Yet another web design software question

[Roger Hicks]

Brother in law pretty much understands it already: Microsoft-trained and fun stuff like that. The big problem is that I don't really want any more learning curve for me than is absolutely necessary.

Gabriel: yes please. I've been meaning to get to Paris for a while anyway, as I have to see about some visas... Willl call when I find your number again! If it's as easy as using a manual car in rain-soaked one-lane Scottish roads, it doesn't sound too intimidating. How about picking up an Enfield Bullet loaner from the factory, then iimmediately riding it through rush-hour traffic in Madras, with right-foot shift and left-foot brake, when you're used to left-foot shift and right-foot brake...? I did that in 1990.

Cheers,

R.

 

[Jamie123]

"Dated" looking websites have surprisingly strong brand recognition and appeal in the internet space. Take for example Luigi's website (Leicatime) or even the one authored by Ken Rockwell.

I think there's a difference between classic and dated. A Leica M3 looks classic while a Canon T50 looks dated.
I definitely think a simple classic (i.e. timeless) design would fit Roger but unless the 90s look is part of the concept of the page I think an update would be good.

There are, of coures, brands who use a deliberately anachronistic website design (like, e.g. Maison Martin Margiela's site) but these are exceptions.

Of course you are always going to recognize something that stands out even if what makes it stand out is that it is terrible. You could make a horrible Flash website with animations, music, pop-ups and use Comic Sans as a font and I'm sure people will remember it. But is that really what you want?

And I honestly think Luigi's business is working out despite his awful website not because of it. If he didn't have such a good reputation on internet fora I think many people would be hesitant to do business with the owner of this website.

(PS: All of the above comments relate to the general topic of "datedness", not specifically to Roger's site. I don't think his current site is bad at all, I'm just saying that, IMO, it could probably use an update.

 

[Kevin]

You're right Jamie, there is a difference between classic and dated.

I wonder, however, if things which fall into the dated category can, given enough time, fall into the classic category. Take 80's fashion, for example. Is it still dated or is it now classic?

 

[Michiel Fokkema]

Hi Roger,
http://www.photographyschool.nl/
Was set up in Wordpress in a few days by my bussines partner. Okay, she is very smart but this was the first time she did it.
We used a free template. We do pay hosting fees, but that is it.
We kept part of the BLOG functionality. There are loads of other photogrpahers who also use WP and you can't tell it started as BLOG software.

Cheers,

Michiel

 

[Frank Petronio]

Well... the CameraQuest website is a good example of dated, but it still works. I suggested it needed a structural update to make it easier to navigate and for the owner to maintain, but then once I saw all the prior work and the hundreds of pages involved... there was no way to redo it at a reasonable cost. So better to keep on patching and hope those framesets continue to work in modern browsers.

But... in general, the old table cell sites, page-sized sliced up gifs and jpgs, the Internet Explorer kludges, and all the other patches people layered on top of layers have made the old sites ridiculous to edit and maintain. They exist better as screenshots for historical reference. And you can thank FrontPage, GoLive, DreamWeaver, and iWeb for creating that mess (Internet Explorer 4 should get the Gold Award). Anything that promised "easy to use" and WYSIWYG results only gave us millions of crappy websites that need to be forgotton, euthanized, or completely redone.

Contrast this with the movement for making W3C standards-based websites that separate code and content, allowing simple updating and relative future-proofness... the better, more aware IT departments and designers eventually got on board and even if most sites don't validate, they are mostly compliant. And those sites will likely still be working fine 50 years from now.

So... if you're looking to leave us a legacy, better redesign right!

I mean you don't want to leave a relic: http://www.bobshell.com/

 

[Paddy C]

Just got back from vacation and saw this. Let me jump in with more advice...

Credentials: I've been designing and developing web sites for 13 years now along with a lot of traditional print work.

Roger, you need someone to set up a content management system (CMS) on your web host. Then familiarize yourself with how to add content to it.

Why? Because you are a writer. This is the best way for you to add, maintain, and automatically organize articles. You need only write and upload, the CMS will do everything else for you.

