Who... Digital BESSA R5

Who... Digital BESSA R5

  • Digital Bessa R-5 ($1000-$2000)

    Votes: 494 60.4%

  • Epson R-D2 ($1000-$2000)

    Votes: 112 13.7%

  • Digital Zeiss Ikon ($3000-$4000)

    Votes: 159 19.4%

  • Leica M8 renewed ($5000-$5500)

    Votes: 53 6.5%
  • Total voters
    818
Why hope for Cosina to build a digital RF when makers like Panasonic and Fuji already have built foundations to allow a RF camera to be created..

Sensor - #1 importance. Everything else is trivial by comparison....
 
So are you proposing a Micro 4:3 to M adapter that would include an RF cam and be attached to an actual RF apparatus that would sit on top of the micro-4:3 camera?

It would be pretty ugly but it would also be very cool.

The biggest problem with the M43 foundation is the 2x crop factor. People would have to use 18mm lenses to get something equivalent to their 35mm lenses. While it's possible to make smaller, faster, digital-only lenses, there's no point in making them M-mount lenses.
 
Keith said:
...........When he reads that he can no longer sell enough film bodies to be viable on his terms ... he will release a digital body for his lenses and I don't care how many times he states publicly that he won't do it, I don't believe him for a minute! And when you consider Cosina's lens range and how many there are out there amongst us M mount users he will have to make it full frame or bring out a new range of lenses to suit the crop factor! :p
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Dear Keith,

To my understanding, what is killing Leica, even before we start to think about the world recession, is their dis-ability to fund research of digital posibilities, and adapting their production lines, vis a vis major competitors.

So Mr K, when dennying any digital project, is just saying his feelings go along with a realistic approach of his possibilities.

Cheers,
Ruben
 
ruben said:
Dear Keith,

To my understanding, what is killing Leica, even before we start to think about the world recession, is their dis-ability to fund research of digital posibilities, and adapting their production lines, vis a vis major competitors.

So Mr K, when dennying any digital project, is just saying his feelings go along with a realistic approach of his possibilities.

Cheers,
Ruben
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If I understand you correctly, quote, ( To my understanding, what is killing Leica, even before we start to think about the world recession, is their dis-ability to fund research of digital posibilities, and adapting their production lines, vis a vis major competitors.) you are saying Leica RD can not stay ahead of the curve.
How would you explain there new unbelievable professional S system. Bill
 
Of the two choices out there for a digital RF, in my opinion, they are fine for most photographical needs and if I could I would buy one today. However, for serious and professional use they do push the limits. While they may not be perfect they can get the job done. For those who want a full frame sensor with ISO performance like that of the D3 or D700 (I would settle for even the D300, even if it is APS) your looking at a cost easily above $2500. I think digital RF's will need to go through an APS sensor phase before they can just jump to full frame. Once they build up a market they can then put more into it, however the M8 and R-D1 have gotten the ball rolling. I am glad Leica is standing behind their camera, they have always been a classy bunch, but it will take more than just one company to put this into full effect. If a major company, like Nikon or Canon, were to get involved then we would be able to see a higher interest in the public more likely. But again, the problem with this is both companies would likely have to produce new lenses as there current lineup would just cause too many problems and they would look stupid on a RF body and would probably try to incorporate AF ( I said try) as to invoke more interest with families. Given the current economy and the hikes in prices of equipment, I doubt either one will try anything yet, but maybe in 3-5 years we will hear the announcement of a digital RF, which means another year or two after the announcement it will be real. Digital is convenient, not everyone is able to develop there own film or pay for all the rolls. It was only about a year or so ago that the D3 came around with an amazing sensor, considering digital first started to pick up in '99-2000, expect a 6 or 8 year wait for anything like that in a digital RF, especially with the economy as it is production of R&D ideas will slow down.

One thing Ken Rockwell has right is that there is no point waiting for a camera to come out when you can be shooting with one already, so if your looking for digital RF, they're here.
 
Maybe when the current owner retires. He most definately thinks the obsolesence cycle of digi is way too fast and does not want to go there.
 
I think the recent report about the tour at one of the Cosina facilities in Japan explains it all. Cosina is a small company basing its manufacturing on what they can manufacture in-house. To manufacture a digi Cosina would have to behave as Leica.

http://www.rangefinderforum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=73534

In this context, the request from Cosina to do it, is do it more intelligently and cheaper.

