F
Frank Granovski
Guest
George wrote:
I second that! Please hurry before this Zeiss Ikon forum busts!
What's coming on Dec 21?
- Thread starter Mazurka
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R
rpsawin
Guest
If the buzz about Hassleblad is true and they are really stopping production of analog gear and going all digital then maybe Zeiss is looking at other markets such as Nikon. Who knows, maybe we will see Zeiss lenses in a Canon mount. I think the hardware side of the house is in as much turmoil as film/paper/chem's.
Bob
Bob
aizan
Veteran
are we sure the zf lenses won't be af? i'd be up for a 50/1.4 with good bokeh, but not so much if it's only manual focus.
i think the "final solution" phrase was a marketing ploy. it worked, but f*#! the ad man!
i think the "final solution" phrase was a marketing ploy. it worked, but f*#! the ad man!
C
ch1
Guest
aizan said:
You bring up a good point. Since we know that CZ and Cosina have a relationship. And we also know that Cosina makes manual F-mount lenses - we've all kind of assumed that the ZF lenses will be manual - probably made by Cosina under some arrangement.
But maybe CZ/Cosina are about to come out with F-mount AFs!
That would be VERY interesting indeed.
Guess time will tell all.....
Taipei-metro
Veteran
From the this side of the world, I did not feel any excitment either.copake_ham said:RJ,
Yes, I guess it strikes me as odd that there is all of this excitement over the introduction of a line of manual lenses for film-based SLRs. I still use my Nikon manuals (shot a couple of rolls of T-Max on my F3 over the past two weekends) but any check of eBay listings will reveal how many are being "dumped for digital" so to speak.
But what really gets me is how much "heat" is being generated here on the RFF about SLR lenses. Maybe it's time for Jorge to start a film-only SLR site. Going by the number of responses and "hits" on this thread there sure seem to be a lot of Zeiss fans that want to get into film-based SLRs!
George
One Zeiss Vario-Sonnar T* 28-80mm 3.5-5.6 is a re-branded Sigma 28-80 lens, so no big deal if Zeiss bought up Sigm, Tokina or Tamron lenses, re-coating them then sell them as Zeiss. As the American saying, they'll sell their grandma to make a buck!
Leica, Zeiss are keep alive by Asian market purely like fassion world, it's "imports".
When Japanese Photo magazines testing equipments, one criteria is "Cost to performance ratio" (or 'kospafomas' in Japanese), let's say Distagon 28mm 2.8 $500, Yashica ML 28mm 2.8c, $200, since these two lenses are the same, so the kospafomas for Distagon will be 2 stars, and Yashica a 5- star.
If cost is not a concern, then one may spend $50,000 to convert a 5D to accept Zeiss or Leica M mount.
Back in early 80s, when Yashica T featured a 35mm Zeiss; an affordable one, we all flocking to get one. Again, kospafomas, 5-star.
Concepts of Photographers here, pro or amature, regonize Zeiss lenses are of better quality then "kokusan"(domastic) lenses with higher prices, if you want to pay more to your own satisfaction, by all means...There are many many many, many lenses that are cheaper then Z, L brands yet performed as good or better.
Asahi Kamera 9-2005 picked 5 mf Nikkors as their best, Ai28mm 2.8S(8g 8-element), Ai35mm f2S(6g 8-element), Ai50mm 1.8s, Ai85mm 1.4S and Ai180mm 2.8S.
I have many Nikon bodies, a 35 f2 is on my F3 all the time. Let's say I bought a Zeiss 35/2 for $1,000, mount it on, took a few rolls and found out it is the same as my Nikkor, I think I'll kill someone....wait, maybe like that KBcamera M7 sales pitch, my girl friend will say, " ...a German Zeiss lens...take me!..."
LOL...
bobofish
Two-fisted Atom Smasher
Since the ZM lenses are "ready for digital," it's logical to conclude that any ZF lenses will also be "ready for digital."
But of course understanding that would mean having to accept that any potential Cosina made ZF lenses would be more than just "rebranded."
And as to why somebody would choose a manual focus Zeiss lens to use on an F6, I assume it would be for the same reason as a manual focus prime Nikkor. Prime lenses are sharper than zooms as a rule, and some people don't like autofocus, or a lens is different enough from its autofocus cousin, that it produces different results.
I still can't understand why there is so much vitriol against these not-yet confirmed lenses.
I wonder if there would be the same seething anger if Canon were to announce F-mount lenses?
But of course understanding that would mean having to accept that any potential Cosina made ZF lenses would be more than just "rebranded."
And as to why somebody would choose a manual focus Zeiss lens to use on an F6, I assume it would be for the same reason as a manual focus prime Nikkor. Prime lenses are sharper than zooms as a rule, and some people don't like autofocus, or a lens is different enough from its autofocus cousin, that it produces different results.
