using a 'big' lens

You're wrong, Gregory.

First, I don't want to work your opinion to make it closer to mine.

Second, you shouldn't consider a problem or feel upset if most people consider size matters.

Third, photography has more relation with delicateness than with guts... Only you can judge the public and private success of your photography. Only you can imagine if it could have been better if done in any other way. Of course I understand your opinion... You say size makes no difference, and I think it makes a difference to me, to you, to street people and to your photography. You're right: you don't need to think the same way other people think.

Cheers,

Juan
 
>>> Nikkor AIS

How true.
I love the little story about the heart pounding. Attitude does play the most part. When I walk down the street with the Norita I'm very conscious about taking a picture of a person close up. As I know if I did, they and every other person in a 5km radius would hear its mirror slap and turn and look (at least that what I think, truth be told, very few people would care).
The bigger the gear the more visible the photographer feels. True, a big lens can be seen more easily, but it does not change the fact that you're carrying a camera. Whatever the size, it takes a photograph. How people respond to that is not the role of the camera, but how the photographer adjusts their self to the situation.

I see people using P&S's just as I see people using DSLR's with a 1000mm attached. This inconspicuousness RF'ers talk about is really how they handle themselves out on the street, not how much gaffer tape they have over the Leica logo.
 
Neare said:
True, a big lens can be seen more easily, but it does not change the fact that you're carrying a camera. Whatever the size, it takes a photograph. How people respond to that is not the role of the camera, but how the photographer adjusts their self to the situation.
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Not at all!

People react differently to an XA and a Hasselblad!

And there's nothing the photographer can do... Maybe you don't have enough experience with different equipment in the street... Or maybe you're very visible always, no matter the gear used...

The differences the OP states in the first post are very real, and you can hear the same opinion from most unknown and famous photographers. Just ask and read.

Cheers,

Juan
 
Juan Valdenebro said:
I'm not sure Roger's opinion is your "extension" exactly... I think he prefers very small gear for the same reason most of us do...

Cheers,

Juan
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Dear Juan,

You're both right.

Smaller. lighter, quieter gear = easier to carry and use, less obtrusive.

Gear you're comfortable with = less obtrusive.

I can be pretty damn' unobtrusive with a Nikon F, because I'm used to them. F4 and later - as obtrusive as a monster DSLR. That's how I feel, not necessarily how I look -- but how I (you) feel is nine-tenths of the story.

Cheers,

R.
 
Juan Valdenebro said:
People react differently to an XA and a Hasselblad!
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Of course. But if a person is looking at you and you suddenly take their picture, they will realise no matter which camera you use.

The point I was trying to make was that if you are using a hassy on the street, you can't use it like an XA and get the same effect. You have to adjust your attitude to the size of the gear. There are photographers who do this exceptionally well and are able to stick hassy's in peoples faces and take a shot. And those people only realise after hearing the 'clunk!'
 
Hi Roger,

You can't be damn unobtrusive in a silent church with SLRs just because you're used to them. In many cases "nine tenths" can be "one tenth". In other cases I can also use SLRs without problems.

In "nine tenths" of the cases, smaller gear (XA vs. Hasselblad) helps more than how we feel about our gear. It's a visual and auditive reality. People are not blind. People are not deaf.

Cheers,

Juan
 
Neare said:
Of course. But if a person is looking at you and you suddenly take their picture, they will realise no matter which camera you use.

The point I was trying to make was that if you are using a hassy on the street, you can't use it like an XA and get the same effect. You have to adjust your attitude to the size of the gear. There are photographers who do this exceptionally well and are able to stick hassy's in peoples faces and take a shot. And those people only realise after hearing the 'clunk!'
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C'mon... Are we talking about special, unusual magicians here, or about the commonly accepted reality? Of course I accept I can make unobtrusive my Hassy to a point, but we all know we can make unobtrusive an XA to a different point... Why so hard to accept this as the general thing? Will we start a poll? :p Just kidding...

Cheers,

Juan
 
But if you pointed a XA at me, or if you pointed a hassy at me and I was looking your way... I'd notice you taking a picture.

So really, the size of ones gear only makes a difference when one is... not taking pictures?

