Voigtlander 50/2 Collapsible Heliar

[johannielscom]

Doug,

The nickel Heliar is only 14 grammes lighter than the (confirmed brass) nickel Summar, as per Leica forum specs. It is a lot heavier than the (confirmed aluminium) Jupiter-8!

The chance of it being brass is a lot bigger than it being aluminium.

Erik, you apparently want the Heliar to look like a Rigid Summar more than it does but to entertain me, can you point me towards a lens that resembles a Rigid Summar more than the Heliar?

Meanwhile, let's not forget that the Heliar and Summar are different optical designs, that the nickel Heliar was the only lens made in nickel since Leica abandoned nickel plating some 75 years earlier, that the Heliars are the bee's knees in lens design since they are 2.0 wide open and that the Heliar might prove to be a future collectible, since it is more rare in numbers than the Rigid Summar... Even if it does have brushed nickel plating instead of a gloss one!

 

[Erik van Straten]

Doug,

The nickel Heliar is only 14 grammes lighter than the (confirmed brass) nickel Summar, as per Leica forum specs. It is a lot heavier than the (confirmed aluminium) Jupiter-8!

The chance of it being brass is a lot bigger than it being aluminium.

Erik, you apparently want the Heliar to look like a Rigid Summar more than it does but to entertain me, can you point me towards a lens that resembles a Rigid Summar more than the Heliar?

Meanwhile, let's not forget that the Heliar and Summar are different optical designs, that the nickel Heliar was the only lens made in nickel since Leica abandoned nickel plating some 75 years earlier, that the Heliars are the bee's knees in lens design since they are 2.0 wide open and that the Heliar might prove to be a future collectible, since it is more rare in numbers than the Rigid Summar... Even if it does have brushed nickel plating instead of a gloss one!

On the picture the worn nickel looks more like paint than like brushed nickel. My nickel Summar weights 179 grammes.

The collapsible black Heliar is almost 100 g heavier.

I am sorry if I've hurt the feelings of people. I only wanted to discuss an interesting phenomenon. Collectible or not.

Erik.

 

[Yokosuka Mike]

Voigtlander 50mm f2.0 Collapsible Heliar Classic (Limited Edition) (Silver color) VM lens, Sony A7III camera
Yokohama, Japan - April 2019

Mike

 

[Doug]

I think you have a good point, Erik, about the sadly scuffed appearance of that nickel finish Heliar! Yet I'd be surprised if it's paint given that Cosina calls it nickel... 😕

 

[Doug]

I find this lens a bit of an enigma. I bought it because I wanted a modern collapsible for walkabout purposes, expecting performance much like my other Voigtlander lenses. Instead what I’ve got, my copy at least, is a lens that behaves much like a 1950s lens but with modern coatings etc. It’s probably the softest overall 50mm that I own, only getting to its best at f8/11, and even there not perfect at the edges. It does however have a lovely “calm” quality about it, probably because it’s not got the modern bite, and mechanically I love it. So I use it far more than I should and won’t be selling it anytime soon.

Could be a symptom of focus shift, most noticeable f/2.8 - f/5.6?
Sean Reid says that if he owned this lens he would not bother to have it 6-bit coded for the M8. It is softer wide open, esp in the corners (likely due to field curvature), than either the Summicron or Planar, and more subject to veiling flare for a "classic" rendition. Improved noticeably at f/2.4, but evidence of a focus shift at mid apertures.

Despite Sean's suggestion about coding, I sent mine to DAG for this, and incidentally to adjust for best focus in his judgement. Coded to 010111 as an earlier Summicron, focus now seems about right-on wide open and I suspect a slightly concave field of focus. Not crisp wide open but pretty good at f/2.8 and up. Maybe a slight tendency to front-focus a bit at f/4. Lovely smooth bokeh with very slight tendency to doubling in near-bokeh so perhaps undercorrected spherical aberration.

 

[Doug]

I earlier misattributed the following info. Here it is with the correct source...