I still can't understand why there is so much vitriol against these not-yet confirmed lenses.
I wonder if there would be the same seething anger if Canon were to announce F-mount lenses?
jlw
Rangefinder camera pedant
The current AF Nikkor lenses include a lot of single-focal-length options, and many of them produce excellent sharpness and contrast. (I know because I own several to use on my Nikon DSLR.)
However, most of the shorter ones have unpleasant-feeling plasticky barrels, and even the metal-barrel ones have inconveniently-placed, scratchy-feeling manual focus rings that clearly are afterthoughts to the auto-focusing system.
Since I almost always prefer to use manual focusing for some types of photography (such as studio shots of people, where autofocus is actually a drawback) it might make sense for someone like me to invest in a couple of high-quality manual-focus-only lenses in the focal lengths I use most in these situations.
(Okay, it wouldn't make sense for me, since I much prefer to use a rangefinder camera for studio shooting -- but it might make sense for an SLR user.)
However, most of the shorter ones have unpleasant-feeling plasticky barrels, and even the metal-barrel ones have inconveniently-placed, scratchy-feeling manual focus rings that clearly are afterthoughts to the auto-focusing system.
Since I almost always prefer to use manual focusing for some types of photography (such as studio shots of people, where autofocus is actually a drawback) it might make sense for someone like me to invest in a couple of high-quality manual-focus-only lenses in the focal lengths I use most in these situations.
(Okay, it wouldn't make sense for me, since I much prefer to use a rangefinder camera for studio shooting -- but it might make sense for an SLR user.)
SDK
Exposing since 1969.
Well, I love the ZM lenses particularly the 50mm Planar and the 25mm Biogon for my M7s. The Zeiss rangefinder lenses complement the Leica lenses I have, and are at least as good as the 28mm and 75mm ASPH Summicrons. On fine grained film the ZM lenses make 35mm photos look like they were shot on medium format! I just got the ZM 21mm Biogon, but haven't had the chance to put it through its paces yet; I think it will be a big improvement over my soft old Super Angulon 21mm/3.4, admirably compact as it is.
I have used mostly Nikkors over many years, and only a couple of them were in the same league as my newer rangefinder gear (the 105mm/1.8 AIs Nikkor is still a favorite). I have been disappointed by a number of AF Nikkors, like the 28mm/2.8 especially, which had a huge performance drop from the 28mm/2.8 AIs in every way. Some Nikkors are nice and crisp at the plane of focus, but ragged outside that plane, like the 35mm/2 AF, 85mm/1.8 AF and 180mm/2.8 AF. I do still love my Nikon F4 though, and if Zeiss comes out with some improved offerings, like a 100mm/2 Sonnar, 180mm/2.8 Sonnar, and a 28mm Distagon f/2 or f/2.8, I may be interested, whether or not they are AF. I was recently thinking about e-buying used Contax or Leica SLR gear, but now I will wait.
Soon I expect we will see not only pictures of the new gear from Zeiss, but also lens diagrams, MTF charts and a sample photo or two. It should be interesting to compare with the literature from the Contax products to see if they update the lens designs with new computations. I suspect they will, since new glass types are available (some that Scott developed with Zeiss and Leica) and some older glass has been discontinued due to environmental regulation changes in recent years. It seems like Zeiss did not rest on their laurels with the G mount to ZM mount lenses, and produced improved products with no identical designs. Some lenses in the Ccntax N line seem to have been updated compared to the C/Y versions (the 85mm/1.4 and 100mm Makro) but the Planar 50mm/1.4 appears to have changed less. I suspect the same will occur with the ZF lenses compared to the Contax SLR lenses with many teaks and perhaps several major revisions.
I have used mostly Nikkors over many years, and only a couple of them were in the same league as my newer rangefinder gear (the 105mm/1.8 AIs Nikkor is still a favorite). I have been disappointed by a number of AF Nikkors, like the 28mm/2.8 especially, which had a huge performance drop from the 28mm/2.8 AIs in every way. Some Nikkors are nice and crisp at the plane of focus, but ragged outside that plane, like the 35mm/2 AF, 85mm/1.8 AF and 180mm/2.8 AF. I do still love my Nikon F4 though, and if Zeiss comes out with some improved offerings, like a 100mm/2 Sonnar, 180mm/2.8 Sonnar, and a 28mm Distagon f/2 or f/2.8, I may be interested, whether or not they are AF. I was recently thinking about e-buying used Contax or Leica SLR gear, but now I will wait.