:D
 
Neare said:
But if you pointed a XA at me, or if you pointed a hassy at me and I was looking your way... I'd notice you taking a picture.

So really, the size of ones gear only makes a difference when one is... not taking pictures?

:D
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People who detect me pointing at them with my Hassy and with my XA react in opposite ways... Looks like you don't really know what you're talking about...

I guess it's all been said, and clearly, by both of us... So this should be over...

Cheers,

Juan
 
A certain percentage of people do not want to be photographed. Most people will also assume that a large lens is a telephoto. When they see a big lens pointed at them, they think closeup. If someone doesn't want to be photographed, being shot in a closeup adds salt to the wound. In addition, that lens is more likely to be caught out of the corner of a subject's eye.
 
Juan Valdenebro said:
People who detect me pointing at them with my Hassy and with my XA react in opposite ways... Looks like you don't really know what you're talking about...

I guess it's all been said, and clearly, by both of us... So this should be over...

Cheers,

Juan
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Juan don't end a good argument :),

Reacting is different to seeing. I am under the impression that this thread is about being noticed while taking pictures and if the size of gear has an effect on that.

Bigger cameras are more intimidating for sure, they are louder too (though this is only a factor after you have taken the shot anyhow). I simply believe that people notice others taking pictures (provided you are in front of them) whether they be doing it with a 8x10 on a tripod or a Leica M.

I'm sure they'll take more interest in the 8x10 if they have a moment to spare. But if I point either camera at a person in front of me, from my own experience, they will react in the same "my picture is being taken!" way.
 
Neare said:
Juan don't end a good argument :),

Reacting is different to seeing. I am under the impression that this thread is about being noticed while taking pictures and if the size of gear has an effect on that.

Bigger cameras are more intimidating for sure, they are louder too (though this is only a factor after you have taken the shot anyhow). I simply believe that people notice others taking pictures (provided you are in front of them) whether they be doing it with a 8x10 on a tripod or a Leica M.

I'm sure they'll take more interest in the 8x10 if they have a moment to spare. But if I point either camera at a person in front of me, from my own experience, they will react in the same "my picture is being taken!" way.
Click to expand...

Believe me you'll get more experience and remember this thread in the future...

Cheers,

Juan
 
wgerrard said:
A certain percentage of people do not want to be photographed. Most people will also assume that a large lens is a telephoto. When they see a big lens pointed at them, they think closeup. If someone doesn't want to be photographed, being shot in a closeup adds salt to the wound. In addition, that lens is more likely to be caught out of the corner of a subject's eye.
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That's it!

When I started to use my CV 28 3.5 (black on black camera) I was amazed at how people reacted to it: they think it's a toy camera, and they don't see me as a problem... Even if they see me shooting at them quickly... If I use other "small" lenses, like my 40 1.4, or a small SLR, the situation is another one... Not my imagination... That happens just with that lens or with the XA... A flat lens and the camera in hand with no strap is like magic...

Cheers,

Juan
 
Thank you for being patronizing.

That is, you 'obviously' know far far more than I do. :rolleyes:
 
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I think Gregory's shots speak for themselves. I also find people react the same regardless of which lens I'm using.
Juan you seem a little argumentative, perhaps try to see the other side of the discussion. Personally, I notice every camera pointed at me unless from very far away, but I don't care, it's their misfortune to have a picture of me :p
 
Juan Valdenebro said:
Without your irony, yes. I know smaller cameras are less obtrusive AND less offensive when detected shooting at someone.

Cheers,

Juan
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Should I quote all my posts in this thread or would you do me the favour and go back and read each one? Perhaps you might understand that I am in consensus with big means being noticed more. :)
 
thrice said:
I think Gregory's shots speak for themselves. I also find people react the same regardless of which lens I'm using.
Juan you seem a little argumentative, perhaps try to see the other side of the discussion. Personally, I notice every camera pointed at me unless from very far away, but I don't care, it's their misfortune to have a picture of me :p
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Fully agreed! Proof is in the pudding. Gregory's shots show it all and support his point. Juan's shots....? Where are Juan's shots? Hmmm. lol.:rolleyes:
 
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