JNewell
Leica M Recidivist
Eeek, apologies! - and thanks for the link.
Which raw processor for M8?
- Thread starter b.espahbod
- Start date
- Latest activity Latest activity:
- Replies 63
- Views 802
jaapv
RFF Sponsoring Member.
i see more difference between the output of various posters than of various lenses....
S
Simon Larbalestier
Guest
Capture One 4 with sharpening turned OFF and Noise Reduction OFF unless the ISO is 1250 or 2500 and then on the Color Noise Reduction I set it @ 75.
sepiareverb
genius and moron
eef
Established
Used Capture One with pleasure until I got Aperture, which allows me to do all photo related work in one app, from filing to printing. The prints look good to me. Am I really giving up quality for convenience?
RichC
Well-known
Yup - but we're not talking shedloads, although it is noticeable, and of course also depends on how large you print. I always print at A3 (20 in.) or larger, often for competitions and exhibitions, so need to max. my print quality, and therefore use Capture One. A convenient workflow is of secondary importance to me.
Others will have different priorities to me, and if you're happy with the output from Aperture and you like its workflow, you should ask yourself whether the increase in quality from changing to Capture One is worth the trouble.
mani
Well-known
One comment about C1 version 4 (or rather two related comments)
While detail is definitely superior to the other developers (I've extensively tested, as I know others have), I'm finding a couple of problems with the C1 color-rendering in side-by-side comparisons:
1. the colors seem occasionally over-saturated in the latest version
2. there is still a very, very slight tawniness to skintones that is less noticeable in the other apps, even when using IR cut filters
Some simple tweaking deals with the first problem, but the second problem I find more difficult to fix.
Still a great application, though the interface is less directly intuitive than Lightroom imo.
While detail is definitely superior to the other developers (I've extensively tested, as I know others have), I'm finding a couple of problems with the C1 color-rendering in side-by-side comparisons:
1. the colors seem occasionally over-saturated in the latest version
2. there is still a very, very slight tawniness to skintones that is less noticeable in the other apps, even when using IR cut filters
Some simple tweaking deals with the first problem, but the second problem I find more difficult to fix.
Still a great application, though the interface is less directly intuitive than Lightroom imo.
adavis47
Well-known
So, people that are using C1 and then taking the file into LR or PS, are you exporting a tif image from C1, or ??? Thanks
mani
Well-known
Just as an update - while reading through the thread I was reminded by one post of Iridient Raw Developer. I have a demo version on my computer, so I thought I'd give it a quick try again - in the past I've been somewhat exasperated by the rather primitive interface.
To my enormous surprise, the files showed (imo) truer color rendition than C1, without the problematic muddying of skintones in C1 (but also not the pastel tones of Lightroom), and also to my even greater surprise more detail rendition than C1!
I'll test this a bit more as soon as I have time, and I know that it's heresy to suggest such a thing, but I do think that maybe Raw Developer squeezes even more out of the M8 files than C1 does.
One definite downside: moiré artefacts were visible in some fabric that were absent in C1. Even Lightroom showed the moiré to a certain extent.
I'm gonna do some more intense testing before I decide on whether to switch to RD. In this case I'm glad they have a watermarked demo that allows for testing instead of a time-limited demo: if that had been the case, my chance of trying their product would have passed long ago.
To my enormous surprise, the files showed (imo) truer color rendition than C1, without the problematic muddying of skintones in C1 (but also not the pastel tones of Lightroom), and also to my even greater surprise more detail rendition than C1!
I'll test this a bit more as soon as I have time, and I know that it's heresy to suggest such a thing, but I do think that maybe Raw Developer squeezes even more out of the M8 files than C1 does.
One definite downside: moiré artefacts were visible in some fabric that were absent in C1. Even Lightroom showed the moiré to a certain extent.
I'm gonna do some more intense testing before I decide on whether to switch to RD. In this case I'm glad they have a watermarked demo that allows for testing instead of a time-limited demo: if that had been the case, my chance of trying their product would have passed long ago.
adavis47
Well-known
I'll going to chime in with mani here. I had Raw Developer a number of version ago and put it aside. Just downloaded latest and think initial results on a few images tonight were an improvement over LR.
maggieo
More Deadly
Wow, that's weird, Doug. I've been running Capture One LE 3.7.7 and Capture One 4.8.1 on my Intel MacBook Pro with Leopard 10.5.7 with only the usual sort of software problems. (I need more memory and processor speed!!)
maggieo
More Deadly
A quick Capture One 4.8.1question: is there anyway to set the default color profile to something besides "Leica M8 Generic?" I usually use "Leica M8 Generic UV/IR" or a B&W profile and it's a drag to have to change that for every single file I process.
