Ukrainian script Kiev-4, just how rare?

[batterytypehah!]

Hi, back to posting here after a couple of years.

I decided to support my local camera show, mostly because I like to still HAVE a local camera show, and, on a whim, got this tired but working Kiev for ten bucks (no lens).

When I fired up sovietcams.com at home just to see what exactly I had, to my surprise I found it described as “ultra rare.” Turns out the bilingual “Kiev” script is Ukrainian and English, not Russian. (Which would never have occurred to me, makes sense though, I believe in Ukrainian it’s actually pronounced “Ki-yiv” not “Ki-yev.”)

It’s a 58xxxx serial number just like the other ones known to exist, per the site.

My (lame) attempt to justify this particular GAS attack was that it would give me something to practice on while I work up the nerve to CLA my Contax IIa.* Now I’m wondering if I should leave it alone as a collectible.

It works on all speeds but is very sluggish below 1/50, and advance feels rough. Quieter shutter than my Contax though.

*Yes, post-war IIa. I said it was a lame excuse…

 

[Pioneer]

Didn't know that was rare. Mine has exactly the same script on the plate. Nice camera though and mine works great. Shoot it and enjoy.

 

[FrankS]

The earlier and rarer ones have only the Kneb engraving.

 

[batterytypehah!]

You need to look closely at the Cyrillic script, the difference is in the 3rd letter.

e - Russian
ї - Ukrainian

I'll try to find some close-ups around the web.

 

[batterytypehah!]

Here you go, this is what I have: http://ussrphoto.com/Wiki/default.asp?WikiCatID=20&ParentID=1&ContentID=1178&Item=Kiev+4++Ukrainian+Logo+-+1958

Except on mine the engraving is filled with black paint that has partially worn away, which makes it hard to take a good picture. (That, and using an iPad camera, sorry, it's what I have right now.)

 

[batterytypehah!]

And here's the exact link to sovietcams http://www.sovietcams.com/index.php?960432535

 

[bobby_novatron]

You're correct, the pronunciation of "Kiev" is 'Ky-iv' in Ukrainian. I'm half-Ukrainian on my mother's side, so I heard a lot of it around the house while growing up, but I speak it very poorly. LOL!

I own 3 different "Kiev" cameras from different eras, 1957 / 1966 / 1981 and they all of the Russian version of the name. I'm very surprised that the factory even made a version with Ukrainian script -- the USSR wasn't known to be exactly friendly to non-Russian cultures, with 'Russification' and all that.

 

[batterytypehah!]

Right, I wonder what the story is behind this variant. It must be very obvious to Ukrainian and Russian speakers, like US versus British spellings, I imagine.

At any rate, given the current situation over there, I'm actually pleased to own one that's not only made in Ukraine, but announces it ever so subversively...

 

[bobby_novatron]

It would be very obvious to Russian / Ukrainian speakers, you're correct. But I think the differences are significantly greater than the dialects spoken between American and UK English. Ukrainian has a lot of different spellings, and somewhat different vocabulary from Russian. When I hear people speaking Russian I can tell immediately that it's Russian and NOT Ukrainian.

I'm no linguist, but I think a fair comparison would be to say Ukrainian and Russian are related like French and Provencal, or maybe Spanish and Catalan. They're cousins, but not interchangeable.

For curiosity's sake I just took a quick look at eBay under "Kiev" and "Kyiv" cameras, and after sifting through lots of auctions I found no variants that look like yours. I must say I'm a bit jealous!

 

[jbielikowski]

Now thats interesting! Still its ugly as hell, I covered mine with gaffer, early Kiev II bold logo is so much nicer... I'd say, keep it as a collectible (or sell and get yourself that IIa). I have '57 Kiev II and while it works perfect (it was just restored by the best technician in Poland) winding/shutter speed mechanism is far from nice&smooth.

 

[batterytypehah!]

I know, that was a bad example. They are of course two distinct languages.

I should have said Spanish and Portuguese, but your example of Spanish and Catalan is even better. I can't imagine a consumer product with a blatantly Catalan name being produced under Franco. (Maybe I'm wrong there, I don't know enough of that history.)

 

[batterytypehah!]

Jan, I already have the IIa, and it's a great user. I honestly don't understand why it isn't more popular today.

 

[jbielikowski]

Oh, no idea how I read GAS insted of CLA... Well, if one could mount J-12 on IIa I suspect its popularity would be greater.