:
http://www.kodak.com/global/en/professional/support/techPubs/f4017/f4017.pdf
http://www.kodak.com/global/en/professional/support/techPubs/f4017/f4017.pdf
Chriscrawfordphoto
Real Men Shoot Film.
Jan,
In bright contrasy sun you overexpose and underdevelop. The underdeveloping reduces contrast, keeping the highlights in check. It also cuts about a stop of film speed, so you need to add a stop to keep the shadow detail (so its not really overexposing..the film speed drops so you expose accordingly). The usual procedure is to reduce dev. time by 20-30% from normal for this kind of light. Zone system users call it N-1 developing.
In bright contrasy sun you overexpose and underdevelop. The underdeveloping reduces contrast, keeping the highlights in check. It also cuts about a stop of film speed, so you need to add a stop to keep the shadow detail (so its not really overexposing..the film speed drops so you expose accordingly). The usual procedure is to reduce dev. time by 20-30% from normal for this kind of light. Zone system users call it N-1 developing.
lawrence
Veteran
ay caramba, I have a lot to learn...
But hey, wouldn't it be boring if we all agreed with each other
bmattock
Veteran
This group would bitch if they were hanged with a new rope.
squirrel$$$bandit
Veteran
This group would bitch if they were hanged with a new rope.
"I distinctly remember requesting a mahogany gibbet, gentlemen."
jan normandale
Film is the other way
hey Chris, thanks for the 'splanation. I've always just shot at the rated speed and then used the Massive Dev chart. It works but as usual you eventually find out there's always another level
I've never read about Zone systems or using it to deal with light situations like you described. Then developing 'off chart' so to speak. I guess I've got some homework and I just love homework. I'm sure I'll be better for it tho.
BTW I've liked your BW work you put up in another thread here at RFF
I've never read about Zone systems or using it to deal with light situations like you described. Then developing 'off chart' so to speak. I guess I've got some homework and I just love homework. I'm sure I'll be better for it tho.
BTW I've liked your BW work you put up in another thread here at RFF
nikon_sam
Shooter of Film...
What is right is what is right for you. You are required to test.
For me, ISO 400 D76 1:1 for a condenser enlarger is 9.75 min. If I use stock solution time is 6.5.
Your water PH is different than mine. Your agitation is perhaps different. Your enlarger is more or less contrasty than mine. You camera and enlarging lenses are different.
You need to test.
Very true indeed...
I feel like an outsider with my numbers...
Tri-X or Neopan 400 gets D-76 1:1 @ 68* for 12 minutes, agitate for 15 seconds every two minutes...I like my negs and they print just fine with my enlarger...
You gotta find what works for YOU!!!
michaelging
Established
Jan , Christopher did a good job of explaining about overexposure and underdevelopment. I had a quick look though my photos and I do not see one that jumps out as one that I did this with . Most of the times that I had to do that , was when I was shooting film for the paper and had to shoot a photo at noon on a summer day. Those photos are not here in my gallery, but there are many examples of Tri-x and D76 here, if you open the photo , I almost always put the film dev combo in the details, and as I said 99.9% of all these B&W are tri-x.
http://photo.net/photodb/member-photos?user_id=947345&include=all&unlimit=1
http://photo.net/photodb/member-photos?user_id=947345&include=all&unlimit=1
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Chriscrawfordphoto
Real Men Shoot Film.
Very true indeed...
I feel like an outsider with my numbers...
Tri-X or Neopan 400 gets D-76 1:1 @ 68* for 12 minutes, agitate for 15 seconds every two minutes...I like my negs and they print just fine with my enlarger...
You gotta find what works for YOU!!!
You agitate a lot less than most people do, and that could account for you needing a longer Dev. Time.
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