A few points:

1. The web is NOT print. Don't try to make it look like print or think you have the kind of control over it you have with print. This isn't a bad thing.

2. Do not learn markup (or at least not much of it) or "code". That's a waste of your time.

3. Do not use "web page software" such as Dreamweaver, iWeb, or whatever else is out there. This stuff is all rubbish.

4. Tumblr is for short posts and is not suitable to the sort of content you wish to publish. Forget about it.

5. Don't use linked PDFs. They are not searchable (very very bad) and they are not the web. They are an often-used hack for the web. It will be easy, over time, to upload old content if you have a CMS in place. You can even back date it.

6. Content management systems are a rabbit hole. In brief:
Drupal is for nerds (no offence nerds)
Joomla is absolute garbage
Don't use either of these.
ExpressionEngine is very good but comes with an upfront cost and is probably more robust then what you need. (It's what I use for client sites)
Wordpress plus a free template is totally free and relatively easy.

Stephen Schaub's Figital Revolution site is an example of a Wordpress site that might be useful:

http://figitalrevolution.com/

It uses a free (I believe) template that is currently being used by some 500K other people. Obviously you can find a different template that suits your needs and is less used (and thus less likely to look like a template).

I have seen so many half-assed web implementations over the years. I'm currently working on a proposal for a foundation that has mess of a site that was built only two years ago. It's a disaster. They wasted their money.

Don't do this half-assed. Don't try to find the easiest solution, or the one that seems most familiar. Find the easiest and cheapest solution that does everything you need, then learn how to make proper use of it.

Questions? Ask me anything. I'll try to answer.

 

[Gabriel M.A.]

Hi Roger,
http://www.photographyschool.nl/
Was set up in Wordpress in a few days by my bussines partner. Okay, she is very smart but this was the first time she did it.
We used a free template. We do pay hosting fees, but that is it.
We kept part of the BLOG functionality. There are loads of other photogrpahers who also use WP and you can't tell it started as BLOG software.

Cheers,

Michiel

That's pretty impressive for a WP site; I can see there's work done with CSS, dropdown menus, and custom pages (for the menus), but what I'm intrigued about is the slideshow-ish plugin/widget used for it. What, if I may ask, is it called?

 

[Michiel Fokkema]

That's pretty impressive for a WP site; I can see there's work done with CSS, dropdown menus, and custom pages (for the menus), but what I'm intrigued about is the slideshow-ish plugin/widget used for it. What, if I may ask, is it called?

Thanks.
it came standard with the theme "Boldy".
http://wordpress.site5.net/boldy/doc/

Cheers,

Michiel

 

[Frank Petronio]

It's nice to use the proper character codes for science/math expressions and foreign languages. Simply look them up on a reference card or webpage. Why not have nice degree symbols and fractions, etc?

 

[slm]

You can try out Joomla for 30 days, free.

http://demo.joomla.org/

cheers

 

[Kevin]

Requirements

Requirements

• New tool to create articles offline and "upload" in finished state to brother-in-law
• Continued collaboration with brother-in-law
• No subscription service
• Low learning curve (or no new learning at all)
• Lower time investment for all involved
• Portfolio creation not needed
• WordPress and Rapidweaver already investigated
• Old-Fashioned-Style is okay
• Consistent Design/Layout
• No new website features needed

 

[Jamie123]

You're right Jamie, there is a difference between classic and dated.

I wonder, however, if things which fall into the dated category can, given enough time, fall into the classic category. Take 80's fashion, for example. Is it still dated or is it now classic?

Some very good design of 80s fashion has now become a classic. One thing that comes to mind is Nike's Air Force 1 sneaker. Some bad 80s fashion did come back as a fad a few years ago (in the form of some American Apparel clothing) but this is short lived.

I will also add, though, that one needs to make a distinction between the things that were good at a certain time and the things that never were good at all. A website (and, again, I'm not talking about Roger's site) that was pretty bad in the 90s and is still as bad now will not become a classic.