Soon I expect we will see not only pictures of the new gear from Zeiss, but also lens diagrams, MTF charts and a sample photo or two. It should be interesting to compare with the literature from the Contax products to see if they update the lens designs with new computations. I suspect they will, since new glass types are available (some that Scott developed with Zeiss and Leica) and some older glass has been discontinued due to environmental regulation changes in recent years. It seems like Zeiss did not rest on their laurels with the G mount to ZM mount lenses, and produced improved products with no identical designs. Some lenses in the Ccntax N line seem to have been updated compared to the C/Y versions (the 85mm/1.4 and 100mm Makro) but the Planar 50mm/1.4 appears to have changed less. I suspect the same will occur with the ZF lenses compared to the Contax SLR lenses with many teaks and perhaps several major revisions.
RJBender
RFF Sponsoring Member
bobofish said:
Bobofish,
What is the definition of ready for digital?
Zeiss says:
source: http://www.zeissikon.com/faq.htm
Q: Will the future Zeiss digital camera look like the Epson R-D1 ?
A: Top secret! No comment.
I'm not angry. Is anyone else pissed?
R.J.
RJBender
RFF Sponsoring Member
Taipei-metro said:
Taipei-metro, thanks for the explanation of the Japanese lens rating system.
WOW!
So this lens is the same as
source: http://hotbuyselectronics.com/item_detail.php?item_id=647
this lens except for the brand name and coatings?
source: http://www.hi-ho.ne.jp/sbko-hq/YASHICA_ML/ML28mmf2.8c.html
But Zeiss doesn't rebrand, right?
R.J.
halabar
Member
Socke said:The D200 is tempting, but since I have access to Canon Lenses from 16-35/2.8 to 400/2.8 +TC1.4 and TC2 the Canon 5d is more likely.
And I can use my existing lenses with an adaptor
Put that ultra-sharp Zeiss glass on a Canon digital body and let the 5D noise-reduction smear it to smithereens?.. say it ain't so! A 1DsMark-whatever whould be a better choice, or the D200 or D2x, but not the 5D....
halabar
Member
RJBender said:
That was the primary audience for the F6 too!
Mazurka
Well-known
Taipei-metro said:
Then why bother to post at all? Zeiss did not mention "every SLR photographer" in their ad, just "millions."
Sorry, your word is not enough.
The rest of your post makes as little sense as the obligatory, unsubstantiated "re-branding" rant.
Bryan Lee
Expat Street Photographer
Well its about 24 hour or so till the next clue? More donuts? More digital? R.J., You asked if anyone is pissed off, Yes Im totaly pissed off, I found mold growing in the airconditioner in my darkroom so I spent the whole day taking it apart and cleaning it and any kind of fungus just gets me cursing, Its over for now but the fight will go on. As far as the tread goes, Farangset Jai Yen Mak, The Frenchmen in Thailand has a very cool heart.
C
ch1
Guest
Bryan Lee said:
Oh, oh this reminds me I have to change my furnace filter!
Won't be using the AC for a long, long time yet.
leafy
Established
Yeah, they MUST be the same lens. And Yashica put 2 more pieces of glass inside to confuse us when they rebranded it as Zeiss. That is such a consipiracy!RJBender said:Taipei-metro, thanks for the explanation of the Japanese lens rating system.
WOW!
So this lens is the same as
source: http://hotbuyselectronics.com/item_detail.php?item_id=647
this lens except for the brand name and coatings?
source: http://www.hi-ho.ne.jp/sbko-hq/YASHICA_ML/ML28mmf2.8c.html
But Zeiss doesn't rebrand, right?
R.J.
The Yashica lens has 5 elements in 5 groups(構成：5群5枚), as stated from the link above. From www.zeiss.com, Distagon 28/2.8 has 7 elements and 7 groups. Go figure.
BTW, コシナ is Cosina in Japanese. A Yashica lens made by Cosina that has the same performance with Zeiss?
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S
Socke
Guest
RJBender said:
No, never. But I'm something like a two headed pink turtle here. I'm the only one who uses film. All my friends use digital exclusively. Mostly dSLRs and one with a Pentax Optio P&S.
And I'm definitely the only one who uses rangefinders.
Avotius
Some guy
"* The solution will be revealed on 01/18/06. Until then, you will find out a little more each week from our images."
To hell with Zeiss, this is just annoying now.
To hell with Zeiss, this is just annoying now.
S
Socke
Guest
Mazurka said:
To be true, I don't care if it's rebranded or not as long as it performs as advertized. When I hear the reports about returned bodies and lenses from major japanese manufacturers due to focusing, sharpness, centering and what not I'm very happy with my "overpriced" japanese made lenses with a german name.
In november a friend returned a Nikon 17-55 EF-S he got for his D2x three times until he got one which was not as expected but good enough, another had to send a new Canon 24-70L in to get the focus calibrated. I know of three Sigma 15-30 EX, one Nikon the other Canon mount, which where not corectly centered and one Sigma 120-300 EX which was delivered with a defective focusing motor.
back alley
IMAGES
thank goodness for 50 year old canon lenses...
joe
joe