JNewell
Leica M Recidivist
I've been totally unable to get version 4.x to recognize the license key furnished with the camera. :bang:
__--
Well-known
I also use Aperture with Silver Efex for B&W and with Viveza for color and, with the testing I've done have, not been able to see any superiority in C1 RAW development. However, I found that I prefered Aperture to ACR, which is used in Photoshop/Lightroom.
—Mitch/Paris
Scratching the Surface©
Maggie, you have the proper combination of C1 4 + Intel Mac + Leopard = Good. On the other hand, I have the combination of C1 4 + NON-Intel Mac + Leopard = Not Supported. Weirdly, it works anyway. 🙂
Doug
mani
Well-known
The last two evenings I've sat and gone through pretty much all my M8 images (still haven't taken so many), and my conclusion is definitely that Raw Developer extracts far, far more detail from the M8 files than C1. I'm actually super-excited still: I seriously feel like the application has given me the camera I hoped I was buying when I finally chose to get the M8. The files are visibly richer in detail, and (NB!) when I use the default DNG color profile in RawDev, the images are far truer than in C1.
RawDev is a true revelation to me - I'd completely written it off because of it's rather unattractive and slightly inconvenient interface. But the results are volumes better than the competition *IMHO*
A few images that I'd totally given up on after trying to fix them in C1, Lightroom and Aperture, were totally fine after some quick adjustments in RawDev.
Anyways, I know each of us is wedded to our own particular favorite apps, but if you're open to try something that admittedly does not match the ease-of-use and convenience of some of the big-name applications, I can genuinely recommend RD.
One extra thing - I metered memory use for C1 vs RD last night: not only is RD much snappier to open and process images, it also swallows a fraction in comparison with C1's memory hogging.
RawDev is a true revelation to me - I'd completely written it off because of it's rather unattractive and slightly inconvenient interface. But the results are volumes better than the competition *IMHO*
A few images that I'd totally given up on after trying to fix them in C1, Lightroom and Aperture, were totally fine after some quick adjustments in RawDev.
Anyways, I know each of us is wedded to our own particular favorite apps, but if you're open to try something that admittedly does not match the ease-of-use and convenience of some of the big-name applications, I can genuinely recommend RD.
One extra thing - I metered memory use for C1 vs RD last night: not only is RD much snappier to open and process images, it also swallows a fraction in comparison with C1's memory hogging.
__--
Well-known
Mani, interesting — would it be possible for you to post a couple of files showing the difference in detail between C1 and RAW Developer, since most people swear that C1 reveals more detail than other raw developers, although I have not seen this difference with regard to Aperture.
—Mitch/Paris
Scratching the Surface©
—Mitch/Paris
Scratching the Surface©
mani
Well-known
Hi Mitch
Well I took a couple of side-by-side screenshots of two *randomly chosen* images in each developer at 100% scaling and posted them on a thread at LCF - but before I link to them please be aware of the following conditionals:
- some of the detail I'm talking about is finer-grained than jpeg compression will properly display
- I made no attempt whatsoever to control the images so that they had the same contrast or sharpening: instead I left sharpening and other settings pretty much at default
- from the images I posted, some of the extra detail may appear to come from sharpening, but since I posted them I've seen masses of other examples where fine details (such as a hair blowing across someone's face five or seven meters from the camera) is clearly discernible in RawDev but totally absent at any setting in C1 (ALL noise suppression always off)
For me the files really DO look like film now. Before I was healthily sceptical. To say that I've fallen in love with a camera which I was only relatively lukewarm about before would be an understatement. For the time being I've saved a couple thousand dollars, as I was about to buy a chrome M6 to replace the camera I foolishly sold in the Spring - that particular urge has been postponed, at least.
Here are the crops anyway - naturally now I wish I'd chosen some better examples, but never mind.
Best,
Mani
adavis47
Well-known
The quick look I took after Mani's post showed what he explains: the image had a concrete wall and the texture in RAW Developer image looked finer and more detailed. Thanks Mani for taking time to do this.
mani
Well-known
No problem at all for me - thank the guy developing the application!
I have a feeling that if the relationship were to sour any more than it already has between Leica and Phase One, Leica would do well to discuss licensing with the Raw Developer company: I imagine a branded version of the app would then be hailed as the best by Leica aficionados, some of whom may use PhaseOne as a default... (as I did).
Similar threads
