Voigtlander Nokton 50mm 1.5 or 1.1?

[William Temple]

Good evening all,

I have the option of purchasing either of these lenses for around the same price. I used to own the 1.5 years ago and loved it but I wondered if the 1.1, as it is a newer design, is optically superior when stopped down?

If you have experience of these two lenses I'd love to hear what you think about the 1.1's handling, rendering and sharpness compared to the 1.5.

Thanks in advance,

William 🙂

 

[kshapero]

I have owned both. And both are excellent lenses. Build is sturdy on both. Stayed with the 50/1.5 as it is smaller and suited my needs. Can't go wrong with either IMHO.

 

[Erik van Straten]

The Nokton-M 50mm f/1.5 in silver handles nicely and will look like new for many years.

The Nokton 50mm f/1.1 is a stop faster, but is very big.

Optically both are state of the art, but the f/1.5 is smoother. On the other hand the f/1.1 is very sharp for such a fast lens. In fact one needs both.

Erik.

 

[bobby_novatron]

I owned both. Sold the 1.1, kept the 1.5 ASPH. The IQ on the 1.5 ASPH (in my opinion) was much better. Plus, it's smaller.

 

[William Temple]

Thanks for the quick replies!

I'm leaning towards the 1.5, I know what to expect and look forward to. I have seen some lovely examples with the 1.1 though...

I've read in a few places that the OOF background can be hit and miss depending on what it is, has anyone experienced this?

 

[mdarnton]

I like my 1.1, but man, is it a load, so I don't carry it around much. It's one of those times when I wonder how much weight you can put on strap lugs, and often put on a grip so I can carry it in a hand, instead. Results are fine, though.

You want background and flare characteristics, here's some of both; dimmish streetlight, 1/30 @ 1.1, Tri-X:



Annie on Halsted
by Michael Darnton, on Flickr

 

[Erik van Straten]

Great shot, Michael! What a wonderful example of a shot with the F/1.1.

Erik.

 

[Photon42]

If you just look for optical superiority, I would get the 1.5, mainly for simplicity and portability reasons. Also, it focusses down to 0.7m. You did not mention the camera, but on a rangefinder the focus shift of the 1.1 can get in the way.
On the other hand, the Nokton 1.1 gives you fascinating shallow depth of field combined with very good sharpness wide open. It may also depend on what else you have got. If 50mm is your thing and this is the only lens, go with the 1.5 now and maybe add the 1.1 later.

 

[William Temple]

I like my 1.1, but man, is it a load, so I don't carry it around much. It's one of those times when I wonder how much weight you can put on strap lugs, and often put on a grip so I can carry it in a hand, instead. Results are fine, though.

You want background and flare characteristics, here's some of both; dimmish streetlight, 1/30 @ 1.1, Tri-X:



Annie on Halsted
by Michael Darnton, on Flickr

Starting to sway to 1.1 now... it's just the size and weight that's putting me off. When you acquired the 1.1 were you surprised at how big it was?

 

[Erik van Straten]

To be complete, here's a shot with the f/1.5.

Leica M2, Nokton-M 50mm f/1.5, Tmax400.

Erik.

 

[William Temple]

If you just look for optical superiority, I would get the 1.5, mainly for simplicity and portability reasons. Also, it focusses down to 0.7m. You did not mention the camera, but on a rangefinder the focus shift of the 1.1 can get in the way.
On the other hand, the Nokton 1.1 gives you fascinating shallow depth of field combined with very good sharpness wide open. It may also depend on what else you have got. If 50mm is your thing and this is the only lens, go with the 1.5 now and maybe add the 1.1 later.

I use an R2 with a 50mm all the time and have an L with a 25mm f4 for anything wider.

I the more people mention the size of the 1.1 the more I think the 1.5 would be more suitable for me. I don't think the 1.1 looks that big, am I totally wrong?

 

[Erik van Straten]

I don't think the rangefinder of an R2 is as precise as that of an M2 or M3. A very precise rangefinder (with a large base) is essential for fast lenses like these. Their dept of field is very small.

