Was just buying film, and I found our conversation funny..

rivercityrocker said:
in short, I'm not embarrassed by the fact that I can afford to own and use a Leica, but when people ask me what I do for a living I'm usually embarrassed to say "photographer". And the follow up question is almost always; "but what do you do to pay the bills?"
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I've been shooting film and digital since I was a teenager, now almost 46, and I still to this day dislike calling myself a photographer. I am semi-ok with saying I'm a film photographer because that doesn't have the same general stigma that photographer does. I think this is in large due to the massive amount of people out there now with cameras and camera phones all snapping and sharing everything under the sun including the sun literally.

I do think that even these Instagrammers and anyone who points any form of camera at anything is technically a photographer and they are truly doing the exact same thing that the original photographers were - documenting the world around them.

But it's certainly funny how we as a world and then more important we in this part of the photographic community view the idea of photography and what it means and what each piece of gear means in the grand scheme.

I wasn't around when photography was born but I'd be willing to bet that the very same "He's got a suchandsuch brand camera, he's a hipster" was probably just as common, just in different wording.

I've never made money at it, I lose money every second I exist in the world of photography. And I still love it dearly. More then ever actually. My film camera obsession has grown and I am slowly working my way towards the M9, M240 or Monochrom as a regular shooter. One day.

I just think it's really cool that regardless of who has what, we all are doing exactly what the people in the early days did. And have happiness in our hearts as we do it. Like them. Some of us looking through the very same viewfinders and lenses as they did. That is magic.
 
Richard G said:
I haven't had a black Leica since the early '90s. I really didn't know what i would do about the odd combination of my many chrome lenses on the Monochrom. I've read of duplicating one's lenses in black but I consider that excessive. Turns out that when I put my chrome 50 Elmar M on the Monochrom it completely silences anyone who might have dared comment.
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Except for the all-black KE-7A kit I was issued in the service (and boy, do I wish I had that kit today!) I've never had a full, one-color Leica kit. As a matter of fact, I've always had a mix of older, smaller-aperture Leitz, Canon and FSU LTM lenses in all kinds of colors and finishes; and with the exception of my M4-2 in the '80s, all of the cameras have been chrome bodies, of course.

While I'm not a purist, and I've never really cared much what my gear looked like, I bought my kit as I found pieces at a price I could afford and because I got good deals on the stuff I needed. This time around, it's been amusing to put together an all-black kit just because I could. Both the M8 and my M9P are even black paint. And I went ever further, and bought large-aperture lenses that pretty much are all styled similarly with the scalloped focusing rings that the E. Leitz lenses of the '60s had. Thank God for Mr. K at Cosina tho... as an original black paint Summicron can run upwards of $10k! And of course a Noctilux is prohibitively expensive for folks like me... but as Leica investments go, I don't have a whole lot in mine, but it's a competent and fun-to-use kit.
 
if i was there i would have not said i have a digital leica, i wouldn't have wanted to embarrass the guy after what he said about digital leicas.

but i guess that is why i don't own a leica and never will, even if they give to me for free.
 
Margu said:
if i was there i would have not said i have a digital leica, i wouldn't have wanted to embarrass the guy after what he said about digital leicas. but i guess that is why i don't own a leica and never will, even if they give to me for free.
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I didn't say anything until he specifically asked for that exact reason. But I'm not going to lie, that would just be ridiculous.

I don't understand though how any of that relates to wether one should own a Leica or not.
 
alienmeatsack said:
I do think that even these Instagrammers and anyone who points any form of camera at anything is technically a photographer and they are truly doing the exact same thing that the original photographers were - documenting the world around them.
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I don't quite agree. Just pointing an image making device at something and recording an instant of time doesn't make one a photographer. It makes a person a picture taker. On the other hand, someone who goes out of their way to compose an image and puts a little thought into the process can be a photographer no matter what device they use.

My grandfather always had a camera with him, a Polaroid in the early days then a Yashica 35mm that he borrowed from my father after he came back from Viet Nam (he never gave it back). He took thousands of photos but never once did he call himself a photographer. He was just taking pictures.

I have been in a half dozen feature films and appeared on many TV shows and commercials. That's a lot more acting work than most average people have ever done. I've never told anyone I was an actor. I get called for bit parts sometimes, but I don't consider myself an actor. I've even been paid for every part and I've definitely never called myself a "professional actor".
 
Snowbuzz said:
I found a film blog by a gentleman in Edinburgh (very nice blog) who actually identifies Leica users on the street. He then runs up, photographs them with his "vintage" contraption and posts their respective photos on his said blog. He does this to embarrass them. I might add that the Leica users do look startled, confused, embarrassed. I suppose that's his intent. Do Leica users deserve that? I don't know. Maybe some.

I have to work in Edinburgh in January so I hope he doesn't spot me. :) I'd post a link but his blog would register a ping-back which may induce him to show up here to fight the Holy Wars. We could do without that.

Anyway, love your article and photos rivercity!
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and another request for said blog link ;) and I think it's a bit mean to ridicule Leica users. no matter how badly a few deserve it ;)
 
Hee, no problem. I'll post a link to one of the posts here but I'm not making it 'clickable' so that he doesn't get a ping-back to the forum and hence commence WWIII. Just paste it into your browser and delete the extra 'ts'. He's a very creative fellow otherwise.

httttttp://streetlifeedinburgh.wordpress.com/2013/09/04/photography-in-urban-edinburghs-streets/

Very insightful thread, btw.
 