It is a risk beyond the field of Cosina operation. Perhaps it would be more realistic to wait and see for Cosina producing lenses for digital cameras.

Cheers,
Ruben
 
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pmu said:
I didn't read the thread, but...

Now for this summer I have worked in a daily newspaper shooting with Canon 1,3x crop digital 1Dmk3, 16-35/2.8, 24-70/2.8, 70-200/2.8 and 300/4. And of course you all knew this because you have visited the daily work blog ;)

This rig has caused me:

-pain in the back. The weight is ridiculous even if I usually take max 2 lenses with me.
-Because of the 1,3x crop factor the wide is too wide and normal zoom is too long. The result = I have to change lenses all the time.
-I hate relying on autofocus in so many situations. I really don't trust the camera operating correctly.
-I hate the size of the camera. Ridiculous.

If there would be digital weather proof rangefinder body I would jump on it immediately. Goodbye to backpains! Goodbye to struggling with autofocus! Goodbye to carrying that ridiculously heavy camera bag! Surely I would lose the convenience of using zoom lenses, but who cares, like I said I have to change lenses all the time now also...

Only thing I would have to do would be to use dslr in sports photography. No big deal, 70-200/2.8 and 1,6x body would cover that.

So please someone, CV, Zeiss, SOMEONE! ANYONE! Please make me full frame (or really close to it) 10mpix, D3 style high ISO's, weather proofed rangefinder body. I wouldn't hesitate a second getting one. PLEASE! I want to get rid of dslr's as much as possible.
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We all would like a new & more affordable & better image quality RF. I'd be lining up to buy it. But the poster quoted above got some basic stuff wrong:

1. If you take the time to read the manual and understand all the AF modes, you "struggle" with AF very little - it works for you, not against you. In almost every situation, you can focus faster than any manual focus system if you really understand how to use it.

2. Because of the crop factor, wide is LESS wide not "too wide" as he says. With the exception of sports, most photojournalistic situations can be covered with a 12-24 and a 24-70 or similar. Two bodies, one lens on each. Or just an 17-55 2.8 and one body.

3. The weight is real. But lots of jobs demand carrying heavy equipment. You can use rolling bags or well-designed backpacks to relieve the weight, also strengthening the back helps....

I don't see any alternative to the DSLR any time soon... so no choice but to suck it up. I'd rather have a car that flies too, instead of having to drive on the roads..
 
wlewisiii said:
It will never happen. Kobayashi-san does not like digital cameras and, far more importantly, the expensive & nasty short upgrade cycle they require. Hence there will never be a digital Bessa as long as he controls the rights to the Voightlander name. Or for that matter, is the director of Cosina. While I can sympathize with your desire (I was fantasing about a FD mount digi-cam from Cosina earlier today :) ) all the sympathies in the world can not change reality & the reality is that Cosina will not make digital cameras.

Sorry,

William
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I would love to live in a world where all major business decisions could be driven by emotional preferences and similar sentiments.

I can see that the short upgrade cycle would be a problem, but if a digital camera would be necessary to make sure Cosina continues to be a healthy and profitable company, I'm sure we would see a DRF camera with the Voigtländer badge on it.

Currently, for mr. K. the financial climate is more of a setback to invest in new developments than the non-DRF sentiments, I'm positive.
 
How can we posssibly tell you what camera we are waiting for if we don't know what features are going to be on each of these cameras?

I don't care what the brand is, as long as the sensor is big (1.2x - 1.0x), some thought went into the design (recessed buttons, accessible ISO, WB...) and the price is correct. That's the camera i'm waiting for.
 
wlewisiii said:
It will never happen. Kobayashi-san does not like digital cameras and, far more importantly, the expensive & nasty short upgrade cycle they require. Hence there will never be a digital Bessa as long as he controls the rights to the Voightlander name. Or for that matter, is the director of Cosina. While I can sympathize with your desire (I was fantasing about a FD mount digi-cam from Cosina earlier today :) ) all the sympathies in the world can not change reality & the reality is that Cosina will not make digital cameras.

Sorry,

William
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dude! i was today too fantasing with a fd mount digi cam made by other company rather than canon
 
Creagerj said:
Ya know, I never really saw the point in having an LCD on a Digital SLR ( I guess for some things it makes sense). I get the idea that if you take a bad picture you know right away, but why sit there and waste your time editing on your camera when you could be taking more pictures.
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It's about knowing you got the right picture... and knowing when to stop or do it over.
 
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