Voigtlander Ultron 28 vs Leica Elmarit 28 optics

Jerevan

Jerevan

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Which lens does the Voigtländer 28/2 optically most resemble in comparision to the Elmarit 28 (pre-asph) product line?

I like the idea of the Ultron 28/2 but the focus shift stories put me off - to what extent do the Elmarits exhibit this?
 
I have three Elmarits. Two pre-aspherical - version 1, 2 and an aspherical. I have not experienced any focus shifts with any of these.

Maybe you should compare it to the 28/2 Summicron, of which I have never used.
 
I wondering how significant can the focus ship possibly be to be noticeacle on a 28mm lens, but I admit I'm not familiar with the 28mm Ultron. I'm just basing my comment on the large DoF of wide angles... I think even at close focus and wide aperture you'd have a DOF of 10cm to hide the focus shift....
 
I have both 28/2 and 28/1.9 Ultrons, one supposedly shifts and the other one doesn't.

I have tested both on my M and can tell you: the shift that Sean measured only matters if you shoot test charts against a flat wall. In practice it is irrelevant.

Think about it: how often is your focus point smack in the middle of the picture; how often do you focus and recompose ? Do you really want a perfectly flat focal plane ?

I prefer the 28/2 on the M due to handling and higher contrast. It renders beautifully and is very "sharp", sharper than the Mandler Elmarit that I own too (28 is my favorite focal length ....). Note that I have a good 28/1.9 copy, but the 28/2 is just more fun.

See also here http://www.rangefinderforum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=146790

Roland.
 
Hi!

Lenses have focus shift at large apertures.
If they have aspherical elements then focus shift might disappear.

The ultron has focus shift and also at f2 is disapointing.

I used a lot one when i had the epson rd1s so i could play with some dof...it is a decent lens and it´s real f2 so is quite fast...but´s also ugly and big.

If money doesn´t matter i´d go for an asph elmarit which is superb glass.
 
I guess it depends on what you photograph. When I tested the 28/2 Ultron against the ZM28 on the M9, the focus shift was pretty evident when near minimum focusing distance. The Ultron was also lower contrast and IMO, less impressive. I've since ended up with the 28 Cron and can't say I've ever noticed a focus shift problem with it, though it does have field curvature that will affect focus & recompose at nearer distances. This can be compensated for with experience, just as I'd expect one could compensate for focus shift. As for the various 28 Elmarits, unfortunately can't help there.
 
Thank you so far, gentlemen. I am using b/w film so I wouldn't need high contrast.

I don't have the money to spend on the Summicron or the Asph 2.8.

So I am thinking Elmarit 28/2.8 vII, vIII or an Ultron 28/2.
 
I´m using the Elmarit vIII on film and digital. It´s a wonderful lens, sharp, conrasty, nice bokeh.
 
mfogiel said:
I've tried most of the 28mm lenses, and for B&W the 1.9 Ultron is the nicest.
Click to expand...

Totally agree. Wide open, the 1.9 has a really wonderful glow that now that I'm messing with 5x7 and 8x10 I understand comes from the same type of aberrations as the old portrait lenses have--a sharp core with diffuse surrounding. On the Ultron it isn't really visible as an effect, but creates a very smooth look. In comparison, my V2 Elmarit is. . . completely lacking character.

I don't know if it's lower in contrast than the Leica lenses--probably it is, but that's something that's an inherent characteristic of old Leica lenses like the original Summicron that makes them so nice for available light B&W. When I got my 1.9 Ultron, my immediate thought was "Great--finally a 28mm that matches the collapsible Summicron!"
 
Interesting ... I thought that an asph lens would not have glow, aberrations or low contrast?

When I say "modern" lens, I am automatically thinking high contrast, sharp, high fidelity and no character (a bit exaggerated).

I was also thinking about Rolands (ferider) photo - it looked much better in bigger size where you sort of "fall into" the photograph and can explore and experience the wide view.
 
Jerevan said:
Interesting ... I thought that an asph lens would not have glow, aberrations or low contrast?

When I say "modern" lens, I am automatically thinking high contrast, sharp, high fidelity and no character (a bit exaggerated).

I was also thinking about Rolands (ferider) photo - it looked much better in bigger size where you sort of "fall into" the photograph and can explore and experience the wide view.
Click to expand...

Thanks J.

The 28/1.9 is sharp in the center wide open, with nice fall-off and some "glow" due to aberrations, a little (but much less) than your pre-asph 35 Summilux. It becomes very clean and sharp across the field at f2.8 and peaks at f4 with very high resolution (> 100 lp/mm). On film, I use it together with LTM Nikkor 50/1.4 and 105/2.5 for sharp but lower contrast / mellow color landscapes. The 3 lenses fit very well together.

The 28/2 is more contrasty and peaks at f5.6, a bit like my 35/2 v3 Summicron - very predictable all across the board. I said "it's more fun" than the 28/1.9, because it's smaller, and better handling (less "flimsy") than the LTM lens. Imagine your 35 lux at f2 and up, that's how the 28/2 behaves. Also distorts less than the 28/1.9 (which doesn't distort much - a little wavy at the borders).

F2.8 and up - except for size - both 28/1.9 and 28/2 Ultrons are very competitive in performance across the field when compared at the same f-stop to any other 28/2.8 or slower lens out there, IMO. I think some people compare the Ultrons at f2/1.9 with, say, the Elmarits or Biogon at f2.8. BTW, my Elmarit is E49 v3, and it is bigger than the 28/2 Ultron. Pretty much the same size as the 28/1.9.

Here are two of my 28/1.9 shots that I like (both on classic 50 Velvia):

Scan-110115-0016.jpg


Scan-121117-0057.jpg


Hope this helps,

Roland.
 
Indeed, Roland - very helpful and inspiring! I really like the second one - is there a bigger size somewhere?

I have handled the 28/2 and it was a pleasant surprise. I liked the haptics but just got a scare thinking about the focus shift talk.

But the price being €350 new, compared to €900 (at least) for an Elmarit, it is tempting.
 
I did not notice any focus shift on my Elmarit (last non aspheric version). Then again, I usually preferred to snap the shot rather than to fiddle around a lot when focussing, and never shot plane test posters. Hence the inevitable occasional misfocussed pictures may more likely be my fault than that of the tools.

What I did not like, however, was that the nicely square sunshade did not fit easily when reversed in the way the 50 & 35 sunshade did.

Given the changeover to digital, I eventually ceased using my M-6.

p.
 
Cant say on comparison, but Ive owned 2 1.9 Ultrons and Ive never noticed any shift issues on either of them. I generally shoot wide open too. Wonderful, all around lens. And dirt cheap for what youre getting :)
 
After much thinking back and forwards about this - I think I have to try the "28 on a rangefinder" thing.

I am not convinced - being mostly of the 100% viewfinder SLR persuasion.

The cheapest way I can dip my toe in, is to get the Ultron 28/2. I need to clear off some space in the camera cupboards and get some monetary room to swing the proverbial cat around though. If I remember to, I'll check back when I get some results in.

Thank you all for your suggestions and ideas - much appreciated!
 
I am sold on the CV1.9 -28 and have not experienced focus shift. 28 is my favorite focal length and I'm quite thrilled with the CV.
 
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