Snowbuzz said:
Hee, no problem. I'll post a link to one of the posts here but I'm not making it 'clickable' so that he doesn't get a ping-back to the forum and hence commence WWIII. Just paste it into your browser and delete the extra 'ts'. He's a very creative fellow otherwise.

httttttp://streetlifeedinburgh.wordpress.com/2013/09/04/photography-in-urban-edinburghs-streets/

Very insightful thread, btw.
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I think that dude gives himself too much credit. His work is awful. It reminds of the photography I did as a teenager in the late 80's when I first discovered using flash and shutter drag. It's a nice effect once in awhile, but just like a fisheye It gets old quick. And this dude seems stuck on it.

It's also pretty pathetic that he chats up his "Leica victims" and then posts pics on the internet making fun of them. He's too chicken**** to call them out in real life. Shows lack of character. If he thinks these people are so far beneath him he should at least have the balls to say something to their face.
 
Yeah, well, takes all types to make the world less boring, I guess. I felt a bit sad for him, actually: he doesn't seem very happy. Anyway, I like his DIY camera contraptions. That and anyone with a tightly-knit family and cute kid I automatically develop a soft-spot for 'em.
 
Snowbuzz said:
Yeah, well, takes all types to make the world less boring, I guess. I felt a bit sad for him, actually: he doesn't seem very happy. Anyway, I like his DIY camera contraptions. That and anyone with a tightly-knit family and cute kid I automatically develop a soft-spot for 'em.
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I suppose it makes the world less boring, but I find it loathsome that he goes out of his way to speak to people and then uses them as the butt of his jokes behind their backs. I detest that sort of behavior and I cannot find a soft spot for someone who does that.

If he was being rude to them to their face to get a reaction then OK, he's mixing a little danger in with his activity.

But these people are smiling at him, obviously they aren't bad people. Just happy Leica users who assume that this guy is being friendly. But he's making fun of them in a most cowardly way.
 
From the opening line of his blog: "As I said in my update I’m still chasing the elusive, lame, candid, weird, ‘street’ photo..."

Perhaps he's still practicing?

The democratic Internet allows for folks of all maturity levels to have an equal presence.

My mother taught me very young not to say anything if I don't have a good comment. I usually try to refrain from commenting on images or sites I don't care for as it's just not constructive. So, other than that I agree with RCR's assessment of his images, my only other comment is that he needs to grow up. I find the behavior he demonstrates with this blog entry petty and juvenile.
 
rivercityrocker said:
I suppose it makes the world less boring, but I find it loathsome that he goes out of his way to speak to people and then uses them as the butt of his jokes behind their backs. I detest that sort of behavior and I cannot find a soft spot for someone who does that.

If he was being rude to them to their face to get a reaction then OK, he's mixing a little danger in with his activity.

But these people are smiling at him, obviously they aren't bad people. Just happy Leica users who assume that this guy is being friendly. But he's making fun of them in a most cowardly way.
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I understand your points. I hope someone can buy him a Leica for Christmas one day: he wants one but can't admit it. :)
 
A sad case. But, despite his poor framing and dodgy technique, he does have a few decent shots in there, and I reckon could make a decent photographer if he had a bit of guidance, and stopped using crappy equipment. He has a couple of cameras he should be getting reliable results from, and should concentrate on that. Not everyone needs a Leica, and I admit I've done my fair share of making fun of collectors buying cameras that will live on a shelf, and just pushing the price up for users like ourselves, but people out there taking photos with their Leicas don't deserve his puerile harrassment.
 
Agree -- "puerile" is the right word for his behavior.

So the next time anyone of us is in Edinburgh and out and about with a Leica, if someone wants to take our picture, just say "Oh, are you the [use your favorite epithet] who likes to mock Leica users on his blog?"
 
rivercityrocker said:
...I wouldn't wish the job of professional photographer on my worst enemies children in this day and age. It's too competitive, there's little money to made, and professional standards have all but disappeared. As little as two years ago I was shooting for Rolling Stone and SPIN, and making decent money from just a few gigs a month until a couple of local guys ferreted out the editors and offered to do the jobs for "photo credit". It's a cut-throat business and I could go on and on with ugly stories of how people are stepping on others to get their jobs...
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Hahaha! I was told that exact same thing in 1969 at age 17. It discouraged me. I gave up thoughts about photography and I ended up in a career programming computers (ugh!)

I wish I had never listened and followed my heart.
 
wblynch said:
Hahaha! I was told that exact same thing in 1969 at age 17. It discouraged me. I gave up thoughts about photography and I ended up in a career programming computers (ugh!)

I wish I had never listened and followed my heart.
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The reality is that 1969 and 2014 are still completely different times. I wouldn't discourage someone from becoming a photographer, but it's not a great career opportunity. Not when there are thousands of capable photographers ready and willing to work for free.

I would consider myself relatively successful as far being a professional photographer goes. I've published more than 2 dozen books and I've have countless photos published in major magazines. I absolutely love what I do, but it's very hard to carve a niche in this market and keep a foothold. And even if I am successful, I'm certainly not getting rich.

It's a great life if you like being a starving artist.
 
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