Which Shall it Be?

[DeeCee3]

My days as an RF shooter go back many years. I got schnockered into the SLR thing and finally gave up my cherished M kit for (almost literally) 30 pieces of silver in the mid-80's. Finally, it's time to go back.

There seems to be no way for a retired clergyman to put back in place the old E. Leitz collection with prices so astronomically high nowadays. I was an early user of the Voightlander R but it never pulled my chain.

Now I'm giving serious thought to trying the Canon RF line. I already have a couple of LTM lenses so finding a good body should get me started fairly quickly.

Who'd like to offer some suggestions about which body to look for, what pitfalls to avoid in buying old Canon gear, and whether or not (having been a devoted Leica hand for long) I'll ever really be satisfied not going back to Leica?

I may not answer all replies but I'll guarantee I'll read them all and takem to heart.

dc3

 

[dexdog]

I would suggest either a Canon P or a Canon 7. The 7 has switchable framelines from 35 to 135, while the P has three framelines visible at all times 35-50-100. The 7 has somewhat better usability due to the framelines IMO, while the P has nicer build quality and exudes a certain elegance that the 7, and most other RFs, lack.

I would caution about the finders in the 5 and 6 series. These finders have complex projected framelines, and are nice if you get a good example, but many appear to have aged poorly, and are subject to flaking of the margins of the framelines (I have had 2 Canon VI-Ls, and both had the malady to some extent).

I can't address the leica thing- I don't have one, and will never own one.

 

[DeeCee3]

Thanks for the insight, Dex...yes, as lovely as the Leica M's were (and are), that Canon P did have a particular elegance about it.

What does a "normal" CLA run for a Canon RF nowadays and who's recommended to do them?

dc3

 

[FrankS]

There's a Canon P for sale at PNet for $250, I think.

 

[iandg]

There's a Canon P for sale at PNet for $250, I think.

The P went over to the auction site and sold i wanted it but he would not post to the uk so im still looking it was a beauty too.

 

[dexdog]

Thanks for the insight, Dex...yes, as lovely as the Leica M's were (and are), that Canon P did have a particular elegance about it.

What does a "normal" CLA run for a Canon RF nowadays and who's recommended to do them?

dc3

Essex Camera in NJ is pretty good, several RFF members have used them with good results, usually $125 to $150 for a CLA. I have used DAG Camera for 3 Canon RFs, and can attest to the fine quality of his work. CLAs usually run about $150 to $175. Don Goldberg of DAG is a great guy to deal with, one of the most conscientious folks in the business.

 

[DeeCee3]

You fellows are really giving me some good information for which I'm grateful. Yes, I noticed the Canon's dropping out of contention myself. Oddly, though, it was counteracted by two M's that have popped up at dealers in the past several hours for around $450-500.

Thanks for reminding me of Don Goldberg, Dex. I kept drawing a blank on his name (too many "senior moments" happening together!). There's a fellow in the Roanoke area...or at least, used to be there...who did some work for me 10 years ago. Again, can't pull the name out of the bag.

Am pondering whether to go for a wrinkled curtain, RF out of calibration, speeds off, but dirt cheap price, then have it CLAed...or spend more $$ up-front.

dc3

 

[jlw]

I've had good results with Essex for other stuff, but am not sure I would send them a Canon RF. Earlier this yeare I sent them my 7s for a CLA (shutter was tapering slightly at fastest speeds) and light seal replacement as a precaution. It came back six weeks later with oil coating the inner surface of the shutter curtains, a big black speck of crud smack in the middle of the finder eyepiece, and it looked as if they had used "furry string" light seal material instead of the original-type foam.

I sent it back for a redo, which they did at no charge but which took another six weeks -- during which it appeared they didn't do anything except blow the piece of crud out of the finder and wipe most of the oil off the curtains. The furry string is still there, but I've decided I'll just learn to live with it until someday I get mad and dig it out and try replacing it myself.

The camera works fine and the shutter speeds seem good, but this just seems like a pretty sloppy standard of workmanship (the big speck in the VF was the FIRST thing I noticed when I took the camera out of the packing; how could they have missed it?) Maybe I just caught a bad technician or a bad day (or a bad six weeks' worth of days) but if I send them another Canon I am going to be very explicit upfront about what I expect.

I've read that the Canon RF shutter is more sophisticated than those used on many other cameras (e.g. Leicas) in such details as that it has separate braking adjustments for the opening and closing curtains, and that having it set up by a real expert with lots of Canon experience, as opposed to a general technician, can make big differences in its quietness and how long it holds its speeds. So I'd say that if you want a really good job, look for an individual technician who has done a lot of Canon work and has a reputation for knowing these cameras.

[I apologize for repeating a story I've told before, but several years ago I had the good luck to take my cameras to a local camera store's factory sponsored "Canon camera checkup" day, and drew an old-timer technician who had started there toward the end of the RF era. It turned out that my cameras' shutters were still within original factory tolerances despite, as far as I knew, never having been serviced; he told me that wasn't uncommon, and said that his recommendation, now that factory service was no longer available, was never to let anyone "mess with" a Canon RF shutter at all, unless it actually wasn't working properly -- no "routine cleaning" or "periodic maintenance," in other words.]

 

[5:00 PM]

www.markhama.com

Mark CLA'd a Canon P for me last month. Perfect in every detail.

 

[ChrisN]

www.markhama.com

Mark CLA'd a Canon P for me last month. Perfect in every detail.

Well I wish he would send back the camera of mine he has had since August 2005. I paid for it too, in Jan 2006.

 

[Letien]

If you had good experience and loved Leica, why don't you get an M3.
Canon used to be in good price but now it goes up when Leica went down alot.
I have several canon RF and I really like it but if I should have only one RF camera, then I will have my M3 to go with my canon lens.

 

[Chad]

I'm fond of the Canon 7s, Canon's last rangefinder. It has just about every feature a person could want (this is subjecive of course), including a light meter. I shoot with a Canon 7 (non "S") and the only things I would change on it were changed with the 7s, i.e. a good light meter, an accessory shoe, and a more centered tripod socket. Expect to pay about $360-420. Your LTM lenses will work fine with this body (and any other Canon rangefinder body).

Pacific Rim has one for sale:
http://www.pacificrimcamera.com/

KEH has two for sale:
http://www.keh.com/OnLineStore/Prod...2=&BC=CR&BCC=8&ID=6&CC=2&CCC=1&BCL=&GBC=&GCC=


~Chad

 

[Chad]

JLW, that's not too suprising. I'm using a 7 that has never had anything done to it. Works great.

~Chad

[I apologize for repeating a story I've told before, but several years ago I had the good luck to take my cameras to a local camera store's factory sponsored "Canon camera checkup" day, and drew an old-timer technician who had started there toward the end of the RF era. It turned out that my cameras' shutters were still within original factory tolerances despite, as far as I knew, never having been serviced; he told me that wasn't uncommon, and said that his recommendation, now that factory service was no longer available, was never to let anyone "mess with" a Canon RF shutter at all, unless it actually wasn't working properly -- no "routine cleaning" or "periodic maintenance," in other words.]

 

[5:00 PM]

Well I wish he would send back the camera of mine he has had since August 2005. I paid for it too, in Jan 2006.

Really? You can't resolve this with him? It took a few weeks to get in touch with him in the first place, but he turned my camera around in two weeks flat, including shipping time. Sorry to hear of your bad experience.