Herbert Keppler's column in the 12/2006 PopPhoto praises the lens: "The Heliar turned out to be incredibly good, comparable at all apertures to the 50mm f/2 Leica Summicron-M we'd tested in 1996." Cosina did it with "Newly developed super high-index glass (that) reduces all aberrations." This is quite a breakthrough, as the Heliar was historically not suited to small-format use, its qualities not including the necessary acutance or desired speed. As essentially a Tessar with another element cemented-in to make a front doublet, it's amazing it could exceed f/2.8. Fastest Heliar ever made. Having only 6 air-to-glass surfaces, it's extremely flare resistant and contrasty.

Also worth commenting that collapsing the lens does not make it intrude into the camera, stopping about even with the lens mount. Safe, therefore, with cameras that may have trouble with lenses that extend further back into the camera.

 

[Erik van Straten]

Also worth commenting that collapsing the lens does not make it intrude into the camera, stopping about even with the lens mount. Safe, therefore, with cameras that may have trouble with lenses that extend further back into the camera.

I can assure that there are no problems to collapse it into the Leica M5. It is safe.


Erik.

 

[Erik van Straten]

Sean Reid says that if he owned this lens he would not bother to have it 6-bit coded for the M8. It is softer wide open, esp in the corners (likely due to field curvature), than either the Summicron or Planar, and more subject to veiling flare for a "classic" rendition.

This one is wide open against the light:

Leica MP, Heliar 50mm f/2 collapsible, 400-2TMY.

Erik.

 

[Erik van Straten]

Leica MP, Heliar 50mm f/2 collapsible, 400-2TMY.


This is a much smaller file with some sharpening. Works much sharper than a big file with the same amount of sharpening.


Erik.

 

[Erik van Straten]

Leica MP, Heliar Classic 50mm f/2, 400-2TMY, printed on Adox MCC 110.

Erik.

 

[Bingley]

Nice one, Erik ^^^^^^^.

I think I still prefer the look of the Skopar 50/2.5.

 

[Erik van Straten]

Nice one, Erik ^^^^^^^.

I think I still prefer the look of the Skopar 50/2.5.

Thank you, Steve. I only have the lens since a few weeks (I could buy it cheap), it is very different from the Skopar 50. Not as handy and not as refined optically, but nice to play with for some time though.


Erik.

 

[Erik van Straten]

''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''

 

[Erik van Straten]

I like the lens for portraits with backgrounds with bright light points that are turned into bokeh-balls. I've never seen the Color-Skopar 50mm f/2.5 doing that.

Also the "3D" effect, shown by our own Ululator later on in this thread, is impressive.

Erik.

 

[Erik van Straten]

gelatin silver print (heliar 50mm f2 black collapsible) leica m3





I've found out that the Heliar 50mm f2 black collapsible is the only Leica fitting collapsible lens in black there is. Unfortunately it is not paint on brass, like the Color Skopar 50mm f2.5. Maybe an idea for Cosina to make the lens again but then in black paint on brass. At the same time they could correct the very small, but visible, barrel vault distortion. Of course it should be in LTM and not in M-mount.

Erik.

 

[Out to Lunch]

An Lac, Saigon. Leica M-E - Voigtlander Classic Collapsible Heliar 2/50.



Lang Co Beach, Vietnam. Epson R-D1 - Voigtlander Classic Collapsible Heliar 2/50.

 

[Erik van Straten]

gelatin silver print (heliar collapsible 50mm f2) leica m3

Amsterdam Oosterpark, 2023

Erik.

 

[Out to Lunch]

Ba Chieu Market, Saigon. Leica ME - Voigtlander Collapsible Heliar 2/50.

 

[Erik van Straten]

aaa

Leica MP, Heliar 50mm f/2 collapsible, 400-2TMY.


This is a much smaller file with some sharpening. Works much sharper than a big file with the same amount of sharpening.


Erik.

I've found out that the Heliar 50mm f2 black collapsible is the only Leica fitting collapsible lens in black there is.

Erik.

Not true; I forgot the Elmar-M collapsible.

Erik.

 

[Out to Lunch]

House detail, Saigon. Epson R-D1 - Voigtlander Collapsible Heliar 2/50.