Erik.

 

[kshapero]

I mated my 50/1.1 with an M6 with a .85 VF. It was a dream to use.

 

[Photon42]

I use an R2 with a 50mm all the time and have an L with a 25mm f4 for anything wider.

I the more people mention the size of the 1.1 the more I think the 1.5 would be more suitable for me. I don't think the 1.1 looks that big, am I totally wrong?

It only looks big by comparison with the 1.5 or similar rangefinder lenses. The 1.1 Nokton has about the size of a SLR lens (but only focusses down to 90 cm). No actual problems in usage (as Akiva pointed out), really, other than the ones mentioned. Maybe another thought: you had the 1.5 already a while back - why not try the 1.1, as you seem to have a 50 already. You can always sell the 1.1 again and it is definitely a special lens in my eyes.

 

[William Temple]

I don't think the rangefinder of an R2 is as precise as that of an M2 or M3. A very precise rangefinder (with a large base) is essential for fast lenses like these. Their dept of field is very small.

Erik.

I've never had a problem with the R2 not being precise enough at 1.4, would it really not be up to focusing at 1.1?

 

[William Temple]

It only looks big by comparison with the 1.5 or similar rangefinder lenses. The 1.1 Nokton has about the size of a SLR lens (but only focusses down to 90 cm). No actual problems in usage (as kshapiro pointed out), really, other than the ones mentioned. Maybe another thought: you had the 1.5 already a while back - why not try the 1.1, as you seem to have a 50 already. You can always sell the 1.1 again and it is definitely a special lens in my eyes.

I think your right, I feel I'll only know the answers to my questions fully if I actually get to use the 1.1. I think I'll go for the 1.1 to try it out, if it doesn't work for me it can go on to someone else. Thanks Photon

 

[Erik van Straten]

I've never had a problem with the R2 not being precise enough at 1.4, would it really not be up to focusing at 1.1?

Is that a 35mm f/1.4 or a 50mm f/1.4? That makes a lot of difference. Fast 50mm lenses are (much) more difficult to focus. An 50mm f/1.1 is really demanding. It would be wise to try a 50mm f/1.1 on your R2 before you buy it.

Erik.

 

[Photon42]

I never sold my 1.1, btw 😎

 

[mdarnton]

Starting to sway to 1.1 now... it's just the size and weight that's putting me off. When you acquired the 1.1 were you surprised at how big it was?

I was very surprised at the size, but moreso at the weight. You can't really compare it with a modern SLR lens--at least I can't, since any Nikon lens I have of similar size has a large percentage of plastic, and MUCH less weight. Ultimately, size just takes up more air; weight is what you feel.

By the way, that's a picture of my wife, who's an artist but not a photographer, so she has no particular bokeh opinions or even recognition that it's something people think about. When she saw that shot, the first thing she commented on was how much she liked the way the background looked. Some people have commented on other threads about how the lens seems to have more depth of field than it should, and I think that's due to aberrations similar to what many old lenses have that tend to spread the focus out in front and especially back, giving a bit of 'glow' in the process. But this lens is needle sharp stopped down, not a disappointment at all in that respect.

 

[uhoh7]

CV 50/1.1 on SOny A7.mod:


Wading by unoh7, on Flickr


Be Prepared by unoh7, on Flickr

This is where the 1.1 shines: fast speeds. Stopping down (these are not the best shots overall, but should give a good idea of performance)


DSC00859 by unoh7, on Flickr


DSC00757-2 by unoh7, on Flickr

In short, the 1.1 is adequate stopped down, I suspect the 1.5 may be sharper on the edges at F/8, because the 1.1 def looses it a bit.

Both the 50 cron v4+ and ZM50/2, and of course the lux asph, are much better on the edges than either of these very nice lenses.

Much worse on the edges at all apertures is the Sonnetar, but it goes with me evenings more often than my 1.1. Why? Tiny and delightful 🙂 My main daylight 50 is the cron v4.

Between these two as my only 50 I would take the 1.5, with biggest issue being size and weight.